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In Reply to: RE: cMP - can't get it to work!!! posted by audiodan@tiscali.it on April 10, 2011 at 00:23:09
Hi Daniele,
thanks for your help!
ASIO4ALL not bit-perfect? I've never read about that... (even cics is recommending ASIO4ALL if there are no native ASIOs)
How would the Overture compare to the Xonar concerning the hardware?
Cantatis claims to have such a good hardware - can you confirm that, esp. in relation to the Xonar? You're a brave modder, as far as I can depict from the links you provided, so I guess you can provide some insights about the hardware of both cards...
I couldn't find a suitable translation program for the italian links you provided, and Google translatior is ridiculous. So I can only roughly estimate the content of the posts. What do you regard as a mid-range CDP (comparison to the Essence ST)?
I'm using JRiver with its inbuilt kernel streaming and complete memory loading at the moment, and I start it through cMP, just as I would with cPlay. Its the only kmixer-bypassing option that works with the Overure. But I guess it should be Bit-perfect, too - or what?! At least JRiver is well appreciated for its sound quality, so I suppose in that setup (kernel streaming, memory play, via cMP) it could be a worthwhile replacement for cPlay.
I'm waiting for Dawnrazor's comment on my settings of the cMP-system to find out if I've missed something. If he (or some other friendly guy having insights) can't find anything weird I'll go with the JRiver option at first and see if I'll switch to another soundcard (probably +DAC - I'm thinking of a Beresford TC-7520SE, but I don't know which soundcard with it) later on.
I'm having the RME 9632 lying around at home un-unpacked. I find it difficult to decide if it justifies the money. Without an external DAC its probably only midrange at best, but with a DAC its probably overkill since then most likely the DAC would make the sound (maybe something like a cheap EMU 0404 or so would be a wiser choice together with a DAC, but on the other hand: the RME 9632 has a zero-CPU-load design and is supposed to be on low pro level already. A fine Lynx is expensive, so getting a better DAC instead would probably be the better choice, right? No??)
Follow Ups:
Hi E,
I'm waiting for Dawnrazor's comment on my settings of the cMP-system to find out if I've missed something
Well I found the german hard to get past :).
Though I thought it was weird that windows showed a soundcard present at all. I suppose it is because the windows audio service is running. On the lynx you can stop the windows audio service and use the native asio driver. One of the things I took from the cmp2 project is that the sofware side of things is just as important as the hardware and well you might be better off soundwise with a card that doesnt need the windows audio service even if that cards hardware might not be as good as the card you have now.
Is there a pict of the canturis setup screen???
Otherwise, nothing jumped out at me. Looks like that card is just a non starter with cmp2. Though if you can get it to work with Jriver it should work with asio4all which is just doing kernal streaming. Maybe jriver is the compromise you need.
If you are set on getting an external dac, I would say go with the Juli@. We know it works with cmp2 and is affordable and will make a great card for your external dac. FWIW I do recall an inmate who used the juli@s analog outs and was happy.
Sorry I cant be of more help. Now about that Lynx :)
No one here remembers the bending of our minds
Thanks Dawnrazor!
You were a great help in that EXcluding ways and possibilities is just as important as INcluding them!
By the way: I've had a state somewhen during the struggle with no soundcard mentioned in the windows settings. I rolled that back to what it is now because I thought that must have been wrong. But ASIO4ALL did't work in that state without a soundcarddriver present either.
Meanwhile Daniele from Italy reported similar problems with the Overture. He dropped it and modded a Xonar quite heavily instead and seems to be happy. Leif from Berlin tought me that kernel streaming is not bit perfect and that the upsampling done by cPlay is much more sophisticated than Sox and alike in foobar/JRiver, and I think Daniele mentioned that ASIO4ALL isn't bit perfect either. So the Overture is ready to be kicked out... Thanks a lot again for your help.
