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In Reply to: RE: When your music appliance breaks you're at the mercy of others... posted by AbeCollins on July 22, 2015 at 11:52:49
Yes, there is an argument that using a general purpose computer for audio playback gives you more options. But I think a lot of computer audio users are strongly attached to their playback chain of choice and when it breaks they're not going to be happy about switching to some other software. Likewise if a person's music player appliance breaks they're not going to be happy but usually have something else to play music they can fall back on.
A more important point in my opinion is that the maintenance burden of an internet connected general purpose computer is considerably higher than any media playback device I've owned, and the overall reliability of a general purpose computer can be a fair bit lower. I think if we were able to compare the number of people affected by a botched upgrade like the one you posted to the number of people affected by operating system updates gone awry, viruses and malware, and other common computer problems - the latter would but much higher.
Follow Ups:
Hi Dave,
Everything you say makes sense and I agree. The problem here is that is difficult to have an intelligent discussion because of a couple people who do not really understand what's going on with computer audio. They cannot comprehend that people can also use what may start out as a standard computer (if there is such a word because computers can come in many shapes and forms) as a streaming audio device.
The one thing that I may take a bit of exception with is the fact you mentioned about the Internet connection viruses, updates etc. My computers are no different from the dedicated streamers that are being foisted on us by the audio manufacturers. I push the button to turn it on use a tablet or similar device to control it, and push a button to turn it off, what is the difference? There is no antivirus software, or for that matter any ancillary software on the system. It runs in core mode, which is like DOS and it is hard to imagine a less intrusive operating system. It is just that a couple of people here have actually little knowledge and as is often the case, the less informed someone is the more noise they make.
Regards
Bob
It would be fascinating to know who the "couple of people" you think are making the noise. (LOL)
Does anyone who disagrees with you mean that they are ignorant and disruptive, making it not possible to have a "good discussion?" Are you so insecure in your solution that you have to go out of your way to label people who compare & use several different solutions, "precious streamer guys?" Is there a party-line that some people need to be forced to toe?Considering the two people who I think that you're referring to, both are running computer based solutions, and are, in fact, more familiar with several different types of solutions than you are: neither of these two people START contentious threads that have as their essence, criticizing a solution that they themselves employ.
You're starting all of the "noise" with your claims and criticisms of high end audio manufacturers, - who are much better at the most important aspects of producing higher performing audio than traditional commercial, multi-purpose computers. (This is proven out historically, & presently, long before their ever was digital file playback, - with CD players, amplifiers, speakers, etc). But you won't know, because you won't try, (as is the case with other naysayers who try to assert things like NAD amps sound the same as LAMMs). But unfortunately, that doesn't stop you from criticizing.""My computers are no different from the dedicated streamers that are being foisted on us by the audio manufacturers.""
That has been PROVEN, - without a doubt, - to be 100% false. And, especially, - with only about 6 of these devices out there: they are hardly "foisted" by audio manufacturers. Wavelength, - who brought us the USB solution, is an Audio designer-manufacturer. Logitech is not an audio manufacturer.
When it is really difficult to have a good discussion is when someone with an anti-high performance audio agendae comes on an high performance audio website and is uninformed about the components involved in high performing audio devices. (Hint: the power supply is far more important than any OS and/or digital file playback software).The irony of your accusations is not lost considering your lack of experience: experience being the most critical aspect of having a "good discussion." For with experience comes the realization that good sound can be achieved with either approach.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 07/23/15
This is like groundhog day. These folks enjoy wasting time getting in circular arguments and they seek to discredit file playback set ups they have NEVER tried. One brings in a new DAC every two weeks which obviously means their is something off, and they are seeking to correct it at the DAC end, a classic tail chasing paradigm.
You are all over the place and making little sense. What does this have to do with Wavelength or Logitech? NAD vs Lamm? I am not criticizing high-end manufacturers at all. It is the few people who do not really understand what is going on here. Maybe you need to do some reading on the CA, JPlay or Tri Na HiFi forums. Staying here only you are learning very little.
repeated for emphasis,.....
