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All,
If your around at the show, stop in were at 9007. We will be showing with Vaughn Loudspeakers and their new plasma speakers.
It should be a good time!
Thanks,
Gordon
J. Gordon Rankin
Follow Ups:
I would be curious to know what people who have hear DF's system this year think about it.
better than prior years, more like the first year or so before the fire wiped him out.
I've not missed a RMAF since the first year and have known Dennis since forever, or so it seems. In fact I think it was the Utah EIMAC tube crazies that gave him the handle of the Tube Wrangler.
In truth Dennis' amps can sound very good on the right speakers and the GPA 604's in the large boxes he built for them are ideal. Likely drive my Edgar Horns and sound good as well. The smaller room he is in this year for some reason sounds better than prior years.
But ya got to like your music COWBOY! =:-0
JM sent out a summary of the event.What set of amplifiers did you listen to?
Apparently, they had a few different variations on the basic circuit at the show.
Posted a link to Stereophile review.
Edits: 10/08/15
That is the only report about the SS room I have seen. Seems like Herb liked 'em - I wonder if others did also.Is Dennis using the AlNiCo version of the GPA drivers in his speakers now?
Cheers,
91.
"Confusion of goals and perfection of means seems to characterise our age." Albert Einstein
Edits: 10/09/15
To the best of my knowledge GPA doesn't make a AlNiCo version of the 604 (or any other speaker). * see edit belowAnd the magnets weight a total of 8.1 lbs, not the 44 lbs that Herb reported. (I wonder where he got his information?)
"The low frequency loudspeaker cone is attached to a 3.0-inch
(76 mm) diameter, edge-wound, copper-ribbon voice-coil and a 5.6-pound (2.54 kg) ferrite magnet, producing a gap flux density of
1.3T.
The high frequency compression driver features a 2.5-pound
(1.13 kg) ferrite magnet..."The whole speaker weights 38 lbs.
I looked for a way to inform him personally of his mistake but couldn't find an easy one so I left a comment.
Edit;
Correction, I see now that GPA makes the "Classic" series and do make AlNiCo speakers. I don't know how I missed that. My apologies.
OK, now it's time for Herb to correct his article. Even the GPA AlNiCo 604E (and I'm not sure if that's the one Dennis is using) has only 5.6lbs of AlNiCo magnet, not 44lbs.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Edits: 10/12/15
NT.
Meat; It's the right thing to do. Romans 14:2
Somehow I missed the Classic Series altogether.Sorry about that.
I'm glad I said "to the best of my knowledge". That keeps a little egg off of my face. :-)
The GPA AlNiCo 604E Series II has 5.6lbs of magnet total. 4.4lbs for the woofer.
That must have been what confused Herb when he reported 44lbs.
I have a responsibility to get it right.
IMO Herb, being a journalist, has a bigger responsibility to get it right.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Edits: 10/12/15
for their error has the larger responsibility to 'get it right'. :-)
OK, and now I have.
Now it's Herb's turn......right?
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Hi Tre,Link is to 604E Series II datasheet. I think GPA are building these to meet a few requests, I assume mostly from the East. According to them though, AlNiCo is not superior and its use in the duplexes increases the fore/aft distance between both drivers. Still, I'd like to hear them.
Probably, Herb has his wires crossed. As suspected, Dennis is not using the AlNiCo version.
FWIW, my 604-8H-III drivers run in ~290L MLTLs designed specifically for SETs and my room. Its a nice domestic 2-way, but the 100kg each weight means they don't get moved often. ;^)
Cheers,
91.
"Confusion of goals and perfection of means seems to characterise our age." Albert Einstein
Edits: 10/12/15
I think Herb might have just misread the spec sheet and typed 44 instead of 4.4
"The low frequency loudspeaker cone is attached to a 3.0 in. (76 mm)
diameter, edge-wound, copper-ribbon voice-coil and a 4.4 lbs.
(2.0 kg) Alnico V magnet "
Somehow I missed the Classic Series altogether.
Glad I said "to the best of my knowledge".
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
a 'typo'.
Yes, it could be just that.
Are we sure Dennis uses the AlNiCo series speaker?
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
I don't think it was a typo.
Jeff thinks Dennis still uses the ferrite, as do I.
I think I can see the aluminum throat of the horn in the Stereophile piece. I don't think I would see it from that angle if the multicellular horns that are used for their 604E. Pretty sure Dennis uses the 604-8H-II with the mantaray horn... and his prices have not changed much.
Cheers,
91.
"Confusion of goals and perfection of means seems to characterise our age." Albert Einstein
I had to use the wayback machine. Dennis' website seems to be down.From Dennis' website,
"The Great Plains Audio/Altec-Lansing model 604H, 15" Duplex Engine, Single-Point-Source Transducer is used. (38 pounds)."
The 604E weighs 33 lbs according to the datasheet.
The 604-8H III weighs 38 lbs according to the datasheet.
The 604-8H II weighs 34 lbs according to the datasheet.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Edits: 10/14/15
Don't recall ever discussing it with him.
Do recall that they are GPA drivers but not which model.
