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I have a Sony STR-DH830 home theater stereo receiver and an older Macintosh 1700 45 watt per channel amplifier/tuner, both of which provide audiophile quality sound. Recently, I have been using my computer more and more for listening to CD’s, Hi quality radio, computer music files and online streaming music /video sources.
While the sound I get on my computer is very good quality, it’s obviously not the same quality as the sound from my AV equipment when using the same headphones (Sennheiser). My computer is an ordinary Dell Inspiron 560 desktop with 8GB ram and, 2.2 Ghz processing speed and Windows 7. Is there any way I can get similar audiophile sound on my current Dell by adding a particular sound card?
If so, which one and if not and I have to get a different computer, which one? Another idea would be to move my MAC 1700 over to the computer and use the amplifier portion of it for playing back the audio from my computer. Is there a way that could be done? Even if there is though, I would think it would still be limited to the audio quality coming out of the computer itself. I could easily do that however since I still would have the Sony STR-DH830 for my home theater system.
Right now, I just use my 22” HD PC monitor for video and am mostly interesting in upgrading the audio on this computer. That's more important to me than upgrading the video although I can certainly do both. I already have an HDTV though and am not looking for another one of those. I am simply interested in something that I can use to listen to high quality music while working at my computer and while using my regular HD computer monitor. Thanks for any feedback.
Follow Ups:
Hi Curmudgeon,
Your Sony STR-DH830 receiver already has a DAC build inside and you are happy with the sound quality that comes from the STR-DH830.
The STR-DH830 has a BD/DVD (digital) coaxial input and also has several (digital) HDMI inputs.
Your Dell 560 desktop (probably) has an HDMI-out.
Given these digital output and input options and before buying al kind of extra boxes too make a digital connection between your Dell 560 desktop and your STR-DH830, I would suggest too: first do some experimenting with the digital input en digital output options you already have.
You might want to listen too this connection:
Dell 560 HDMI out -> HDMI cable -> HDMI in STR-DH830.
HDMI sound quality can be surprisingly good.
Be sure too use the WASAPI (software) output in Foobar when re-routing audio through HDMI.
If the sound quality through HDMI does not meet your quality standards, then consider buying a USB too S/Pdif converter.
Dell 560 -> USB too S/Pdif converter -> 75 ohm digital (video) coaxial cable -> BD/DVD coaxial input STR-DH830.
USB too S/Pdif convertors come in different (sound) quality’s and difference price levels. Do some google-ing and ask asylum inmates which are good and which are bad (I don’t use USB, so I can’t give recommendations first hand)
In all cases be sure too select the WASAPI digital software output in Foobar / Windows 7. You will hear the SQ difference. Also disable automatic GAIN in Foobar. And don’t use any re- or up-sampling by default.
Only use it when your build-in DAC in the STR-DH830 sounds better with it, than use real time up-sampling or up-sampled audio-files.
MAC Mini > Weiss AF1 Firewire interface > Vovox Link Direct SD > Lavry Black DA10 > Vovox Sonorus Direct S > Klein & Hummel O300
I've auditioned enough turntables, CD players, amplifiers, DACs, operating systems, and music software to my satisfaction. At age 63, I doubt I have "golden" ears. I'll take a lot of heat, but here is my optimum system. Everything is free except the PC and headphones. Also, I use no external DAC. I believe any cable affects (degrades) the sound.
PC: HP Pavilion Entertainment
Music player: Bug head Emperor HQ
Additional software: SRS Labs IDT Audio Control Panel, Fidelizer
Music files: WAV 16/44.1 upsampled on the fly to 176.4
Headphones: Sennhieser HD600
Look at the cMP thread down on this same page - what's described there is pretty much the essence of what needs to be done.
If, on the other hand, you decide to follow the advice of those who don't know much beyond "computer audio is easy" mantra - the result will be just like theirs. Which is not to say bad - just not anywhere close to the limits of what's possible.
stop drifting to the negative and folks will listen more.
