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I ordered a pair of Rythmik Audio Signature Edition 12" Powered Servo Subwoofers last weekend and they arrived Friday in perfect condition. These subs are really very nice looking and they sound great, too. I'm thoroughly impressed with Rythmik Audio.
The particular model I bought has a shiny piano-black mirror-like finish. In order to protect the finish they were wrapped in Saran Wrap and placed in a white cloth bag while further protected by molded Styrofoam packing inside a heavy double cardboard box. Each sub weighs 62-lbs.
Rythmik included a pair of white cloth gloves with each subwoofer so they could be handled without getting fingerprints on their mirror-like finish. I thought that was a nice touch although the cloth gloves proved to be too slippery against the piano-black finish to be functional. Therefore, I left the Saran Wrap on while setting them up and then I used a pair of latex exam gloves to remove the Saran Wrap and place them in their final position.
I think these Rythmik 12" Servo Subs might just be one of the best values available in servo subwoofers today. The Signature Edition was the most expensive 12" model at $999 each plus an additional $50 each for the silver aluminum diaphragms. Ordinarily they come with black aluminum diaphragms, but I wanted the silver cones to match the diaphragms of my Thiel CS3.7 main speakers.
I decided to buy a pair of subwoofers so I could place them next to my main speakers. However, many people believe that two subwoofers are nearly always better than one regardless of placement. Two subwoofers just provide more flexibility in minimizing room acoustic peaks and nodes. Rythmik surprised me when I increased the quantity from one to two by providing a 10% discount. The price of each sub was reduced from $999 to $899 and the price of each sliver diaphragm was reduced from $50 to $45. That was a welcome discount considering shipping cost was $136 for a grand total of $2024 for the pair. This certainly isn't cheap, but for two servo subwoofers with all the capabilities they include, I believe this is an incredible value.
Each subwoofer has a 370-watt RMS class A/B servo power amplifier with more controls than I know what to do with. There are six knobs and six toggle switches that provide control for Power, Input, PEQ, Gain, Bandwidth, Frequency, Delay/phase, Crossover, Volume, Lowpass filter, Rumble filter and Extension filter. Here is the spec sheet to give you a better idea of what you get.
All I can say is that I am overjoyed with what I see and what I hear. If you are in the market for a high-end subwoofer or two, you definitely need to check out Rythmik Audio. I can't imagine you will find anything better at twice the price.
Best regards,
John Elison
Follow Ups:
Their subs are phenomenal performers and are very well built. If I were to upgrade my Rythmik LV12R, it would be to a more powerful model of Rythmik. I'm truly smitten by their customer support as well.
> I'm truly smitten by their customer support as well.
Good to know! However, mine seem to be performing perfectly so far so maybe I won't need any further support.
Thanks,
John Elison
...driven by the main stereo signals on the back wall, left and right of the couch. These operate as 'true' SWs with a low-pass-filter point of 25Hz. (The LP filter is 2nd order to around 80Hz and then becomes 4th order. Another way to write that is that there's an 80Hz LP filter that's nondefeatable.)
These really do stretch the system's bass extension in the bottom octave and below, and they sound to me (and others who are GEAs) to integrate very well with the Super-Sevens.
After fooling around with various analog multiband EQs to reduce, mostly, the strong 28-30Hz room node, with varying success (mostly poorly), I've minimized the bass resonances in my room with a pair of RANE-brand commercial 3-band parametric EQs.
Each band is continuously adjustable from 10Hz to 20KHZ. These work very well. :-)More pics at the link.
I also have a pair of the previously mentioned double-12"-servo open-baffle woofers as part of my Serenity Super-Seven speakers. These use a special version of the Rythmik 370-Watt amps previously mentioned.
The highly over-rated Coincident Frankenstein II poweramps in this pic are long gone.And altho I mass-load most equipment in my system--see, for instance, the Coincident poweramp in the pic immediately above--I've not considered mass-loading these SWs as someone else mentioned; I too have lots of 25-pound bags of lead shot.
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Tin-eared audiofool, large-scale-Classical music lover, and damned-amateur fotografer.
William Bruce Cameron: "...not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted."
Edits: 08/30/16
Wow! It looks like you have some very expensive equipment.
Thanks,
John Elison
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Tin-eared audiofool, large-scale-Classical music lover, and damned-amateur fotografer.
William Bruce Cameron: "...not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted."
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Will you continue to run the main speakers in full range mode?
