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In Reply to: RE: Yet another manufacturer going with the OEM StreamUnlimited solution posted by Dave_K on October 3, 2014 at 15:21:18
The folks at Sonore claim that they're using their own proprietary and custom mainboard built in Sweden: (or was it Swiss-y-land)?
The SA Mind has a way different case footprint: is the TFT board that you're referring to really small?
IME, power supplies, connector types, internal damping, defeat-able LCD, playback software etc, CAN be very, very, important. Almost ALL of the products have differences in those areas.
These players also have differences in features like some have USB outs and some don't. Some have the capability of playing files from USB thumb drives.
I am curious about that board, & want to see it. Going to hunt around the internets ......
Thanks again.
Follow Ups:
The Simaudio MiND is based on the Audivo OEM board and software. Here is a link:
http://www.audivo.com/AV/hifi-streaming-emas.html
You can see the Audivo board in the middle of the MiND in this picture:
http://www.moremusic.nl/moon/180_mind_inside.jpg
An intro to the StreamUnlimited alternative is here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCL4c61AmBg
http://www.streamunlimited.com/support/downloads/product-leaflets/stream700-v25.pdf
It's pretty easy to recognize who is using StreamUnlimited or Audivo by looking at an interior picture, or by looking at the app, or both.
The BridgeCo chips that are used by StreamUnlimited, Audivo, and the mainstream Japanese companies are an embedded computer on a chip specialized for network audio. These have an ARM processor, system controller, video, audio, USB, Ethernet, and any other interfaces you need on one chip. It runs Linux. Their current products are the DM860 and DM870, with the former having Ethernet only and the latter including a Wi-Fi radio on the chip. A PDF describing the DM870 is here:
http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/DeviceDoc/dm870db.pdf
The audio equipment manufacturers can decide which of these features and interfaces they want to offer to the end user based on whatever marketing rationale they come up with. Simaudio took the minimalist route and offered only Ethernet and Wi-Fi with digital out in a small package, which is why the Audivo board in the MiND has several connectors which aren't connected to anything. Whereas Accustic Arts included the optional 3.5" display from StreamUnlimited and digital input and USB.
I think this is one of the main reasons why BridgeCo's products have become ubiquitous:
Apple working together with BridgeCo to launch AirPlay
Anyway...
The real reason why I posted was that I think I have a hypothesis why you don't see more transport-only options like the MiND. Most audio equipment manufacturers don't have the resources and expertise to design embedded computers nor to develop the software stack or apps. What they bring to the table is expertise in audio circuit design, power supply design, DACs, etc. These are the things that have the greatest influence on audio quality and it's where the audio equipment manufacturers add value and differentiate themselves.
If you take away the analog outputs, then what value do high end audio manufacturers really add? BridgeCo provides an embedded computer, reference/evaluation boards, operating system, software stack, application SDK, and example applications. Then companies like Audivo and StreamUnlimited produce turn-key solutions based on the BridgeCo platform and offer hardware design services and customization/branding of the apps. If all you want is an Ethernet/Wi-Fi to S/PDIF converter, it's basically done. If you take a look at the Simaudio MiND for example, there is hardly any Simaudio engineering expertise to apply in that product. They even use an off-the-shelf wall wart power supply.
As a further example, consider the set of products shown below, ranging in price from the $20k Ayon S-5 at the top to the $900 Pro-Ject Stream Box DS at the bottom. These are all based on the same BridgeCo based streaming hardware and software platform, they all have the same 3.5" displays, and more or less have the same Android and iOS apps with different branding and what looks like minimal customization. Where they differ is in the DAC and analog circuit design, with the Ayon including a high end tube rectified power supply in a separate box and a tube output stage, while the Pro-Ject makes due with a wall-wart supply and a pretty generic looking op-amp output. Ayon can make a high margin on their product because there is a lot of high end audio engineering in it; the OEM SteamUnlimited stuff is a relatively small part of what's offered. Pro-Ject can't because all they've added to the StreamUnlimited modules is a very bare bones DAC stage that they probably didn't even design.
The same companies could offer transport-only streamers, but they would basically just be the same OEM solution in different casework, and then it would become a race to the bottom on price. That's my hypothesis on why you don't see more products like the Simaudio MiND
Ayon S-5 ($20000)
Chord DSX1000 ($13000)
Accustic Arts Streamer ES ($5500)
Krell Connect ($4000)
Atoll ST200 ($2500)
Musical Fidelity M1CLiC ($2000)
Pro-Ject Stream Box DS ($900)
dramatically different.......
What DAC was used to show these dramatic differences in sound quality? Were there any reclockers or conversion boxes between the computer and the DAC?
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Spot on.
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