Nobody else so far reacted the way you did, which tells us that, quite frankly, it's your problem. Thanks for the unsolicited advice to "stop drifting..." - but next time, why don't you keep it to yourself.
Not to mention that I don't really care whether "folks" listen to me or not. Inmates whose opinion I value - they know it all without me telling it for umpteenth time. And for those who continue for years repeat things like "DAC makes the biggest difference", "I can't hear the difference between internal SATA drive and external USB" etc. - my posts won't fix whatever is broken anyway.
Well said. Quite a lot of accumulated expertise is needed to turn a NOS machine at lower cost into anything 'special' and 'audiophile'. Otherwise one gets a bits are bits norm.
....as some will have you believe. ;-)
The short answer is YES and it doesn't require rocket science to get there. A basic PC with some minor OS tweaks and a good DAC will get you there. A good DAC probably having the most influence on the outcome.
That isn't to say some tweaking won't help but to fret over it endlessly is not necessary unless you're into that sort of thing.
There is so much information about prepping a generic computer for music service that it is hard to wade through it. That being said, I agree with Abe, a moderately set up PC/MAC USB throught a good DAC and music system can produce quite good sound.
1) you can majoryly tweak the PC/MAC
- good playback software, allowing memory play
- use SSD only (consider having the music on a NAS)
- eliminating some unnecessary services
- an improved USB 2.0 output card can be very helpful
2) you can pay a lot for the USB cable if you want
- most the difference will be in separating or eliminating the 5v power wire, which is not needed by a self powered DAC
3) the DAC and AMP/Speakers will still make the most difference in the sound.
you get it by buying a Marantz or whatever, and forget about tags, backups of backups, ripping, and all the hassle.
> quite good sound
> you get it by buying a Marantz or whatever, and forget about tags,
> backups of backups, ripping, and all the hassle.
Do you ever take your own advice?
my blog: http://carsmusicandnature.blogspot.com/
What Marantz or 'whatever'?
Depends on the 'Audiophile'. ;-)
Hi and i have a question
when you say " While the sound I get on my computer is very good quality, it's obviously not the same quality as the sound from my AV equipment when using the same headphones (Sennheiser) " what do you mean ?
Are you using the PC as a source from its HDMI out ?
This is what i am doing and the sound is quite comparable with that out of a HDMI of a cheap dvd player, through the same AV amp of course.
Not that big difference.
Kind regards,
bg
Thanks for the responses.
> > when you say " While the sound I get on my computer is very good quality, it's obviously not the same quality as the sound from my AV equipment when using the same headphones (Sennheiser) " what do you mean ? < <
The sound I get on either of my AV receivers has a much fuller, richer sound that the sound I get from the computer (The Mac 1700 is a terrific instrument by the way even at over 50 years old).
The headphones are currently connected to the computer via the 1/8" headphone jack. The HDMI port is currently being used for the HD monitor connection. The audio specs for my computer are described as the following:
"Integrated 7.1 Channel Audio up to Creative SoundBlaster® X-Fi Xtreme Audio (D)
While an integrated sound solution is fine for playing MP3s and CDs, simple presentations, and other basic computing, a sound card can dramatically broaden your audio horizons. In addition to crisp multi-channel sound with maximum realism, sound cards offer high-resolution, low-latency and feature-rich recording for audio enthusiasts and professionals."
I don't think that my computer has the Sound blaster "Extreme" mentioned above but I am going to take the covers off tomorrow and make sure. If it doesn't, I am wondering if the following Sound Blaster card would be good choice for what I want or perhaps spend some more and get either the Sound Blaster "Platinum" or "Fatal1ty:
http://www.amazon.com/Creative-Sound-Blaster-Recon3D-SB1350/dp/B00654PUPA/ref=dp_ob_title_ce
You just need better Digital to Analog conversion. The DAC function integrated into your motherboard varies in quality from one PC model to another. Some recewnt motherboards have much better sound quality than was the case for PCs 10 years ago. However, an upgrade may produce an improvement in sound quality that is significant to you.