You don't really have enough experience & maturity to understand that your way is not the only way.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
"You don't really have enough experience & maturity to understand that your way is not the only way."
Oh boy... Please stop talking out of your....
Do your self a favor, stop writing, and listen.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Actually have... Why are you screaming??? Are you really that immature.smh...
You are all over the place and making little sense.
Not only that, it gets a little rough around here when they tag team against you. ;-)
.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
.... Windows users in general (often), and "streamers" (looks like daily now, too), the only proper solution is the Apple masterpiece, THE ultimate music-making machine.I'm wondering if there's another single person in this forum, stupid enough to believe that - despite the mantra being so persistent.
PS: I sincerely hope Chris, the moderator, enjoys the "smooth sailing" - with a rambunctious 500 Lb gorilla on board.
Edits: 07/24/15
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
If it makes everyone involved happy....
It's pretty telling when someone goes out of their way to criticize you when they are responding to a third person relating their experiences.
Or, whenever one makes a mistake, apologizes after its pointed out: but still gets "piled on" with criticism. That shows no class, and it becomes clear that anything you say, (even if you agree), is seen as a threat that must be attacked.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
LOL!!!
you get some experience and knowledge with computer audio and traditional high end playback. Not sure if I'd hold out any hope that you'd come into line with what, (largely), most others have realized, - that good sound can happen throughout several transport types.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
I know much more about computers, audio, and possibly many other things than you will even know!
You have not commented on my SET 45 amp and Bose 901s yet... You are really an audio expert...
Bose 901s-Julian Hirsch made these babies famous. Since we are going down memory lane, how about the Rectilinear III speakers.Julian felt that these were some of the most natural sounding speakers he ever heard.
I think they sold for $279.
Edits: 07/24/15
Hi Steve,
I remember them well. And from the boogie down Bronx. :) The good old days...
Regards
Bob
your posts have never reflected that you know much of anything.....
Namely, comparitive listening. Have you even heard the ubiquitous SBT?
Your highest form of knowledge, is your number of various listening experiences, in both traditional audio and digital file playback.
If you happen to know so much, why are you so afraid to cite even a smal iota of those experiences? Why are your opinions so disparate from most others here?
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Exactly!! All we see is posts about how much knowledge he has but I can't remember a single enlightening post, not single instance of describing experiences of system building. Just a lot of name calling and foot stomping lol.
Amen to that. But then again I can't be bothered with know it all, smug posters who don't post their systems.
Have posted my system many times. Do you really think you have a better audio system, or are a better listener than someone else...
Nonsense. It is obvious to anyone here you have a severe inferiority complex.
My system is no better or worse than one else's.
Posting one's system is simply an expected courtesy and it allows others to get a picture of your tastes and preferences.
I'm no better a listener than anyone else, I just enjoy music immensley, not playing wack a mole with my 'puter.
We can only guess what you have been wacking...
"inferiority complex." You are trippin... LOL
What is wrong with a SET 45 amp and Bose 901s?
Edits: 07/23/15
Don't quit your day job, although it is highly doubtful you have one.
Nothing is wrong with those things. Stop being a child.
Maybe you are actually a child. I have been doing this probably before you were born but it seems that neither you nor your buddy got the joke, and you really know much less about audio than you think.
The combination I posted would not even make any sound let alone be an audiophile system. A 1 1/2 watt single ended 45 amplifier would not even make a hiss powering Bose 901s!
I think this is actually hilarious that you did not realize that this is an impossible system.
Bose 901s one of the largest selling speakers in history, and one of the most controversial need and an inordinate amount of power. You can hook them to the third rail of the subway and it would not be enough power for them. They are also probably one of the worst sounding speakers in a home environment that were ever made, this is audio history that I hope everybody knows.
They are diffuse sounding, pretty much a total mess but just about everyone that ever heard them in the showroom walked out with a pair because of the way they were demonstrated. High-powered amps like a Phase Linear 400s or 700s which came out around the same time, and an audio demo room with heavy carpet on the walls, floor and ceiling and filled with equipment made these speakers sound like the most amazing things God ever created. Everyone who heard them walked out with a pair, but when they got them home to their apartments with wood floors and windows, no reflective corners, and a 40 watt receivers, they began to cry realizing the mistake they made.
I actually met Dr. Bose many many years ago and told him about the experiences people I knew had with 901s. It was an interesting conversation to say the least. I guess I am lucky I did not get sued... lol...
Can you and you friend just please cool it. You might not really know as much as you think... I see you have AR D150s... I actually heard the first AR D76s in NYC in Lyric back room with Mike K. Have you ever been there?
I have close to a 40 year collection of tubes, electronics and speakers I've been enjoying this hobby since my teens. I too much stuff the list, but now try to keep my system is pretty simple.MiniMax+ Dexa discrete op-amps, Aune S16 a real sleeper" better that a few $3,000 DACS I have heard, or a tricked out Pacific Valve NOS tube DAC into a LIghtspeed attenuator. I was listening to Yamaha and NS1000 for a while driven by Hypex amps. I recently hooked up a pair of Celestion SL600s for a change.
I have heard the very expensive amps that your partner in streamers owns compared to the Hypex amps and it was no contest.
I should have known that was red meat hanging! I read it and did not want to get involved. LOL
A free reaming lost.
----------------------------------------------------------------
Big speakers and little amps blew my mind!
You could have said something. :)
And some people feel they are audio experts. lol And then on top of that the are real nasty...
I could not imagine owning a $15,000 pair of speakers with a 6 1/2 inch woofer and then using a bass boosting equalizer. Just does not feel right. Has to add distortion.
I am not even a real big sub-woofer fan. I still own a pair of Janis subs, very low distortion (and one of the only woofers that can sound good with Quads), but don't bother with them much.
This can be a pretty funny place though. :)
Nobody got your attempt at baiting..your joke because it was so lame and quite frankly no one cares.
I honestly can't remember where anyone here represented them selves as authority.
But..now we have a little substance..that was not so hard was it Bobsie??
I will say with sincerity that I appreciate your post. I heard the MiniMax and it as an excellent sounding DAC. You did not seem to believe me what I said I am non judgmental on systems. Dollars spent mean nothing and have no correlation to musical enjoyment.
As much as you say we need to cool it, you should also consider being less defensive and negative towards products you have not heard.
"As much as you say we need to cool it, you should also consider being less defensive and negative towards products you have not heard."
I am not being defensive or negative, and have heard some of what we are discussing... But more so, a through understand of the technology helps.
Not everyone has this understanding.
Of course understanding of the technology helps, but ultimately the ears are what matter most.
The reason much of the CA sector of high end audio is seen as a lunatic fringe is due to the heavy reliance on measurements and "understanding the technology".
What makes your WAV, AIFF, FLAC, ALAC or whatever files sound like real music and make you forget about DACs, computers, streamers etc is what matters. The ear is the ultimate fine tuning instrument.
"The reason much of the CA sector of high end audio is seen as a lunatic fringe is due to the heavy reliance on measurements and "understanding the technology"."
Not really where I hang out. Start reading CA, Jplay forums etc... Zero talk of measurements.
"What makes your WAV, AIFF, FLAC, ALAC or whatever files sound like real music and make you forget about DACs, computers, streamers etc is what matters. The ear is the ultimate fine tuning instrument."
Very true... Always has been... Always will..
instead of trolling about something you read, - which imparts almost no knowledge: especially compared to listening.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Everyone who disagrees with you is a troll.. Maybe find a new hobby...
Bob,
I agree that what you have is a single purpose computer optimized as an audio transport, basically a DIY alternative to a Bryston BDP or Aurender. And as such, the maintenance argument I made doesn't really apply.
Based on his prior posts and setup, I took Abe literally when he said "general purpose computer".
Dave
Not you at all. It is very hard to have a normal serious discussion here on certain subjects due to the lack of comprehension by the streamer gang.
I am still waiting for one to give me some good advice regarding my Bose 901s powered by a SET 45 amp. He claims to much more knowledgeable than me, so I look forward to his insight.
.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Trust me... I have so much more experience than you... It is funny, you are actually pretty embarrassing.
No Thanks, - I can't trust anyone who neither produces evidence, or any cogent argument: then makes false assertions calling things "the same" when a simple photograph proves otherwise.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Evidence??? photograph proof??? false assertions??? Of what??? Did you fall and hit you head? What in the world are you talking about??? LOL This actually is an asylum...
It wasn't you who ever claimed the Bryston BPD mainboard, and the Aries mainboards where the same as PC mainboards.. no...LOL...
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 07/23/15
All hardware will eventually break or have other issues but...
My post is about a software update that crippled the Sony HAP-Z1ES 'appliance' which put the appliance users at the mercy of Sony for a fix. Three weeks in this case according to some reports.
I think if we were able to compare the number of people affected by a botched upgrade like the one you posted to the number of people affected by operating system updates gone awry, viruses and malware, and other common computer problems - the latter would but much higher.
That's a possibility but the savvy computer user can recover on his own and rather quickly w/o being at the mercy of an appliance vendor like Sony for a software fix. This holds true for most such appliances that do not give the user access to the inner workings under the hood so to speak.
As for OS updates gone awry, you don't update your production system (main music server) without first having a tested and proven way to revert back to a previous state. A complete bootable backup works for me. If an OS update or player software upgrade cripples my system, I simply boot off the backup and I'm up and running again in 1-minute, not three weeks.
As for viruses and malware, you don't use the music server in a way that will allow viruses and malware to infest the system. If you do, there are firewalls and scanners for malware and viruses.
So the computer might require a little more knowledge to operate and maintain but you're not left with a crippled or bricked player while you wait and hope that the vendor fixes a software problem for you.
Yes, there are trade-offs:
- The simplicity of an appliance with the downside of being dependent on the appliance maker to fix it when a problem arises or...
- A general purpose computer that puts a lot more control in the user's hands that allows him to recover quickly.
When your music appliance breaks you're at the mercy of others... ...while you wait for a fix.
I'm not sure why some inmates went ape crazy over my comment above. It's factual and not that hard to understand.
The "crippling" in this case was inability to access Gracenote for metadata. This sort of thing happens with application software as well.
Just this month iTunes 12.2 came out and mangled users' libraries. When Apple software has a bug that screws up your music library, which is in a proprietary iTunes database, you are at the mercy of Apple waiting for a fix, are you not?
Unless you can revert to an older iTunes version by restoring your root volume from a backup, and also restore your iTunes library from a backup.
But then again, the HAP-Z1ES supports backing up and restoring your music library too.
It is theoretically possible that a bad firmware update could brick your HAP-Z1ES or similar device and render it unable to do a network update, necessitating a repair trip, whereas a computer can usually be restored from "bare metal". So you have a point there. But I think that is a very rare occurrence.
This sort of thing happens with application software as well.
True. But the point is, with a general purpose computer set up as a music server, you are not tied to a specific application. For example, no one needs to run iTunes on a Mac. Perhaps that was true a decade ago but today we have several free and paid-for music players to choose from. So we're not locked in to a vendor for a fix.
The mangling of user's iTunes libraries only occurred in very specific use cases which I for one would never encounter. But again, no one is forcing us to use iTunes at all.
In the case of a turnkey audio appliance you ARE forced to use whatever software the appliance maker provides and you ARE forced to wait for them to fix it when it breaks.
The choice really comes down to simplicity of operation for those who do not understand computers or do not want to deal with them -VS- flexibility. And part of that flexibility means not having to wait three weeks (or whatever) for a vendor provided fix.
No one is arguing which is 'right' and which is 'wrong', only pointing out the major differences in approach.
No it wasn't: although you tried to make it seem that way after you post was exposed as a Straw Man and troll."When your music appliance breaks you're at the mercy of others.""
