|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
89.243.121.187
In Reply to: RE: Boston Audio Society Strikes Again! posted by Charles Hansen on September 11, 2007 at 09:44:35
At least they managed to narrow down instances under which differences are audible. As opposed to what folks think is audible. If anybody disagrees, they should perform their own tests and show otherwise. Recently, in a little corner of Seattle after a whole year foot dragging, some diehard vinyl guys found out they could not reliably detect differences btw a CD-copy and vinyl, so Meyer and Moran test is not necessarily inconsistent with what happens on the ground.Personally, considering the quality of John Curl's contribution here and on DIYAudio, he needs to radically change his approach, if he is to contribute anything of longterm value to the advancement of audio perception.
Music making the painting, recording it the photograph
Follow Ups:
What is wrong with you people and why are you so insulting to me? What did I do to you?
I agree, ignore them. Sometimes I think some people's sole mission in life is to stir the pot and cause trouble, instead of trying to learn and share their knowledge openly with others. The lazy person doesn't bother trying.
Brian Walsh
May I ask what knowledge, exactly, is being shared routinely insulting people?
I'm pretty sure you know what I'm talking about, but just in case - you may want to recall the most recent performance, involving some guy from Sweden.
Let me address this: As a small manufacturer, over the years, I know that some customers need help, after their purchase, and some can just be very petty and assume that I will behave like Sony Corp or somesuch when it comes to: schematics, owners manuals, warranty transfer, etc.
Here is Charles Hansen, recently in a serious accident, and not at the factory.
Someone, from somewhere, who has gotten a good deal on some audio equipment, is VERY concerned that he gets the very most out of his most recent purchase, and he addresses a public forum, accusing Charles of not following through in some way. When Charles tries to redress the issue, the guy continues to insist that he is not satisfied. Charles, encumbered with other problems, effectively tells the guy off, by insulting himself. This should have been the end of it, but NO! Then Charles is rebuked for losing his patience.
Well let me tell you, some people tried the same thing with me, after I was totally burned out in a firestorm, 16 years ago. I had a fairly short fuse at the time, so I know that this is not out of line. This is why I offered my input to the discussion.
I followed that debacle quite closely, as you probably saw, and where you are distorting the facts is that the poster in question NEVER accused Charles Hansen of anything. Simply not true. You can go back and read the whole thread again if you wish.
The rest we can simply call differing perspectives then, I suppose.
TL
Seems like a quibble to me. Why then was Charles Hansen provoked to respond in such a way?
I presume that was the question on everyone's lips.TL
Judging by the abundance of your posts on that thread, I would have guessed you might have read Charles Hansen's post that enumerated why he lost his temper. Guess I am wrong.
Sometimes anger is an appropriate response - all of us are humans and anger is a part of our nature. Name calling maybe is not an appropriate response, and Mr. Hansen came to regret that aspect of his posts.
And judging by the abundance of the posts assaulting this shellshocked ex-customer, I'd have thought people read his posts, too (and that includes Charles Hansen - what the hell was he thinking?). Once again, go back and read them before jumping on anyone's bandwagon. There is nothing offensive in any one of them; what's striking instead is their remarkably polite tone, intact even in the face of the inanities hurdled at him.If you guys just like to hang around looking for someone to jump on (ideally someone who's not an English-speaker, I guess, so it's not too troublesome), that's another matter, but then don't windowdress it as something nobler than what it is, using all these silly little rationalizations transparent enough for anyone bothering to read the posts in question. Find other outlets for that accumulated anger - go jogging, chop some wood, put it into productive use. Though conceptions of "human nature" are in fact anything but uniform (feel free to hold on to your own however), group attacks aren't very manly any longer, and in this case it moreover made Ayre products look like something comparable to brass knuckles in their cultural connotation.
Enough said.
TL
> > If you guys just like to hang around looking for someone to jump on
Interesting post, but you're lacking the moral high ground. You might examine how some of your own posting might fit into your argument. Your "luxury pain" post was among the most offensive I've read on AA - that's saying something.
s
Last time around I was a "troubled adolescent."
I'm confused! But it sure looks like you are even more.
TL
"Moral high ground": I'm not looking for one.
"Luxury aches": if indeed you were able to read that message you got the context.
TL
Um, I was drawing attention to your hypocrisy.
Look, I agree with you that Charles Hansen's name calling was inappropriate (hey, he said so himself). And maybe his "luxury aches", to use your indelicate words (but not your cold meaning), had something to do with his short fuse. But you would have us believe that his outburst happened in a vacuum, and that's going to have to be where we part company.
You insist on lifting those two words out of the context - why?What I said was:
Continuing to trumpet the assumed faults of Ulf here is not just highly unfair but almost unbelievably shortsighted and dumb as well. Anyone with a modicum of multicultural understanding would have seen long ago what the deal was about and stopped it right there. The rest was just nitpicking whose only tangible result will be people voting with their wallets. And I don't think you can expect too much sympathy from Scandinavians for your otherwise most regrettable condition, either; compared to what people go through in let's say Iraq, that's but luxury aches, if I take up some straightshooting of my own.
In other words, expecting Hansen's Scandinavian victim and the friends of this victim to be especially forgiving towards their offender and attacker and not voting with their wallets instead would probably be a bit far-fetched.
The "luxury" part as we see it has to do with the fact that this, after all, is about a glamorous American niche manufacturer of expensive vanity goods from a well-off Boulder, CO, neighborhood who, while attending to his own well-being at his considerable leisure on his specialty bicycle costing the annual salary of the guy from the next country, is injured while rolling down along a scenic route freely chosen for his personal pleasure and enjoyment, and is lucky enough to live to talk about it much thanks to the good insurance policy he has. Come to think of it, it might not sound like the life of the worst sufferer on this Earth, compared to all those innumerous others we read about who are destroyed by mutilations, torture, rapes, murders, diseases, and hunger for example in Iraq. In the big scheme of things, Hansen has been enjoying an elite life until now, and soon enough he'll be back at it again as it seems.
Was it really necessary to spell this out for you?
If I expressed myself awkwardly before and continue to do so even here, shouldn't you, for the sake of consistency, be applauding my manliness and "indelicate" straightshooting instead?
Note that I am not blaming the accident on him in any way, nor belittling the degree of personal suffering and inconvenience involved. On the contrary, I expressed my sympathies (and not just in this quoted passage). More than he's prepared to do with the subjects of his tirades, at any rate (and so on all three accounts).
Have a nice day.
TL
< < What is wrong with you people and why are you so insulting to me? > >
Oh, just ignore them John. Maybe it's the way they were raised. Or maybe they are trying to compensate for some other personal deficiencies.
This is all your doing! Here I was trying to retire into a quiet life, and you have to bring up my relations with the AES (that I have been a member of for 40 years). They will be sure to kick me out now! ;-)
Hey, if they kick you out, I'll quit too and we can start our own danged audio society. One that actually tries to improve the art. Kind of like AES was 40 years ago...
I'm also wondering how much of that crap would be allowed if he was just regular inmate here.
...measurements, blah, blah, blah,.....
actually listening to music for long term enjoyment?
Nah, what could THAT possibly tell us?
Oz
I've noticed that you 'subjectivists' often fall back into straw man argument, where you propose a false version of objectivist views in order to ridicule them. Why *is* that, anyway?
FWIW, do all the long-term listening you like. Please familiarize yourself as well as you can with the differences you claim to hear. Then, when you actually get around to reality-testing them, you should have no problem whatever passing those pesky blind comparisons!
Of course, if you never do get around to reality-testing the differences, don't complain if someone suggests maybe you could be imagining them.
FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: