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In Reply to: RE: cPlay - the open source high-end audio player using ASIO posted by cics on May 05, 2008 at 12:31:58
Hello, everybody. In this period I have rebuilt my CMP 3 times, 2 times deliberately leading to a crash and each time applying my own tweaks in a slightly different sequence just to see the "right" way. This is what I propose to do, and it is safe.
Remove to your temp folder, or whatever folder you have chosen, these folders from Windows or Program files or from elswhere: Help (windows help, surely), Internet Explorer, Macromedia, Messenger, Movie Maker, msagent, Netmeetings, Online Services, Outlook Express, Speech, Speech Engine, Video Lan, Windows Media, Windows Media Player and reboot two times. (this is in case you haven't done it yet).
Here goes the tweaks part 5 itself
1. Remove the files: iprtrmgr.dll, rasctrs.dll, mprddm.dll, rasrad.dll, prtmgr.dll, mprddm.dll. Reboot.
2. Registry tweaks
a. Go to regedit, open your registry: H.Key-Classes-Root. Delete wmp.audiocd, wmptheme, wmpskinmngr.1, avifile, audiocd, audiovbscript, audiovbscript.1, wav, wma, wmv, wax, everythimg mp, mpg, mpeg2,3,4, flac and so on (all audio-video multimedia suffixes you know), delete Internet Explorer application and its double - .1, Windows media.
b. Go to H.KEY- Current User-Software-Policies- delete Netscape (repeat with all users)
c. Go to HKLM/System/Control Set001/Services (the same with control set 002 and 003) and delete sysaudio, splitter, cdaudio, swmidi, redbook.
d. Go to HKLM-Software-Active Setup-Installed Components. (Don't be scared) The 4th (cdd79...) from below should be Windows Movie Maker (check in the field to the right) Delete it. The 3rd from above (22d6...) - media player. Delete it.
e. Go to HKLM-Software-Microsoft-delete audiocompr.manager, Internet explorer, IE4 and IE setup
f. Go to Hkey-Users- (you may start with default user but do it within every user listed) s1-5-20 - software-Internet explorer delete it.
g. go to HKLM-System- (all control sets)- services-and delete MSPQM, MSKSSRV, MSPCLOCK
h. HKLM-System-Control set (all sets) ENUM-ROOT-MEDIA delete media
i. HKLM-System-Control set (all sets) -control-Media properties and delete inside everything that doesn't bear the name of your soundcard. The same about Media resources
j. HKLM-System-control set (all sets) -Services and delete: aec, Alerter, asyncMac, audstub, wdmaud, AFD, Browser, DHCP, Dnscache, HTTP, IP6FW (and its .sys file from drivers folder), IPFilterDriver and (ipfltdrv.sys file from drivers folder. All other services with corresponding files will be enumerated below in paragraph j. as files. Remove or delete them from registry AND from folders), IpInIp.sys, kmixer, kssrv, ipnat.sys, ipsec.sys, swmidi, modem, mnmsrvc.exe, splitter, netdde, netddedsdm, netlogon, netman, nla, nic1394.sys, nwlnkflt.sys (+nwlnkipx.sys, nwlnknb.sys, nwlnkspx.sys, nwrdr sys), nwlnkfwd,
perfnet.dll, policy agent, RasAcd, RasAuto, RasMan, rdbss.sys, rdpdr.sys, rdpnp (+drprov.dll), raspppoe.sys, rdsessmgr (+sessmgr.exe), Remote Access, Rpclocator, Shared Access, Spooler (spoolsv.exe !VERY IMPORTANT), Srv.sys, stisvc, ssddpsrv (don't know if it has to do with ssd disks, so be wary), smlogsvc.exe, sysmonlog (+smlogsvc.exe), tapisrv, tcpip.sys (+ tcpip6.sys,), TermDD.sys, termservice (+tcmsetup.exe), Themes, TlntSvr.exe (+telnet.exe, tlntadmin.exe), W32time, wanarp.sys, wdmaud, wmdmPmSn, wuaserv, WZCSVC, xmlprov.
REMOVE THE CORRESPONDING FILES!!!, Perform this castration on all control sets!!!
k.Go to HKLM-System- Control set (all sets)-Control-Class (find 6th from above) {4D36E965-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318} open, find cdrom, remove digital audio, NEXT IS VERY IMPORTANT
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet (all sets) \Control\Class\{4D36E96C-E325-11CE-BFC1-08002BE10318} open and delete everything (you may probably retain drm and kx audio driver 0005, but I deleted everything, though drm and kx driver I deleted later)
As You Delete these services from control set 001 it wil be more or less automatically deleted from current control set, but CHECK ALL SETS. When you will see screaming dialogues, don't be scared.
This is a list of files to be deleted mostly from system32 and system32\drivers
exe files: locator, mnmsrvc, netdde, scardsrv, sessmgr, smlogsvc, spoolsv, tcmsetup, tcpsvcs, telnet, tlntadmin, tlntsvr.
dll files: drprov, iprtrmgr, mprddm, ncxpnt, nddeap, nddenb32, netapi (be careful), netcfgx, netevent, neth, netid, netman, netrap, nlhtml, nmevtmsg, nwwks perfnet rasctrs rasrad
sys files: afd, http, ip6fw, ipfltdrv, ipinip, ipnat, ipsec, modem, rio1394, nwlnkflt, nwlnkfwd, nwlnkipx, nwlnknb, nwlnkspx, nwrdr, raspppoe, rdbss, rdpdr, srv, tcpip6, tcpip, termdd and a file wave.inf (search for it)
NOW REBOOT. Listen to some music! (Let your cmp burn in for an hour)
Serge.
P.S. Please, try to do it with a system backup or smth... just in case. I don't expect ANY troubles.
P.P.S. This is the hardest part of the tweaks. Starting from part 7 and up to 9 it will be piece of cake.
Follow Ups:
there were a few things I could not find.
Let all of the wmdaud stuff in.
Does seem to offer a clearer view into the music but not enough time before or after to make a real assessment.
One thing for sure it did not go backwards.
Truly a pain to do - probably took almost as much time as the standard optimizations.
Downloaded a copy of XPLite and will make those changes tomorrow.
Ditto here.
On my system it was a small but worthwhile improvement. It is all cummulative and heading in the same direction. More air and separation around instruments. In this case the bass sprung to life with more texture and definition. I look forward to next steps but first I have to figure out how to take an image of my system, as I don't want to go through this again.
Thanks Serge
Finally got thru Steppe 5 too (minlogon/winlogon/xplite....). I agree bass comes back.Another observation regarding post xplite. Prior level sounded very deep as if soundstage went way back but you were still outside the soundstage. Like there was a narrow door that was open to the soundstage but you were still outside. Now (post xplite) it sounds as if you entered the narrow door and the soundstage is deep but you are within it and all is very clean/clear not bright just clear.
Edits: 09/17/11
Does Control Panel still work for you?
*
Usually when I boot up I go to Control Panel and stop Cryptographic service and I uninstall Numeric Data Prcessor and unused Usb ports to get them off the IRQ. Also when I install a new hdd I enable one of the other Stopped Services (forget which one) to do routine hw management. I have come up with a workaround for Crypto and have discovered how to access control panel from the Command Line but it still does not allow me to get to device mgr. I do not notice any ill effects from inability to get into Control Panel (because it sounds excellent!!) and I could live with it but would rather not.Also I do not know how to change sound cards or load new drivers without control panel.
Edits: 09/15/11
Theob & others...
If you can't get to the control panel anymore, here's how to get to some of the functions directly...
First, set cMP to open the Task Manager at Startup. In the Task Manager, select File, Run, then Browse to one of the following files in windows\system32\ for some useful Control Panel options:
Services.msc - Services
appwiz.cpl - Add/Remove Programs
desk.cpl - Desktop
sysdm.cpl - System Properties (for the Hardware Manager)
main.cpl - Mouse
I've only gotten through Steppe 4 & Jolida 1 & 2 so far, but these still work for me.
Greg in Mississippi
Everything matters!
Great cant wait to try!Unfortunately did not work...I get same result. I can access what looks like device mgr for example but when I click on it I get an error message.
Edits: 09/16/11
*
Look I think what you have done here is brilliant not because you are a computer expert but because you are not. I don't know how I would ever accomplish what you have other than thru brute trial/error. If that is how you did it I salute you even more because that is a whole lot of work. And to the extent that you are sharing it here I thank you. Let me be clear I am not going back from Steppe 5 it is that good...pure highs, depth, transients and dynamics to die for. If I have to reload a prior image of windows to load new hw I will do it. And if I can figure out why reloading Winlogon did not work for me I will be implementing Steppe 6, 7...
I am just looking for a way to avoid reloading windows.
I do not recommend to owners of network configurations of cMP2 do this tweak. Only lose time and will restore the system. Too many of the removed files and registry entries are related to network capabilities of the system and the Steppe not even warn about it!
http://cmp2-mihaylov.narod.ru/
these mods have been offered as something for the purist.
Network capabilities, from what I have read in the FORUM, are mainly for the sake of convenience and CERTAINLY no one would do this if that was of importance to them.
Only for those wanting to take their computer transport to the highest level. As with all gear that I am aware of one gets to choose between sound and convenience with each option taking a toll against the other one.
I am not interested in any convenience and only want the best sound I can get out of our humble approach.
Thanks to Serge for his efforts.
My apologies for not paying better attention.
I do wonder, though, if with the removal of the networking capability could there be such an improvement, without using a network, that one could come out ahead?
with the removal of the networking capability could there be such an improvement
It needs to be tested but my guess would be that a good network-connected but headless setup would come out on top.
The orthodox setup includes a keyboard, a mouse (possibly a wireless one) and a monitor (perhaps with a touchscreen), all of them noisier than school children at a boy-band concert. Many builders use separate switching power supplies for the CPU, for the motherboard and for disk drives and adopt a bewildering variety of measures to tame them. Data are stored on locally-connected (notoriously noisy) spinning disks. The whole lot is typically squeezed together in a case beneath a rat's nest of cables. What a mess. (If you don't believe me, look at almost all pictures of inmates' systems - they're a veritable plague of "leeches on a mermaid's ass".
Compared to that lot, the likes of a Fit-PC2 (or indeed almost any mini-ITX mobo where the total power draw is about the same as most soundcards on their own) with a good linear PSU sited remotely, an SSD for the OS (also with a remote linear PSU) and a LAN to provide control and data seems to me as simple as it gets.
Hmmmmmm. A Keyboard, a mouse, a monitor, switching PSUs, at least one spinning disk, a soundcard with enough PSU add-ons to rival a small aircraft - or a mostly-inactive networking stack. Tough call.
Mihaylov: I do not recommend to owners of network configurations of cMP2 do this tweak
I've done most of the steppe 5 deletions and am reasonably convinced that there's an improvement to be had but I have not tried deleting anything that might be to do with networking and probably won't.
"Сonvenience" and "best sound" not is mandatory contradict each other.
Agree completely.
Dave
I haven't had time to attempt step 5 but am also daunted re impairing network function. Could you say which items you do not change or delete in order to preserve this?
There you go again smoking that cigarette (in a holder of course) talking with a David Niven accent, :)
Hi Dave!
Please describe your version of step 5 for the network configuration of cMP2 a la Fit-PC2.
Thanks.
Serge.
http://cmp2-mihaylov.narod.ru/
Edits: 09/15/11 09/15/11
Please describe your version of step 5 for the network configuration of cMP2 a la Fit-PC2.
Sorry for the delay - I decided to check that I'd done everything on the lists before answering your question. (I hadn't but I have now.) I don't have a "version" as such though I do have a procedure. In case it's helpful, here it is.
1. I have already worked at length with Bold-Fortune's XP Slimming Guide (see link). Much of what steppe recommends I have, for different reasons, already done and, in many cases, have gone further. (Details later!) That said, his suggestions have a marked effect on SQ and are well worth doing.
