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Note: I wrongly posted this in Digital and can't delete it but it belongs here.
I discovered that I have an old Sony CDP S7000 DVD/CD player and decided to check it out for selling. I honestly didn't know!
Connected it to a computer system which has Realtek HD audio and played a CD thru it, comparing this with a ripped PC version using Audition CS6 and Foobar as player with WASAPI output.
The Sony sounds vastly superior, with that concert hall make-believe whereas the ripped version has little life in it. Both outputs are from the same preamp into the same audio chain.
Music is BBC Last night at the Proms, with very familiar material. In fact the music thru the Sony reminds me of my recent visit to the Royal Albert, although there is a degree of hf digititise with less dynamics and sense of space and resolution etc.
As the Sony won't sell for very much, I shall now keep and use it for audio/video. No new CD player costing a couple of thousand pounds (and more) has the construction and quality of finish of the Sony. The remote itself is a luxury item.
It'll be interesting to use it to play upsampled CDs thru my dCS upsampler and various dacs.
Follow Ups:
I might be accused of repeating myself, and if so, - apologies in advance.
I think that it's a good idea for more folks to have these kinds of experiences in comparing vinyl & CDs/SACD disc spinning with commercial computer digital file playback. Especially if they're interested in pursuing SOTA SQ.
The top tier manufacturers recognize that USB/CC playback does not equal the sound quality that they get from spinning discs and continue to sell, and work on improving traditional transports. I think that the VRDS-NEO was pretty revelatory to many folks that all disk spinning transports are not equal: and that there are still improvements to be made in disc spinning playback.
Most people in this forum are not interested in pursuing SOTA SQ, - and that's fine: one can get really good sound out of optimizing commercial computers. But, - when one starts comparing Meitner's/APL/DCS transports to the very best optimized computers, the Meitner etc. etc. sounds better.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
I used to mod the 7700, which is even better. It was a world-class transport and the modded 7700 is still in use by many. I still get requests, but I don't mod anymore. I gave my last one away. Computer audio is better, at least mine.
Edits: 09/01/14
is modded as well, although I didn't remember this at the time of the post.
The drive does look good and I am not going to make the effort of ripping out boards to see what I did.
You need to put my comments in context when you talk about SQ relative tp your stuff.
no one here understands what you are doing.
If you are using computer analog output, duh, it is bad (OK not bad but no so good).
Can you clarify?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."
nt
I believe what I (we) hear is the DAC. I use an outboard DAC with my PC and it sounds much much better than my old on-board sound card. The sound is still different than my CDP, however, my CDP can be used as a transport player feeding and outboard DAC. When I use it as a transport player and feed my PC's outboard DAC the sound is identical to a flac file made from the CD and played through my PC.
Just sayin'.
JE
No doubt if someone took the time to find the best sounding CDP it would sound different and better than using a PC as source.I would never have ripped my CDs via a PC had I intended them to only be used on the system with an optimized CDP choice. I would have recorded their analog output to CD then ripped them to the PC. As it stands when using the PC as a source I now need to find the best sounding DAC instead of CDP.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
Edits: 08/31/14
> No doubt if someone took the time to find the best sounding CDP it would sound different and better than using a PC as source.
I don't think it should sound different if you connect the PC to the CD player's DAC. I ripped all my CDs to my PC using EAC and my digital rips sound identical to the CDs as far as I can tell. Of course, my CD player consists of a separate transport and DAC, and I used the same DAC to play my digital rips. Anyway, I don't notice an audible difference and I don't think there should be any difference.
Best regards,
John Elison
"I don't think it should sound different if you connect the PC to the CD player's DAC."
Yea ok but what should be and what is are often two different things. If all you need is a cable from a PC to CDP DAC it won't cost much to find out.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
> If all you need is a cable from a PC to CDP DAC it won't cost much to find out.
Well, I've already found out in my system as I've explained. My CD rips sound the same as CDs.
Thanks,
John Elison
No need to repeat yourself. Now the question becomes are both inputs actually identical or is there some reason why the system or the listener is unable to resolve the differences?Your experiences prove or mean nothing except to you.
At least in this unusual case, where a CDP allows a digital input, most of us can try it out and reach our own conclusions for the cost of a cable. (Me repeating myself)
Give me rhythm or give me death!
Edits: 09/02/14
If you connect to the CD player's DAC it may well sound worse, because of the way clocks are handled. There is no need for a one box CD to have an effective anti-jitter circuit (e.g. double PLL) because when it operates as a one box device the DAC runs off of the local clock and the transport is slaved to it. When an external source feeds this DAC then the DAC has to be slaved to the external source. The worse sound is the result of the poor system architecture devised by Sony and Philips (SPDIF).
If you want to compare transports (including computer transports) you should compare two box configurations so as to avoid "apples to oranges" comparisons.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Well, I didn't hear any difference in my system and now I have replaced my DVD player, CD transport, DAC, and computer music server with an Oppo BDP-105D, which consolidates all those functions into a single component.
Best regards,
John Elison
This is a false statement. I am not going to explain why since he has consistently taken this mistaken line over many posts and debates.
"I am not going to explain why"
This remark reads like pure bluster. I doubt you have the ability to explain why.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
You take the cheapest implementations of spdif and complain about the defacto standard setter. The same can be said of any digital or analog interface. Cost and proper design and impedance matching dictate the resulting SQ, not the method.
I hope Sony/Philips pursue you for your many unqualified pronouncements.
Done right, spdif is fine and your constant posts about theoretical clocking is not a sound basis for SQ judgements.
When I switched from using a CD transport to a computer I didn't hear any difference at all. I began using Foobar2000 to stream my ripped CDs into a USB input on the same DAC that my CD transport was connected via I 2 S. I ripped my CDs using Exact Audio Copy (EAC). They both sounded the same to me. It's just a heck of lot more convenient switching from one CD to the next with the click of a mouse rather than having to get up and change CDs.
Best regards,
John Elison
So you are saying that this is a better transport? You are not comparing to your main system, are you?
regards
Bob
So, it's a combination of transport and audio processor.
It is, of course not an indication that the Sony is better than transport thru my audio PC and DACs.
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