Yes, I will continue to run the main speaker in full range mode because they are linear phase speakers and I think that using a high-pass filter might ruin their phase response. They seem to sound just fine with the subs beside them, so I think I'll keep playing them this way.
Thanks,
John Elison
Just curious about what works for you in your room.
Are you using the lowest crossover setting? What are the best phase and gain settings?
I just switched to the line-inputs today and the Rythmik subs sound a lot better. I didn't really expect there to be any difference but they now seem to have a much more substantial sound quality with deeper bass. Furthermore, the optimum volume setting is now about one o'clock on the pot instead of it being maxed out. They really sound awesome now and they integrate seamlessly. I'll experiment some more with crossover settings and servo damping, but they seem to sound perfect now just the way they are.
Best regards,
John Elison
I've noticed the same thing. Line inputs make the bass sound cleaner and meaner.
Glad you like your new subs.
I have the crossover frequency set to 50-Hz with phase at zero-degrees and volume at max. They are connected to my power amplifier outputs by running a short twisted pair from my speaker terminals to each sub. Today I plan to fabricate a pair of RCA cables of sufficient length to connect the subs directly to my secondary preamp output. Perhaps I will be able to lower the volume if I do that. I'll let you know.
Thanks,
John Elison
John,
You should not connect the pos & neg speaker terminals of an amp with a differential output stage to a single ended subwoofer input. By doing that you are tying the negative speaker terminals to the subwoofer's ground. That could cause damage to the sub or amp. Fortunately you are using the subs in stereo. If you were making this type of connection to the L&R inputs of the same sub, then you would be tying the neg terminals of both L & R amp outputs to each other, which makes it even worse. The proper way to make a high level connection is to connect the positive speaker terminal to the positive subwoofer cable lead and connect the negative subwoofer cable lead to a grounding point on the amp such as a ground lug (for amps that have it) or a chassis screw.
Dave
Thanks, Dave!
My power amplifier does not have a differential output stage. It's speaker grounds are common with each other. However, I switched to using my second set of preamp outputs into the Rythmik subs' line inputs and they sound substantially better now. In fact, the Rythmik volume controls are now set to their one o'clock position instead of being maxed out and bass from the subs is deeper and more full-bodied than before. I just didn't have a pair of interconnects long enough so I used a pair of wires from my speaker terminals. I much prefer the line-inputs, though.
Thanks again,
John Elison
In my experiments with subwoofers I almost always end up preferring to run the main speakers full range. Then, an attenuated line level signal to the subs and a combination of lowest sub crossover setting and highest sub volume setting possible.
YMMV though, keep me posted.
If The F12s are similar to my F15, the volume will be set low once he goes to line level inputs to get a good balanced response. His Thiels are ion par with my mains in efficiency. These subs have unbelievable output capability.
What ever works. We'll soon find out what actually works in John's room.The "lowest possible crossover setting" when using line level almost never requires anything close to the "max" volume setting on the sub. I only suggest that the highest POSSIBLE volume setting is required in such a case.
I usually end up choosing the lowest crossover setting because I almost always prefer a slight dip in response over a slight spike in response in the region that mains and subs blend together. YMMV, of course.
Edits: 08/30/16 08/30/16
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Don't let Brian see this post, he might raise prices!
hi john, i heard the rythmiks at the show newport 2015 with a pair of fritz monitors and i was soundly ( ;^) ) impressed. the tightness and extension was quite impressive for the money. i believe it was a single sub but can't be sure.
i have made the recommendation for these remarkable products to many of my friends. they are JL Labs quality at Hsu pricing. i am certain that neither manufacturer would be happy with my comparison but its the best i can do.
...regards...tr
I was running them from my power amplifier outputs and I just switched today to their line-inputs. Wow! What an improvement! I don't know why they should sound so much better but they do. I'm really pleased with them now.
Best regards,
John Elison
it's funny because rel recommends using amp level to maintain tonal character to the amp of main system. they DO have a complicated setup procedure however.
...regards...tr
Maybe my bass problem was not as much with my Thiel speakers as with my Parasound Halo A21 power amplifier because now that I ran a line from my preamp to the line-level inputs on the Rythmik subs, bass is really more substantial on the bottom end. They still integrate seamlessly but they definitely sound better now. I couldn't be happier.
Best regards,
John Elison
Planning to build a pair later this year.
These Rythmik subs seem very substantial. I don't know if you can save any money by building your own, especially if you want servo subs. I'm astounded that these Rythmik subs are so reasonably priced.
The kits are $599, saving me about $700 a pair. To me that's icing on the cake since I build more for the enjoyment than to save money.
