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Hi folks. I check in from time to time to see what's new with pc audio.
I'm looking for a stand alone unit that's easy to use and excels in sound quality. I see the Squeezebox Touch is discontinued.
I prefer a wireless setup if possible with a handheld/portable screen. I prefer not to leave the tv on for screen usage.
I have been reading for days and do not understand all the abbreviated pc lingo. I'm definitely not a techy.
I'm simply looking to replace my cdp with pc audio and continue to use my full sized speakers and a tube amplifier.
Any suggestions or help? Any new advancements?
Thanks!
Follow Ups:
At first I thought that the PC audio alternative would be daunting, too, as was acclimating to PC"S themselves. You just have to embark upon a short learning curve, and you"re off to sonic bliss.
I bought a PC, learned that the preinstalled Realtek High Definition audio player upsampled audio to 24/192, made that setting, bought a Schiit Bifrost unmodded for $350 when they first came out, and never looked back.
http://mindseyemusic.blogspot.com/
For me I've got a HD and an OPPO BD95 but I can't stand looking at the TV to use it.
This sounds good cause I want to listen when I'm using the PC - Foobar, YouTube and iTunes I use often and the PC interface works for me.
For you the Smartphone app might be just the ticket.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
It won't hook to a network, so it depends on your computer for a connection with it's own transmitter. It's a No-Go for me.
Cut-Throat
One side hooks to a USB connector on the PC. The other side plugs into your stereo. My PC connects to the network. There's smart phone apps (I can't comment on their utility) that can run apps on your PC apps if you want a hand held device. YouTube, Pandora, iTunes, etc. all can access your main stereo with this thing.From your objection I assume you would want a wireless hand held device with a network connection? Correct?
If so - I can tell you what I wouldn't like about that (as well as the smartphone apps can be had for the NAD). The applications running on the device just aren't the same as the applications running on the PC. I like the full blown applications on the PC - I've not seen a smart phone app that I liked as much as the full pc app. Matter of fact the internet apps that the OPPO BD-95 uses stink.
If not so - please elaborate.Thanks
Give me rhythm or give me death!
Edits: 08/14/14
Nope, I want a Squeezebox Touch like Device.... I don't want a PC in my Listening room. I want the device to hook to the network with an Ethernet Cable, So I have access to my music and a device that will stream from the internet as well.
I currently use a Squeezebox Touch which is the best solution I've seen so far. I am hoping that someone will make an 'Audiophile' type Squeezebox touch someday.
This NAD is basically a DAC... I've already got one of those that I can hook my PC to if I want.
Cut-Throat
"Nope, I want a Squeezebox Touch like Device.... I don't want a PC in my Listening room. I want the device to hook to the network with an Ethernet Cable, So I have access to my music and a device that will stream from the internet as well."
Sounds like you want an AppleTalk with a built in mini-monitor?
That's the way I feel about my first system - matter of fact I don't even want the Ethernet cable or any streaming - just a small iPod or Squeezebox Touch device giving me access to a hard-drive containing my music collection. I'm using an iPod with an external DAC - but 160 GB is kind of limiting when my collection is approaching 1 TB.
In my lab the PC is 12 ft. from the stereo as the crow flies and almost 30 ft away as the cable runs. It's foolish for me to try to upgrade the PC system when I can just tie it in to the stereo system. The NAD seems like a perfect first pass solution.
"This NAD is basically a DAC... I've already got one of those that I can hook my PC to if I want.
It's a wireless DAC with smart phone apps so one doesn't have to be at the PC to control their music. Seems to me it might do everything the Squeeze Box touch could do without the wires.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
No, you don't understand..... You've got a wire from the PC to the NAD DAC....The Squeezebox is a marvelous device. It is very small and silent.. No PC FANS blowing! It sits right next to my DAC... the DAC and Squeezebox take up less room than a CD Player and they are silent.
I have wires from my DAC and to my Pre-amp and to my Amp. The 1 Ethernet wire to my Squeezebox is just part of the stereo System (Oh you can run the Squeezebox wireless, but I choose not to for added stability). (You do have wires to your speakers, amps, Preamps etc. Right?)
You may not want streaming, but I do! --- The squeezebox streams Spotify which has over 20 Million Tracks. More than I would want to assemble and Store.
I control my Squeezebox with my phone/tablet and their are no FANS in my listening room. So, A squeezebox Touch trumps this NAD player all the way around. The NAD is nothing more than a Wireless DAC that I would have no use for.
Cut-Throat
Edits: 08/14/14 08/14/14
".... You've got a wire from the PC to the NAD DAC...."I don't think so - I've got a short wire from the USB port to the NAD wireless transmitter sitting on top of my PC. Then I've got short interconnects from the NAD receiver/DAC to my stereo system.