2. I would advise anyone against making changes like this unless they have an imagefile backup utility such as Snapshot or Acronis. It's a good idea also to have a docking station on your desktop box as it makes for quick recovery. Non-recoverable errors are pretty much inevitable.
I would also urge inmates NOT to use XPLite for anything other than disabling WFP. See link for a good explanation of why XPLite is best avoided.
But you know all this.
3. Copy the AA post into a text file and format it so it's easy to read (e.g. one step per line). See what steps are likely to involve networking. Clues include, obviously, the likes of files with net, tcp and ip in the name.
4. Perform the various steps in cMP Mode - it makes testing much quicker. Create shortcuts to regedit.exe and cmd.exe and place them somewhere easy to find. Launch Explorer from cMP's GUI and navigate to the shortcuts.
5. Work your way through the lists line by line. Skip any steps that you suspect may affect networking.
As you're accessing the cMP^2 box via VNC on an Internet-enabled desktop, it's easy look up any files you're not certain about. Much of the info is provided by companies trying to sell "security" software and isn't much use but you can usually get a rough idea sooner or later.
If the named file is present, decide whether to keep or delete it; make a note in your text file of what you delete. XP denied me access to some files - I didn't try to over-ride it.
If you disabled as many devices as possible prior to or during the XP install, many of the listed files may well not be present. I could only find about a quarter of them.
6. Test the system every few steps. This is easy if you stay in cMP Mode - a quick reboot is all you need.
7. Make regular backups of the OS partition - much better than the oft-recommended procedure of copying files you delete in the hope you can restore them in the event of fatal error. You'll forget where they came from and, in any case, copying doesn't protect you against Regedit errors.
The more often you make backups, the less time it takes to pin down the source of a problem.
8. I suppose, what with this and that, steppes 5 and 6 took me about two hours. I had no fatal errors (though I've had plenty before).
HTH
Dave
So Dave is not going thru Xplite (or an equivalent) a pre-requisite to Steppe 6 & beyond? That's how I read Serge. Did you do something similar to Xplite? Was not Autoruns something similar? When you went through Slimming XP did you use his 'routine' to do the changes or did you just plow through all the individual changes?
I am not anxious to buy a program for $40 to do one task and maybe never use it again.
I normally adhere to that procedure which you described. But it demands a lot of time. I thought that may be you have the LIST of changes in the registry and file system which it is necessary to make for the step 5 on full optimized cMP2 with network. But all the same thanks!
Serge.
http://cmp2-mihaylov.narod.ru/
Edits: 09/16/11
"Network capabilities, from what I have read in the FORUM, are mainly for the sake of convenience." -You are mistaken.
"I am not interested in any convenience and only want the best sound I can get out of our humble approach." -
"Сonvenience" and "best sound" not is mandatory contradict each other.
http://cmp2-mihaylov.narod.ru/
Edits: 09/15/11
I suppose the usual caveat applies to the tweakers.
But one can always try this freeware for registries backup.
http://erunt.en.softonic.com/images
Just a few clicks of the mouse to save and restore those deleted registries.
Provided, always, the mouse is still alive after the tweaks.
"I suppose the usual caveat applies to the tweakers." -
Similar claims to cics could be never!
For example look here http://www.cicsmemoryplayer.com/index.php?n=CMP.08AutoRuns (steps 4 and 5) and here http://www.cicsmemoryplayer.com/index.php?n=CMP.07Optimisations (step 6).
http://cmp2-mihaylov.narod.ru/
since I use SSD for my opertaing system I wanted to check on this.
Fist thing O fond is that there is an extra letter in Serge's report.
The next thing is, from what I can see, it has nothing to do with SSD. All I read talks about USB and plug and play ...
I wish you would have made it clearer on what is what with the registry and .dll/.ysy.etc paired deletions. Do all of them have correspondents?
If not it would be good for the squeamish to know which has which.
Maybe there is no confusion when one gets going. I am looking at my office computer to get a feel for what's what. It just seems there could be some confusions with .exe and .dll files if both exist. Do we delete them both if this is the case?
