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In Reply to: RE: Have you heard Ligeti's Violin Concerto? IMHO the real deal, doesn't descend into compassionate cacaphonism. posted by jdaniel@jps.net on May 07, 2016 at 08:15:20
They've been turning up in the big piano competitions for quite some time now. I have the Aimard complete recording, supplemented by performances of selections by Yuja, Babajan, et al. I also have the scores to all but the last couple of of them. I haven't heard the Violin Concerto however. BTW, I don't consider Ligeti a post-Webernist by any means.
So maybe Roy is right: I should define my terms. By post-Webernist, I mean a composer (like Boulez for instance) who uses the 12-tone principles of the Second Vienna School and extends them not only to cover pitch (i.e., the row itself), but also articulation, dynamics, rhythm, speed, etc., so that large parts of the score can almost be said to be "pre-composed" even before the composer starts to notate the composition! Of course, Webern himself was already well on his way along this path, a good example being the second movement of his Variations, Op. 27. Oh, and one other requirement for a piece to qualify as part of the post-Webernist aesthetic: the resulting composition has to be REALLY ugly too - that's a requirement! ;-)
Follow Ups:
I'm a fan of the Ligeti piano etudes too. As for Webern, I had the opportunity to perform his Five Pieces for Orchestra in college and was struck by how much it evoked Mahler, except fragmented, as through a kaleidoscope. I think even a dedicated Webern connoisseur wouldn't want to be limited solely to his soundscape, and I would say the same about Mahler.But even using your definition, there was a whole lot more going on in the 20th century than that, as you know. One example I gave, George Crumb, was originally influenced by among others Webern (I was surprised to learn), but developed in a very different direction. And his students include Jennifer Higdon and Christopher Rouse, major American composers today. Also look at another 20th century composer influenced by the second Viennese school -- Leonard Bernstein. Again, a very different direction.
Edits: 05/08/16
Well, I need to listen again to George Crumb and try to see what influences are evident. Thanks.
And, yes, I know that Stravinsky wrote a couple of 12-tone works. But I think that when people talk about Stravinsky, those 12-tone pieces usually aren't what they mean.
At this point in time no sides need be taken really.
Composers can use the technique, strictly or loosely. Or not.
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