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RE: Would you buy anything made by a company that offers this in their FAQ:...

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In Reply to: RE: Would you buy anything made by a company that offers this in their FAQ:... posted by carcass93 on October 30, 2009 at 13:11:41

Having heard the ADM9s I can happily say I would purchase them if my finances restricted me to their price range. For the price, they really are a remarkable piece of kit.
Unfortunately, marketing BS is part of the game. If we ruled out gear based upon the marketing talk of the manufacturers website the list of potential gear would be extremely short. The only way to pick gear is to listen to it.
Personally, I can't help but think that the problem with AVIs particular flavour of marketing BS is that it questions audiophile preconceptions rather than reinforcing them.

Edits: 10/30/09

Follow Ups:

RE: Would you buy anything made by a company that offers this in their FAQ:... - Phelonious Ponk 18:22:34 10/30/09 (4)
"Personally, I can't help but think that the problem with AVIs particular flavour of marketing BS is that it questions audiophile preconceptions rather than reinforcing them."

-- Or perhaps it is not BS, and strips audiophile misconceptions bare. Really, the only thing there that is BS is the complete elimination of jitter. They needed to add "for all practical purposes" to keep it honest.

P
- BTW, "T0M" (or is it TiM) - it was very brave of you... - carcass93 13:03:15 10/31/09 (2)
  ... to post sexually-themed personal attack against me, under fake moniker, from proxy IP.
  
  Keep up good work.
  - RE: BTW, "T0M" (or is it TiM) - it was very brave of you... - Phelonious Ponk 13:21:29 10/31/09 (1)
    Tim. And it wasn't me, peaches. I'm already here under a handle, as you've pointed out. No need to create a second to take a shot at a serial poo-slinger such as yourself. Besides, I'm sure I'm nowhere near the top of the list of people you've annoyed and offended.
    
    Pity I don't have the courage to post openly as you do. By the way, is that Mr. Carcass, or Carc Ass?
    
    P
    - Never hurts to check... No way to be sure, you know. - carcass93 14:21:08 10/31/09 (0)
      Who's "poo-slinger"? I've no idea who you're talking about. I did not INITIATE personal attacks against you, or anyone else - I only sometimes respond to such. As far as gear goes - we're here to discuss it, and it's not my fault that it's tough for you, or somebody else, to take different opinion.
      
      And it's Mr. Carcass93 to you.
- Perhaps it is, and doesn't strip anything bare - - carcass93 20:13:37 10/30/09 (0)
  - except for that company's biases, and obvious lack of either honesty or knowledge.
  
  But what do I know - the product must be good, after all its DAC is indistinguishable from the most perfect DAC in existence, Benchmark DAC1.
  
  Right?
Disagree on several points. - carcass93 13:59:42 10/30/09 (2)
1. "Unfortunately, marketing BS is part of the game."

No - MARKETING is part of the game, marketing BS is not, or should not be, at least. In PS Audio newsletter, that was discussed in deleted thread, there was an example of marketing without too much of BS.

2. "The only way to pick gear is to listen to it."

Ideally, yes. Practically, I sometimes buy gear (used, online), listen to it, and get rid of it if I don't like what I hear, or when I have something better. To buy something unheard, you have to be somewhat ENCOURAGED to do so - and the quotes in my original post would DISCOURAGE me personally.

3. "problem with AVIs particular flavour of marketing BS is that it questions audiophile preconceptions rather than reinforcing them."

No offense, but your usage of an expression "audiophile preconceptions" tells me that you're not free from "anti-audiophile preconceptions". To me, those pieces of marketing BS attempt to challenge knowledge, experience with quality gear, and even common sense - not preconceptions. Or, to put it differently, it caters to lack of knowledge, experience, and common sense.
- The legal term is 'puffing'... - Chris Garrett 17:24:34 10/30/09 (0)
  "we make the best hamburger in the world".
  
  Chris
- RE: Disagree on several points. - toasties 14:56:26 10/30/09 (0)
  "No - MARKETING is part of the game, marketing BS is not, or should not be, at least. In PS Audio newsletter, that was discussed in deleted thread, there was an example of marketing without too much of BS."
  
  And yet looking at the PS audio site I see plenty of similar marketing talk. Look at their description of the way the network bridge and the digital lens reduce jitter, apparently the only network transport/DAC that does it properly, that sets off my BS-ometer. But it's their website and I take it as a given that they will hype up their own product so it's no biggie.
  
  The irony is, I own a cullen modded digital link and love it. Once the perfectwave is fully functional I might take a gander at that too.
  
  Don't misunderstand, some websites aren't full of marketing BS, but the ones that aren't are the exception to the rule in my experience.
  
  "Ideally, yes. Practically, I sometimes buy gear (used, online), listen to it, and get rid of it if I don't like what I hear, or when I have something better. To buy something unheard, you have to be somewhat ENCOURAGED to do so - and the quotes in my original post would DISCOURAGE me personally."
  
  You would, I wouldn't. I tend to go more from reports of people who have listened to the gear. That's why forums like this are so useful. Manufacturers websites are useful for specs but not much else imo.
  
  "No offense, but your usage of an expression "audiophile preconceptions" tells me that you're not free from "anti-audiophile preconceptions". To me, those pieces of marketing BS attempt to challenge knowledge, experience with quality gear, and even common sense - not preconceptions. Or, to put it differently, it caters to lack of knowledge, experience, and common sense."
  
  We all have preconceptions. IMO, in some areas the audiophiles/subjectivists have it right, in some areas the anti-audiophiles/objectivists have it right. I wouldn't say I'm an extreme member of either camp. My point was that certain manufacturers get a free ride with their marketing talk as long as it appeals to the audiophile mindset. That wouldn't put me off their product because they may be good.
  
  Like I said, I've heard the ADM9s and they are a quality product. Their marketing patter or forum behaviour doesn't make much difference to me. To be honest, I recommended the ADMs to a friend a couple of weeks ago. He's not an audiophile, and didn't want to spend the earth, but wanted a good system. The ADMs were a very obvious choice.

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