Thanks and hope I do not sound ungrateful - just a bit nervous. I know you recommend an image of WINDOWS but the programs I have looked at seem like they are always ON which seems to me to be a problem in themselves. Is this not the case and if so, whose software are you using for this?
Thanks, again,
Hello, thank you for the interest. Dlls and exe programs are different. It often happens that svchost is starting with a -key that starts some service and THREADS to other services, represented by other dlls. also there is an utility thst is called run dll as a program. I want to find and EXTERMINATE IT. If I suggest to remove (read delete) a dll it doesn't mean to delete an exe or sys file with the same name. it may come later. I am not a computer specialist, so I may be all wrong. but what I suggest is derived from practice and only after I make sure that the system is stable. Take for e.g. file winspool.exe. It has impact on sq, but though cplay would work without it, cmp wouldn't. So I sort the files, I propose to delete. also, if you have a sp3, PLEASE, make a differences list, that other folks will know that there are some more files to delete.
Serge
My suggestion was to make it EVEN cleared for us who are much less savvy that you just which suffix to remove.
As if you have not given us enough, I know, it does sound ungrateful, but I figure if you did not want this to be used by others you would not ahve gone to all of the trouble to write it down. Please accept my criticism in that light.
Thanks, again,
Hello. Criticism accepted. From tweaks part 7 I try to be absolutely precise with filenames. Also, if network defenders will read this, real orthodox setup was no network and no keyboard and even no mouse (why then write a program called cicsremote and use a touchscreen.) I don't understand why we need network. To grab music from torrents? I don't do it.
Serge
"I don't understand why we need network." -
1. To provide the FULL GALVANIC ISOLATION of cMP2 from hdd.(I explain that it is important first of all for a SQ).
- It is irrelevant certainly only if you use ssd and do not use hdd (internal, usb hdd, esata hdd, etc.) generally. Big ssd (more 500 GB) too expensive for me.
- And certainly it is critical if you made the full optimization of cMP2 with the full linear psu and your audio system is good enough.
2. Usage of network capabilities allows to delete the mouse, the keyboard, the built-in monitor, to disconnect all usb ports as already correctly noted Dave.(I explain that it is important first of all for a SQ).
Serge, I recommend to you to study the content of website CICS attentively.
Serge.
http://cmp2-mihaylov.narod.ru/
Looked at the article, which I of course remember, but dismissed it at the time because I am not using an USB dac and likely never will.
I am confused though about the elimination of the monitor, mouse, and keyboard. I assume these are "turned off" within the machine and not simply left unplugged?
It would be interesting to be able to compare both approaches. Never will happen at my house, sorry to say (no help here with the answer).
One wonders, though, with all of the assumptions we have had to temper about digital audio if a network cable really does bring about the galvanic isolation that is desired? Assuming a fully functioning computer as your SEND unit it is not beyond conception that the pollution from that machine could ride the signal you are sending to the minimal machine.
I continue to think both approaches are valid and I suspect very good results can be achieved with both. Not that they will do all of the same things well but that each will have its own strengths.
Could be a form of personality test as to which one one pursues? I wonder what is says about those of us willing to squint for hours at a monitor deleting files?
All I know is that something quite good became apparent with the cumulative effect of the previous deletions and XPLite. Yes, it is a little frustrating having a computer that does not do all of the things it did before (and that was not much!) but as with the graduation from a changer to a proper turntable, these things must be done.
Bye.
real orthodox setup was no network and no keyboard and even no mouse (why then write a program called cicsremote and use a touchscreen.)
Because some users find a touchscreen convenient. I don't - nor was I ever convinced that the sonic crud it must cause made it worthwhile. For that and other reasons, I eventually rejected the "orthodox" setup and looked for a different solution. Others have done much the same.
I don't understand why we need network. To grab music from torrents? I don't do it.
For the benefits of networked (headless) setups, see here:
http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/pcaudio/messages/9/95222.html
and here (though it's a bit dated):
http://www.cicsmemoryplayer.com/index.php?n=CMP.Headless
Nothing to do with downloads! Other reasons? Monitors are ugly, greedy for space and, esp with a touchscreen, expensive to buy and run.