No one went "ape-crazy" over anything. Pointing out that you're wrong isn't Ape crazy. And, just like anything else, - it's only very few people who are capable of modifying/repairing their "computer-turned" streamer anyway. No one is going to solder traces on a mainboard, no one is going to repair a broken linear power supply, no one is going circumvent a shite MAC USB bus. Even pulling an HD and installing a SSD drive is something an audiophile isn't going to do.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 07/23/15
If you didn't understand the post and the thread I linked to, you make a good case for being the ideal candidate as a 'music appliance' operator.
You wrote what you wrote, - if you meant something else, - say so.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
If everyone but you understood my post, what's your beef?
Watch what you say... There are vegetarians here...
you're insecure with your solution, so you're grasping at straws to keep up your delusions....
This unreasonable "selling" is unfortunate in that you do have experience, and do try other solutions....
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Interesting comment from a streamer fanboy who insists these are not 'computers' yet chest beats their superiority in a "Computer Audio" forum.
but it is good of you to concede& finally be calling network file players what they are.Again, - I own and run both, and have an open mind: the opposite of you: oddly.
Since I am getting better sound (for now) from my MAC mini, - why are you calling me a "streamer" fan boy?
And as always, - as your posts so indicate, - you know, - yet avoid saying so, - because that's where you LOSE the argument: that this is ALL ABOUT HARDWARE. High-End audio is all about hardware.....
Chop chop...
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 07/23/15 07/23/15
.
network appliance threads here if it weren't so dictated.
And of course, you knew this, - but decided to waste everyone's time, and Rod's HD space anyway...
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
When did you become so contentious? I remember a much more laid back individual about 10 years ago. I think you need a forum break.
Cut-Throat
It's not coming from him? After all, he started the thread contentiously criticizing your solution. (Then obfuscating by trying to assert that posts about your solution do not belong here).But, perhaps your point deserves some consideration. Perhaps there's a nicer way to "call him out," on what started as contentiousness.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 07/23/15
Most reasonable readers wouldn't see my original post as contentious at all. It's factual, backed by an example, not demeaning in any way, and a topic of conversation for computers and music appliances.
Except for a couple inmates who for whatever reason went ape crazy and lost their minds over it, I thought my post and responses by others were pretty civil and benign.
If you don't agree with my post, make a decent argument against it as others have. But please don't go around accusing me of being contentious or a troll just because you don't agree with what I said.
> "Most reasonable readers wouldn't see my original post as contentious at all. It's factual, backed by an example, not demeaning in any way, and a topic of conversation for computers and music appliances."
Abe, I saw the OP, and was about to respond to it when the screen came up, "post deleted by AbeC." I figured you had thought better of it and deleted it, because very few people like to dance on other peoples misery.
Then I saw it pop back up 30 mins later. I guess TL posted a response before the deletion finalized? Damn computers! Better luck next time.
A bigger man might have tried to reel it back in as best he could. Nope, you have buffalo'd all day. For two days in fact.
BTW, your original statement is a Truism. Like; if you save money everyday, and do it for many years, then one day you will have a lot of money. Wisdom for the ages don't you think?
You drive a BMW right? Then I'm sure you know what it's like to be at the mercy of the dealership's service dept.
Not trying to be too hard on you. There are many ways to save face.
----------------------------------------------------------
Big speakers and little amps blew my mind!
It's the threads like this that establish new friendships, and solidify the old ones.
Oh, and if you repeat "there was nothing contentious..." enough times, you may make yourself believe that it is indeed the truth. Don't think it works for others though, looking at the results of that innocent, non-contentious post.
I though this might be helpful...
I'm not quite sure what you're getting at. Yes I posted, deleted, reworded, then reposted. Nothing tricky or underhanded.
Have I said something untrue or 'contentious' to warrant the crazy behavior by a couple inmates who seem to have lost their minds?
If you read and understood my post, your BMW analogy doesn't quite fit, IMHO.
If you reposted then it's my mistake, and I'm sorry if I speculated otherwise.
> "Read the sorry Sony thread linked below."
Woeways us ES owners. We got it rough. Now back to the beautiful music.
I have no idea what "post and delete" is, or why anybody would want to do it, or what is to be gained by it. Have you ever heard of it?