So far nobody really seems to be willing to tell me that there is a good analog out soundcard for PCI out there. Hmmm... Seems to be true then, or what?! But: that forces me, if I want or not, to consider an external DAC more severely. What are nowadays recommendations on DACs ready to be used in a living room (i.e. no studio design, rack mount, or so)? I was thinking about a Beresford TC-7520SE (~€300/$400). I'd be willing to spend ~€500/$650. Or even better: a complete external USB-soundcard including a DAC (one box) to have power supply for both components completely external...
These shall be my final questions in this thread to lead it to a useful end (since throwing the Overture out alone is not really satisfying).
My take on your dilemma is that you could get the lynx. I think the analog outs ARE good and know of at least one external dac that is double the price and doesnt sound as good.
It is all relative of course but you will need something to get spdif to a dac (usb can work but it isnt exactly meant for the cmp2 build though the usb section does help alot). The Lynx has a great sounding analog output for the money, and the digital out is stellar according to Gordon Rankin. So if you want to, you can later add an external dac.
Also you have been trying to fit a square piece into a round hole with the cantoris, and I know the lynx works and works well with what you are trying to do. You have already wasted time and caused yourself frustration by going down a less traveled path, maybe it is time to take one that works??
No one here remembers the bending of our minds
Your point of view sounds reasonable indeed.
But before before shooting too fast again I'll try to collect some information now.
Your statement about Lynx' l22 analog outs sounds promising.
Are RME9632's multiple clock operation modi helpful in any way?
At the moment I'm in a discussion about asynchronous USB. But I don't really oversee that area so far. Have to find out about cMP's pitfalls concerning that first, then see if there are suitable soundcards at all (haven't seen USB on a soundcard yet, only Firewire). At least RME and Lynx both provide AES/EBU for clock synchro in the future, but AES/EBU-connected DACs are pricy, I believe.
I didn't expect it to become so complex at THAT point...
Maybe we shouldn't go too far right here and now. I think I'll start another thread for that when time is right.
Thanks a lot so far!
I hope I am not confusing you further, but your choices for an int. sound card are:
1) Lynx L22
2) RME 9632
3) E-MU 1212M PCIe
4) Asus Essence ST
5) ESI Juli@
3, 4 and 5 are not expensive. You can even buy 2nd hand.
So you can try and eventually change them in the future. 5 is inferior for analog.
Both 3 and 4 have solved the driver problems they had in the past.
If you choose 1616M, you have 3) with analog part outside.
Hi Bibo,
thanks for your clear statement.
That ist basically the ranking that seems to crystallize from the whole discussion I've had here and elswhere meanwhile.
Dawnrazor is strongly in favour of the expensive Lynx l22, and he's most likely right if I consider what I've heard so far and that he has tested it extensively himself.
At the moment I'm trying to decide if the RME 9632 (which is lying at my home unused) is really auditibly worse than the Lynx via analog out or if it might only have a different sonic personality. Spec-wise they are both pretty similar. Especially do both offer an AES/EBU connection for later perfect external clock synchro (if I've got it right) in case a DAC should ever come into my mind...
And from what I've heard RME's drivers should be okay. The RME obviously hasn't been used/tested as extensively as the Lynx, though.
YOu keep saying you have the rme just lying around.
why not give it a try??
And FWIW bibo01, Play-mate and myself have all used the lynx 2b which is a multichannel version of the l22 with a cmp2 setup. You can do better than the Lynx but if you think the Lynx is expensive, then wait till you see what better costs...
No one here remembers the bending of our minds
My list was not necessarily a ranking.I had both RME and Lynx. I preferred the second.
However, you pay a premium for 1 and 2 for added flexibility. 3 or 4 are also very good. You can also add an external DAC at a later date and use them digitally at maximum frequency.
PS: Leif (play-mate) was wrong, KS can be bit perfect in XP.
Edits: 04/10/11
Aha, all insiders over here... ;-)
WHAT did you like better (from your very personal, subjective point of view) in the Lynx than in the RME?
How do you realize bitperfekt kernelstreaming under XP? Is there anything specific to adjust?
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