Would not surprise me if they were the older FerriteV as I don't recall him mentioning the multi-cell horn that appears to be on the Alnico version.
Could be either.
"Could be either. "
Could be, but either way.....can you imagine how big the magnet structure would have to be if it did have 44lbs of AlNiCo magnet contained within?
I think we would be talking about a magnet structure the size of the whole speaker basket, or bigger.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
As I'm half blind these days, typos are a common occurrence here.
Yeah, me too.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
I believe ferrite magnet GPA 604s.
Speakers / drivers, ferrite GPA .....versus alnico GPA, are not such a big deal IMHO.
AMPS .... Daniel, are where its at.
Being in Dennis' new Room 418, 90% of the time, for three days, here is precisely how I heard it:
DF brought three pairs of amps to the show. Ninty eight percent of the time he played his red "2016 - EXPERIMENTAL " amps, which were not fully broken in, and not quite ready for public display. To my ear, they had a depression ( suck out ) in between the bass and mid-midrange region, which caused the sound to be non-linear bottom to top - on 604 MLTLs.
BUT, and a BIG BUT, the "experimental" red amps played with VERVE, FINESSE and SPEED, and controlled the drivers unlike any tube amp DF, or anyone else for that matter, has ever built that "I" have heard. They just weren't quite ready for the show.
Friday and Saturday's demoing was all done with the experimental red amps. However, after show hours on Saturday night ) DF, his brother, and I inserted his standard 2015 production amps, a pair done in black chrome powder coat, into the system.
Well, to me, the 2015 "production" amps were VERY listenable to my ear, had perfect bottom to top balance, timbre, and frankly, emotionally, I literally "teared-up" - cried, when I heard them play the GPA 604s so lovely, the production amps touched me as being superb.
That night, I got 5 hours sleep, and then stayed awake for 3 hours, anticipating in my mind how WELL the system would sound all day on Sunday, the last day of the show, ( when the Reviewers knew to come by and hear everyone's system critically ).
Show opened 10 AM Sunday, and I was "jazzed ". OMG, at 10:20 a music lover / audiophile comes in and buys the black chrome amps we were demoing, wrote a check on the spot. This person had to drive a long way Sunday, and could not wait till the end of the show, so the 2015 amps left with him, and I was horror stricken.
DF put back in the red experimental 2016 amps, whereas he had a pair of metallic green 2006 refurbed traded-in amps on hand. He should have used the green refurbed amps.
( So, DF demoed 98 percent of the show with his red amps. )
AFTER the show ended, and before he ripped down the room, DF, his brother Brian, and I inserted the un-played metallic green amps onto the 604s. That was also a lovely experience to me.
A few days after the show, DF called me to let me know that the "red" experimental 2016 circuit had been hammered out, and they were now performing ( to his ear ) better than anything he has ever built. SO....I will look forward to RMAF 2016, next year, to hear them.
Change one cap value, or a wire run inside the amp, and it is probably equal to the difference between a GPA Ferrite or Alnico magneted 604, say I !! Amps are "where its at" - the biggest turkeys, they are always the weakest link in my experience.
Jeff Medwin
As a long time SET user I enjoyed hearing several SET amps with good speaker choices. I felt the Vaughn room was sublime with flowing emotion laden music. The music was detailed but never etched. The imaging was appropriate and the soundstage deep. Mr. Rankin and Mr.Vaughn answered all questions. A wonderful room.
I am a long time reader of the forum and because of it, I use a PX-25 amp, a 45 amp, and a 845 amp. My speakers are modified Klipschs, Great Plains 604 alnicos, and the Terresonic Magnus.
I hope all readers of this forum find a combination of speakers and amps that add meaningful enrichment to their lives.
I did visit the Serios Stereo room on Saturday and had a nice conversation with Brian. We were the only ones in the room. I do enjoy classic country as I grew up in Dallas, Texas and was feed a diet of country music listening to the all night "Bill Mack" Trucker Show on clear channel 820 am.
Listening to this room was for me no better than the AM radio of old. The bass was boomy, the mid range was grainy and the imagining was poor. I felt I has listening to a 1960 transistor radio. The music was loud and reminded me of the music played at the long gone Long Horn Ball Room in Dallas
I am glad Jeff was found an amp- speaker combination that is satisfying.
For me this room did not have a positive effect.
David Pritchard
I do not disagree with you. Its such a shame you only got to hear the red amps. You were there for at best, a couple of hours, I was in there for three days.
Had you been there 10 AM to 10:20 Sunday AM, ( or after-hours Saturday or Sunday ) and heard his standard amps - as I had, you would have gotten a different impression totally, as I have drescribed very clearly above !!
Dennis will likely get those experimental red amps to out-play "everything", I am most confident of that !!! That will be very cool to experience, as a new finished product in audio.
Jeff Medwin
See you Friday afternoon.
Aside from you and Dennis, I'm not sure there will very many SET amps at this show. I wish I were in Colorado, even though it has been unusually sunny in Denmark. Convey my regards to Jim. I still remember vividly the enchanting combination of your amps and his speakers at his home.
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