I'm glad your new pair has worked out so well for you. I'll be using my subs with Pi 4 speakers which I also plan to build. Right now I'm finishing a complete Pederson rebuild for my Michell Orbe turntable in addition to four Hammond organs and five Leslie tone cabinets that are getting full restoration. Hopefully I'll have time to start on the speakers this year.
Hi, John,
Good to hear that the new subwoofers are working out so well. I'm impressed with the level of refinement available in the controls. The subs I use have similar controls but I spent more money for built-in DSP features. I would definitely consider the Rythmik subs now because stand-alone DSP has become readily available and fairly affordable.
I think stereo subwoofers are the way to go with speakers that aren't full range. I've been using paired subwoofers with stand-mounted two-way speakers and the improvement in sound (low frequency extension, bass definition, imaging) is immediately noticeable when switched on or off. That, and I was able to locate the subs to balance out and (nearly) eliminate a couple of low frequency room node peaks and fill out dips enough that the overall frequency response was much better balanced at the prime "listening chair" location and the optimum listening zone was greatly expanded. (I usually listen to music in the best spot in the room but also listen to music and watch movies with other people using an adjacent couch and chair.)
I understand the need to accommodate furniture and shelving and such but if you have an opportunity to experiment with placement of the subwoofers, give it a try. Even to the point of moving the stereo racks and furniture around. The record shelving is a bit more of a hassle, obviously. But if you're at all curious about the potential improvements, you may find the improvements are worth the effort. Or not. :-)
Regards,
Tom
My Rythmik subs incorporate a parametric equalizer and variable phase. They are analog all the way -- no digital signal processing (DSP).
Convenience has its cost. The added expense was to have the DSP module automatically adjust frequencies using an internal 7-band parametric equalizer. (That and a remote control for volume/phase/filter settings.) The DSP is a set-and-forget type of operation. You place the microphone at the listening position and run the DSP feature to set EQ for each subwoofer. Once that's done you disconnect the mic and the EQ settings are stored in memory.
The Rythmik SE subs are a sound tweaker's dream. All you need is time, and I've heard you mention that you have plenty of that nowadays. '-)
Tom
PS: A comparison of analog EQ vs digital EQ in subwoofers would be an interesting discussion...
Congrats on your new subs, John. They look great with the Thiels. I've been singing the praises of Rythmik for a while now. Their price/performance ratio is really, REALLY impressive. I have a single F15 in black oak that I'm electronically EQing, and it does a wonderful job. Probably the tightest, most accurate bass I've gotten out of a sub, and I've owned a bunch of 'em over the years.
BTW, I don't recommend it in your case, because you obviously don't want to mar the beautiful finish, but I find that mass loading on top of my Rythmik helps tighten things up even more. I have 175 pounds of shot on top of mine, which is quite likely overkill, but it does the job.
Enjoy!
"Life is like Sanskrit read to a pony." --Lou Reed
Are these the same as your speakers? They look awesome! I found this picture on the Jenna Labs speaker website. I'm glad to see there are others who use subwoofers with floor-standing speakers and also place their subs next to the speakers.
Of course, you get deeper bass with the subs in a corner or against a wall, but they look great right next to each speaker and they provide sufficient bass for my satisfaction.
Thanks,
John Elison
Thanks! Those are the speakers I have, but that's not my room. That's the room of another of Jennifer's clients. (He uses HSU subs, I believe.) There are only four pairs of the Jena Studio References in existence, including mine.
I have my Rythmik close to a corner, but have it pretty well dialed in with DSP, and it's nicely integrated with the main speakers. Maybe I got lucky! :)
"Life is like Sanskrit read to a pony." --Lou Reed
John
Glad your happy. The system looks great. Now that my new F15 is well integrated the sound is immersive and the bass and drums are visceral. Try some classic rock.
I've been considering a USB mic and analyzer software to see what the overall system response looks like, but it sound great tuned by ear.
My music and HT are integrated and the F15 is ridiculous on movie special effects
Enjoy.
They also offer a servo vented subwoofer(L12). do they have any advantages in matting with Maggies. As far as I know no on the forum thinks they are alternative to the enclosed system?
I recall reading about a few successful Maggie/Rythmic integrated systems. There is an open baffle sub made with Rythmic drivers. I Heard them at the Capitol Audiofest playing with a pair of custom ribbon speakers from GT Audio Works. Best sound at show.
Do you think there is any advantages in sealed box design, which every one applauds. It is more $?
Get sealed
They are typically more accurate and easier to integrate in a stereo set up
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