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In Reply to: RE: Speakers in rooms - final thoughts posted by Dave_K on December 12, 2014 at 13:27:44
All reviews of DEQX were extremely positive - so I presume you're referring to the room-EQ portion.The latest rave was by Kal in Stereophile - and even he didn't max-out its performance. One, (I think) he used analog-in, not digital. Two, he could have spent more time dialing it in - his own words.
Finally, his speaker, one of the great cones, probably needed less driver-EQ than most. In other words, you would hear more improvement than he....
Edits: 12/12/14 12/12/14 12/15/14Follow Ups:
I haven't seen Kal's review yet. I also don't have first hand experience with the DEQX in my system. I've only heard it as part of a couple of demos (NHT and Kyron). But I have researched it extensively, along with Trinnov and Lyngdorf/TacT.
I think DEQX is an awesome way to go if you're a after a fully active bi- or tri-amped system, particularly if you're a speaker builder. But if you're only going to use it as an equalizer and not use it's crossover capabilities, it's a harder sell.
The DEQX approach is to first equalize each speaker to be flat on-axis with FIR filters using anechoic measurements, which is fine as a general principle but may or may not be the right thing depending on the design of the speakers. But you can't really measure anechoic bass, and FIR filters are not suitable for equalizing bass frequencies. It also offers parametric EQ using IIR filters, which CAN correct the bass. But these filters are mono so you can't correct the bass response independently for each channel which is a serious limitation. Also, from what I've read on forums, subwoofer integration with DEQX is a chore and requires you to be an expert with the tool.
I would love the opportunity to compare the DEQX PreMATE or HDP-4 with a Lyngdorf DPA-1. On paper at least, I think the Lyngdorf approach is probably better suited for a typical audiophile whereas the DEQX is more oriented towards the DIY-er.
Lyngdorf's xover comes with their speakers, I don't think it's a stand-alone unit. Besides them, only Legacy has digital xovers standard in their models.
All the others are "separate" - DEQX, Holm, Pass, Trinnov and Linn.
Not sure what you mean by "separate".
Quite a few manufacturers are selling fully active speakers with digital crossovers.
Besides Lyngdorf, Legacy and Linkwitz, I'm not aware of any high-end brands than come with DSP crossovers.
"Separate" meaning DIY-after market. These units are not sold with loudspeakers.
I didn't know Linkwitz was using DSP crossovers. I thought he was still using his own discrete line level analog crossover/equalizer.
There are others:
Meridian has been selling active speakers with built-in DSP crossovers for a long time.
Linn launched their Exakt product line last year.
Dynaudio just jumped on the bandwagon with the Focus XD line.
Legend Acoustics and Kryon Audio use DEQX as the crossover in some of their products.
NHT used to sell a DEQX-based sat+sub system called the Xd which was really impressive for the money but didn't last all that long before being discontinued.
And DSP based crossovers are getting to be sort of common in the pro audio market. Klein & Hummel O300 is a good example.
I guess Linkwitz doesn't count. But yes, a few more:-Two small co. from Australia - Legend and Kryon.
-Dynaudio just announced, with 3 models. Not sure if they're on the street yet.
-Linn and Meridian have one model each. But these co. are known for their source components & electronics. How many are aware of their speaker's xovers ?
With hundreds of brands worldwide, we have a long way to go. That's why we have to DIY. The problem is, most users will need help. It's apparently quite difficult to dial-in an Holm or DEQX *if* untrained in speaker-science.
What's gets me is the reviews of DEQX, in particular, never mentioned this battle - they made it look easy...
Edits: 12/15/14 12/15/14 12/15/14 12/15/14 12/15/14 12/15/14 12/15/14 12/15/14 12/15/14
And we can add Grimm Audio and Avantguarde, with one model each.So, nearly 10 companies with DSP - but 5 have only one model. Almost none use DEQX - they're either in-house (Linn) or pro-DSP (Legacy).
Grimm doesn't even use FIR - they use "IIR", whatever this is...
Edits: 12/16/14 12/16/14
Thanks, I wasn't aware of the Spatial software, but when I looked into it I saw that Emerald Physics was also offering DSP crossovers as options for their speakers.
I also didn't know about the Avantgarde Zero 1.
And you were right about Linkwitz. His newest speaker, the LXMini, uses a MiniDSP for its crossover.
And BTW, Linn has 3 models in the Exakt line.
Here is an explanation of the differences between IIR and FIR filters:
http://iowahills.com/A8FirIirDifferences.html
Without getting into all the advantages and disadvantages for audio crossovers and equalizers, FIR filters are generally preferred except at lower frequencies where the filter length limits the Q. So IIR filters are preferred for notching out room modes in the bass, and may be better for a crossover to a sub.
Thanks for the link -The gurus on DSP (like Holm) are using FIR.
I can't believe it's taken over a decade for DSP to take off. I saw an ad from DEQX (in TAS) from 2003 !
But some co. did their own 'passive' research - with "elliptical" xovers and the like. Or what YG did with their phase-accurate design. (I don't think) it was marketing hype - YGs xover was better...
Edits: 12/17/14 12/17/14 12/17/14 12/17/14
And we shouldn't forget the Spatial software - which works with a passive xover.
Edits: 12/16/14
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