Smart phone apps can control the PC applications from any where without any wires.
"I control my Squeezebox with my phone/tablet and their are no FANS in my listening room. So, A squeezebox Touch trumps this NAD player all the way around. The NAD is nothing more than a Wireless DAC that I would have no use for."
My lab system, in the same room with 2 desktop PCs, a laptop and an Android device I don't agree. Why in heavens name would I want a SqueezeBox Touch?
In my other system I find it hard to believe a low powered notebook/tablet connected to a harddrive, and the ethernet if desired wouldn't be a better alternative than a SqueezeBox.
Don't get me wrong - I like the SqueezeBox Touch on just about every level.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
Edits: 08/14/14
You seem to be satisfied with this set up, I would not be.
The bottom line is that the SBT is a much more feature rich device.
Cut-Throat
Like I said previously if I can use the Squeezebox Touch as a harddrive controller to select music from a directory structure it would be an ideal device for my bedroom (main) system. Too bad it's not being manufactured anymore. But even if it was still being manufactured it's features and functions would be redundant in my Lab system.
The NAD on the other hand sounds perfect for my lab system but worthless in my main.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
I'm kind of surprised that more people who were interested in the Squeezebox Touch
approach to PC Audio haven't looked into getting "another" Digital File Player. The SQB Touch contrary to public knowledge, has'nt been the "only game in town" for a while now.
Google (or whoever) search Auraliti, Bryston & the new HAPZ1ES from Sony.. I would only
go the full "PC Audio" route if I knew all the in & outs of setting up a dedicated "music" PC.
There is a saying among those involved in PC Audio that "everything matters" if you're
looking for the best results. I'm nowhere near "cocky" enough to think I'm close enough
to not have to go through a longer trial & error phase than I would care to at this time.
What's that dopey PC tag line people like to use these days ? Oh yeah YMMV (I warned
you it was dopey; well if you have any amt of intelligence why state the obvious ?)
This entire audio hobby is dopey and YMMV if you believe in every crazy audio tweek or ritual. So PC audio alone is not dopey. It's the entire hobby.
He,he,he.. You're right about that one, but that was'nt the obviousness I was actually referring to. Unless we are all communally operating off of 1 brain everyone's mileage varies
somewhat on any humanly act we can generate !
It comes down to "Social Media" seems to encourage blending into the "Social Wallpaper"
of trying to prove how average we are by stating YMMV instead of YACMIYD
That would be "You're A Cliueless Moron If You Disagree" . Maybe it's time for "Unsocial
Media" to make its debut (yeah, I've had a really bad month because I spent a bit too
much on some "debatable" necessity of some car maintenance) (Sorry, I know,wrong forum)
Do any of them stream Spotify and other internet radio Apps?Sadly all of the ones I've looked at DO NOT Stream Internet Apps Like Spotify. So, they are no Solution for me. I'd have to give up over 20 Million Tracks of Audio.
And As I said Originally, "No one has yet to show me a better solution than a Squeezebox Touch"
Cut-Throat
Edits: 08/12/14
If you are looking for a Squeezebox like solution, the word is “streaming audio player”
Today almost any audio company has one or more models.
You won’t find one as cheap as the Squeeze but that probably the reason Logitec killed it
An incomplete list can be found here: http://thewelltemperedcomputer.com/HW/DAP.htm
I do think Bluesound is the heir to the Squeeze.
As they are streamers, they are playback only. You do need a PC to maintain (rip/tag/backup) your collection.
The Well Tempered Computer
Jeff; your first message with a suggestion didn't come through. The response started with "Like this"
that's what I get for responding with my phone! In theory, I'm with Cut-Throat on the touch and medium priced DAC. The problem is availability and support. I'm thinking laptop> DAC/converter> preamp scenario. The DAC/converter will be the defining factor in SQ.
Edits: 08/11/14 08/11/14 08/11/14
You can still get them on e-bay, Used and refurbished.... There is a reason that they sell more for retail...
Cut-Throat
I've definitely read many good reviews of the Touch. I've also read where audiophiles prefer custom sound cards and DACs or a custom Dac after the Touch. So confusing.
Yes, I use a DAC out of the Touch. That's another reason the Touch is Great. It has digital outputs so that you can choose your own DAC.
Cut-Throat
So you are wireless after the external DAC? How is the signal received at the preamp? Sorry if this is a clueless question? Thanks.
No, The Squeezebox Touch is Wireless and Has the Digital Output into the DAC, which sits next to it. The DAC has its analog outputs plugged in to my pre-amp.
Cut-Throat
That makes sense and sounds so simplistic compared to using a dedicated pc.
I've been reading up on streaming audio services like Spotify. Many say these services don't offer CD quality for critical listening. If this is true; I am then stuck with ripping all my cd's? What do I gain?