The Creative soundcards have a lot of features for gaming. You'd do better looking for a DAC that connects to your PC via a USB cable.
The page linked below lists a number of products. The Audioquest Dragonfly might represent a minimum cost choice for your upgrade.
You mentioned connecting your PCs audio output directly to headphones. In that case, audio quality depends on both D-to-A conversion and the ability to drive the headphones.
my blog: http://carsmusicandnature.blogspot.com/
I don't know about the USB DACs, but they may require hubs over distance.What I do know about is using coax. I just bought this:
http://m.ebay.com/itm/290786571436?nav=SEARCH
Mind you I swapped out the opamp and am making a power supply for it. You may want one that is street ready. Others likely can better advise you on that. Then you'll want this audio card:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B001H4ZCS8/ref=gp_aw_ybh_l_1?pi=SL500_SR500%2C357&refRID=14XN5YB2YKPVVXYEFN13
In the reviews you can find out about loading bit perfect drivers for this card which ensures that the DAC is getting all the information contained on your CDs as long as you rip to a lossless format.
Connect using coax, use Foobar2000 or similar program, and you're set. You can even play SACD material at SACD sound quality levels if you want to buy the gear and learn how to rip SACDs.
You can also get a remote to run Foobar2000 as well as volume etc.
Best Regards,
Lou
Edits: 11/20/14 11/20/14
IMO, sound quality comes from the DAC you choose. You can download Foobar2000 streaming software for free, which allows you to stream digital out your computer's USB port to a USB DAC. You can buy a USB DAC for as little as $250. Or you can spend as much as you want for a better performing DAC.
I used to have a Windows 7 PC with Foobar2000 as my music server and the sound quality was every bit as good as any CD player. After a year, I switched to an Oppo BDP-105D Blu-ray Disc Player, which doubles as a CD player, SACD player, and a music server. Since my audio system is integrated with my video system, I prefer using my Oppo BDP-105D for audio with my HDTV displaying my audio music files.
Good luck,
John Elison
I would bet you could get sound quality comparable to the level of that particular receiver for about $250.
You could spend $2500 on an audio interface for PC audio, but I would think your money would be better spent on a dedicated amplifier and comparable interface, so your components are better matched.
Cheers,
Presto
Agree with Presto. It is not easy to get real audiophile quality from PC systems; one needs to accumulate knowledge and spend quite a lot of time. Those who say they can for $1000 have not included the time, effort, and cost of accessories.
$1,000? This is a hobby, I don't count the time. DAC was $60, p/s will be under $50 for it, the switching PS that came with was noise city. Upgraded opamp $15. Total $125. Sound card $30
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B001H4ZCS8/ref=gp_aw_ybh_l_1?pi=SL500_SR500%2C357&refRID=0XTCNMSDK3EMJ2M4THRD
Cable less than $50 for sure, I think I paid less than $20. Stick a fork in it unless you want a remote, that might cost a couple hundred, I went crazy here bought a NOS remote and paid near list for it, something like $300 I think, but that is hardly necessary. I also bought a 2T hard drive for $70? I could have used spares but I wanted everything audio on one drive.
Bottom line, for less than $130 you are in the door, if you want really high end sound and can DIY, you are at $200. If you want a street ready DAC, I hate to think what that would cost!
Best Regards,
Lou
I maintain that you cannot get audiophile quality for what you said you would pay
Digital is digital, 0's and 1's. That DAC is 24/96. It can do SACD, clean up the PS so it's quiet, to get your black background, swap out the dark BB opamp, and you have high end analogue. $30 sound card with bit perfect drivers gets you to the DAC. What more do you need? I'd prefer a tube output, but 2 AD825's on a Brown Dog adapter biased into class a smokes any brand name DAC I'be heard to date. I'd be surprised if there aren't technically more impressive DACs out there, but I'd be shocked to hear one that smoked it. Frankly I had big name DACs and Sony ES players with tweaked analogue outputs sounded better. I have been out of the loop for a few years, but you are not going to much better IMO.
Best Regards,
Lou
Edits: 11/20/14
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