++++
Theob sees me as a smoothie, David Niven smart ass.
So how do I picture him? Hmmmmmmm Thinks . . . How about as one of those hicks a'jumpin' an a'cursin fit to bust - while a'blastin' away at yet another Goddamn motherboard that's just gone up in smoke??
Only jokin', Pardner.
Ok got through Steppe 5 and it sounds good ...a little light (Jolida might not like) but I cant get Services from control panel (to turn off Crypto) and I cant get into Device Mananger to get some stuff off the irq etc. But how would I change drivers for juli@ or load a new sound card or add a new hard drive? In my case I could reload an earlier image of windows but this might be a major issue for many.The sonics (if they get no better than post Steppe 5) are not enough to justify giving up the above functionality (device mgr, ability to stop Crypto, add new disks etc) from within minlogon. In other words I will try Steppe 6 and 7 but I am skeptical now.
Edits: 09/14/11
I went thru Steppe 5 and I missed some stuff which I picked up the 2nd time thru. For Jolida I also listened to Steppe 5 with/without Sound.drv. I like it way better with Sound.drv deleted. It sounds really good. I am still concerned about Crypto and getting into Control Panel to stop it and also to eliminate stuff from IRQ (like Numeric processor and unused usb hubs). I am currently doing Steppe 6 (I Snapshot my image as a backup) but am doing it slowly (I hate minlogon).
If I had to live with Steppe 5 I would. I prefer it now to pre Steppe 5. If anyone knows how to do the above stuff without going thru Control Panel pls let me know.
Theob,
I haven't implemented steppe 5 or 6 yet. Will probably try it soon. And with regards to my liking or disliking of the music, which may get, as u say 'lighter', is truly subjective. Its not a preference of a particular flavour of sound that I have. What I look for, is a Balance in the entire frequency range. As mentioned earlier, if the Highs sound open or airy after a deletion, but at the cost of the lower range going down a notch, then it's a compromise, or as I put it, 'a downside'. It's something like u pulling Ur speakers a few inches more off the Walls, than they are at the moment, which would somewhat result in the same kind of a tonal change. An improvement, on the other hand, is clearly audible, only with familiar recordings which we are well versed with. Making the presentation Lighter, than it should actually be, is like an equalisation, which is not a very good thing in High-end audio.
As I have mentioned already, I haven't tried steppe 5 or 6. I shall post my opinion when I'm done with them soon :-)
As for the sound.drv file, I still prefer it in. Must be an Acoustical difference between Ur room & mine, which likes either. My room measures almost flat using REW software, using 16 ASC tubetraps, 8 Panels by Realtraps & a couple of RPG skyline diffusors on the front wall & ceiling. Did u like the file in more after steppe 5 ??
I meant no disrespect or even a value judgement on your taste or your system. I was just giving my subjective impressions to hopefully help others (especially you) who otherwise might wonder what Steppe 5 might do for their systems. I do prefer Sound.drv out post Steppe 5.
I am however perplexed as to why Winlogon acts like I have missing drivers for juli@ and usb ports and wont use drivers I quite clearly have in in my Windows System32folder. When I reloaded my image file (which includes minlogon enabled) my system works fine.
I am also concerned that post Steppe 5 I cannot use Control Panel.
Did you ever get 1g ram to work?
No I could not. Last night was even worse. Since my attempt of changing to a 1gb ram, the Juli@ console is acting pretty funny. When I start the computer, the "esi" icon loads in the system tray, but when I take the mouse cursor on it, it disappears. The Juli@ is active in the device manager, shows up in the cMp as well, but does not output any signal. Now when I revert back to the original 2gb ram, it behaves the same, even if I restore a working Image back-up. Will try again this evening, else I'm afraid I will have to start from scratch all-over again :-(
Let me know.
Thanks,
Its german program called snapshot. Slight cost something like $40 or so.
Edits: 09/14/11
Something I should do.
Thanks, again,
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