"I've been reading up on streaming audio services like Spotify. Many say these services don't offer CD quality for critical listening. If this is true; I am then stuck with ripping all my cd's? What do I gain?"
I'm no expert on the Squeezebox Touch but I recall hearing you could attach a harddrive with your hi-rez music and use the SBT to send it to a high resolution DAC.
Here's a link to it's tested high res performance. This thing would be great in my bedroom system (actually my main system) if I could buy one new. The vast majority of my collection is 16 bit.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
If that matters to you - ie. you think it's sonically significant (I think it can be) or you just don't want to tie up a PC as a music server this is a significant gain.
Give me rhythm or give me death!
I mostly agree with Cut-Throat . My CD 'rips' usually sound better than Spotify Premium but the streaming service is so convenient and the audio quality isn't bad. I sometimes have it running in the background for hours while I work from home.
But if you want to 'stream' your own CD 'rips' to the Squeezebox or other streaming audio player, you will still need a PC, software to 'rip' your CDs, disk space for storing your ripped music files, a backup disk or two for backing it all up, and discipline to do the backups and test them occasionally.
Just my 2-cents worth but if you're going to need a PC anyway, why not just attach a DAC to the PC and presto! you now have a PC music system. Add the Squeezebox for a secondary setup for streaming to it in another location.
Of course, this all depends on your situation. If your PC and audio system are conveniently located in the same listening area it's a breeze to add a PC music system. If you need music in another area of the home, streaming to something like the Squeezebox is ideal.
I had my main listening setup in the basement with Mac Mini, DAC, preamp, amps, speakers, etc. I had a Squeezebox up in the kitchen attached to a small integrated amp. That setup worked out great. When I was in the basement, I would listen to the main system. When up in the kitchen/family room I would fire up the Squeezebox.
Good luck with whatever approach you take.
Convenience. And I have ripped all of my CDs. But I also use Spotify Premium mostly and I would not Bet that you can tell the difference between my CD ripped Losseless and Spotify Premium.
BTW - Just because a CD is streaming a lot more bits doesn't mean its a good recording. Spotify has a ton a 'remastered recordings that sound better than the original ones played Lossless.
Cut-Throat
What cdp are you replacing and what is your budget? When I replaced my Wadia cdp, I found that I had to spend comp money to achieve like SQ. I could not find that "giant killer" for cheap.
Cambridge Audio 840c and a G&D Transforms UCD 1.
$1500.00 or less. Thanks!
It's a fine "learning tool" until more streamer transports get manufactured. (By my count, there are really only 4 or so of these).
If you don't already have a hard drive, and you want to, (and don't have an external DAC) & SPDIF cable to use with the SBT, - then you'll really blow through your budget fast).
Later, after you're familiar with all of this stuff, you can expand into stuff like NAS (network attached storage: hard drive that is ethernet/networked).
With the Squeezebox, - you get a (not too bad DAC), a USB port to attach an USB hard drive directly, - tons of Internet radio, music playback apps.
Mind you, none of this stuff will likely sound as good as some of the "better" $2000 CDP players. Yes, Internet radio & apps do not sound as good as CDPs.
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Well I've certainly got a lot to think about. I enjoy cd quality but streaming any genre of music is very appealing. I've always liked satellite radio in the car. A nice mix is always nice. I'm still intimidated by dedicated pc's and external storage. My surround receiver is set up for Pandora and the likes. I'm curious how streaming would be through the Pioneer SC61.
Is that even though the quality of Internet Radio, (and I'm including Pandora, Live365, Soundcloud, Sirius), is that you get far, far, far, more stations than you ever could with an antenna, and you have less trouble & its associated static with dialing in a station/app.
In that sense, - I'll take it for what it is, - and be happy with no static, - which I've always hated. As a songwriter/musician, - radioplay, - and its associated, (for lack of a better word), fascism, - has always been a problem anyway. And, what comes out has always been compressed.
I don't know about streaming with the Pioneer; but a dedicated digital file transport, (whether it's capable of streaming internet radio or not), does offer up a lot of flexibility and convenience.
It is very hard to come up with a scalable solution that is both cost effective & sounds awesome. IMO, the reasoning behind separate components for separate functions, {as is tradition with high end audio}, still offers great wisdom. The genius of the Squeezebox is that it is, (almost), only a transport... A product like the Sim Audio Mind, (and hopefully it will have more and more "sister" products soon), plugs right in as a higher quality Squeezebox replacement. (Recognizing that there are a small number of feature apps that the Mind currently doesn't have available, but is/will soon be, capable of).
Cheers,
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
With a $1500 Budget, You could easily get a Squeezebox Touch for around $400 and a Quality DAC like a Schitt and Stay well under $1000. Many Great DACs for under $500.
Cut-Throat
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