----------------------------------------------------------------
Big speakers and little amps blew my mind!
There is a peculiar dance afforded by this particular and unique forum software, called "post and delete". After you have been around for a few years you will learn how to deal with this. Sometimes this is intentional on the part of the poster/deleter, sometimes not.
One other thing to be concerned about is that sometimes entire threads or sub-threads are 86'ed. This follows from the software capabilities provided to the moderators. Sometimes a highly creative and innocent post gets deleted as a result of "collateral damage" when the moderator felt he had to delete a particularly offensive post. (With experience, you will learn how and when to make your own personal archive of interesting threads where this is likely.)
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Thanks for the heads up.
I'm new, but I have caught on to some of the more obvious tricky tricks. It's funny but strange that people pull them.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Big speakers and little amps blew my mind!
Fair enough.....
I just read through your OP. You're right, - you used the word "server" throughout...
You seemed to imply and extrapolate too far out beyond the one example of the Sony. (But, you definitely referred to Servers only, not network file players).
So it's my bad for extrapolating your point about servers to network file players.
Other folks, as well as I, did make the point that few people are going to touch the hardware, the manufacturer can send updates, and sometimes log into the unit remotely, and people do sometimes have a ton of trouble with their software on their PCs.
But largely the hardware was out of scope from what you said in the OP, my bad, sorry.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
In the context of audio play-back, what's the difference between a 'server' and a 'network file player'?
And is an 'appliance' something I really want to have in my audio chain?
.... between your you-know-what, and your elbow.
In the sense, that you wouldn't know any, as hard as you might try.
As i understand it...Music Servers are more all in one units. They're more likely to have a more typical multi-purpose mainboard, a hard drive, video card, as well as the playback software & (often) a display. Some of them have amps and DACs built in as well, - like the Sonos or Olive.
As opposed to network file players, which typically do not have hard drives, - (one can turn the Bryston & the Aurender N100 into servers by installing HDs, but they don't start out that way), - but have playback software that loads files from an external hard drive, a NAS drive via ethernet, or streams over the Internet.
The SBT, Sonore, Bel Canto, Sim Audio Mind, & Aurilic Aries are network file players.
One can also install LMS, (and of course other software), on a NAS drive connected, - (most typically), - via ethernet, - and that is sometimes also called a server: {but I would hazard that folks just refer to it as a NAS drive, cause more and more people are using NAS for multiple media}.
I don't see much of an issue with the above, and believe that is how those terms are widely used. A "server" stores the files, the player plays them.
I have always been critical of music servers & all-in-one devices, not only for the price, inflexibility in sharing out the files, but for the maintenance reasons that Abe cited in his OP.
I was confused at one point, (maybe by other posts than Abe's main one above), where I thought that the word "appliance" was used to mean a network file player and not a "server."
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 07/23/15 07/23/15 07/23/15
In other words...
As I have a SONOS and a Marantz NA-7004.
Neither of which I'd call more than mid-fi sources.
NA-7004 supports AirPlay, so there's that.
SONOS streams QOBUZ if you tell it you live in Europe.
In addition to the units being all-in-one, (again as it's termed Music Server), the internal HD is a requirement.
In IT Infrastructure I've heard the term "network appliance" used in reference to a NAS drive.
If Abe would've said Server instead of appliance in the title of his post, - I wouldn't have confused it with network file player like the Aries.
I can understand why some high end manufacturers would want to provide an easy all-in-one box that the customer can even ship their CDs to and have the manufacturer load them up for them and ship them back their 1 box solution. A solution like that has never been right for me. People who load all of their music onto their commercial computer's internal HD have built themselves a music server.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
and I don't, I'd likely prefer a stand-alone NAS drive, preferably with some form of RAID configuration that would assure everything is safe and even then, perhaps some off line backup system that only backs up the NAS whenever new stuff is loaded?
A one box solution makes no sense for me as most of my listening today is not even in the main system but streaming Lossless FLAC over the internet to headphones in my easy chair or in the office.
That and spinning vinyl.
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