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In Reply to: RE: Suggest you try Felt Mountain by Goldfrapp (nt) posted by watts on January 31, 2017 at 19:09:14
After Felt Mountain, Goldfrapp still delights critics, but goes more mainstream for several CD's, then somewhat hybrid, and back and forth. Head scratching for some, but quite excellent in sound quality and song writing overall. Something for every mood. Well loved overseas. If you do give Goldfrapp a listen, hope you enjoy the music as well as the sound.
Cheers!
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
Follow Ups:
Splurged for a CD copy from Amazon during coffee break minutes ago. Though used, for $3.99 shipped via Prime, one can easily afford to be this "adventuresome" :)
Play loud, late at night, no interruptions, lights turned down of course.
Hope you like it.
Cheers!
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
Found the ordered Felt Mountain CD by the door when we arrived home close to midnight on Friday. LOL, this qualified for "late at night" but the audio system was in "TV mode". As such, the woofers were hooked on and the playback would have to be via the HTPC. (The more proper Music-PC would take too much time to boot and warm up the DAC.)
Then, there's the small matter of living in apartment. High volume was out at this hour. Low db's would have to do. Ok, then. quick transfer to the HTPC and then on to a few pieces for the few minutes conceded by my wife as she laughed "boys and toys!"
LOL! Darn this stuff sounds like the bastard child of mutant New Age music and what?, perhaps a lady singer whose name I can't recall right now. Not my usual cup of tea but still, I liked it in its own context. In fact, even within the initial playback contraints, I got some good impressions.
With (boxed) woofers on, the impressive bass was really the first big impression. Most pieces reach below the natural reach of my MMG's and for a sec, I feared I would not be able to enjoy much of anything without the woofers. Then, I remembered that the woofers' power amp was boosted in "TV mode" and figured that all would be fine next day, with no woofers. (My mutant MMG's are modded to, among other things, do better on bass than usual without such aid).
After a few minutes, I promptly settled for "Oompah Radar" and for "Human" as keepers . The former will become a demo feature. The latter, an additional test recording for my Maggies.
That night, the "Oompah Radar" piece seemed to include all of the best imaging, soundfield & soundstage available on the full album. Unfairly aided by the woofers being on, it still already said: "tomorrow you'll SEE me even further out these walls!" I have a few recording that already do it, major surround outside the room, I mean. Yet, this one is among the few that can do a very special trick. It can place not just the surround sound field but also some strong localized bass "inside" my neighbor's apartment, straight out BEHIND my right shoulder in this case. Would my highly modded MMG's -- alone -- do this next day? "Nah", I remember thinking, "they are good but not THAT good."
Then, just past midnight, came "Human". Oh brother, what a scare! I recently reglued some wire segments on my MMG's in preparation for an upcoming session with the 2 Telarc 1812 SACD's I have. At the moderate levels I began listening to "Human", its main synthesized sound effect made it seem like the wires were off again. Knowing my system, logic told me, it is NOT mild slapping or loose wire, it is just the damn soundtrack! I then wondered where the hell had I misplaces my headphones, to confirm it. I only found them today...which left me wondering all night long.
Then came today; I only had 2 hours to continue listening on this Saturday morning. I had left the power amps on overnight. I "rewired" for fully passive> direct, just the MMG's from the 2 power amps fed via USB DAC from the dedicated music PC. This is my usual setup if listening from the PC. (a "flat" bass woofer configuration can be switched on with another stereo power amp, but I left this off like I normally do...too little time to test with them on anyway.) After checking via the headphones, the noise in "Human" was just the same in character. Very well, let's crank the Maggies up.
Alright! The Maggies stayed together through all of "Human" even at max (0db, passive). Sure "Human" is a torture test of sorts, more so at high volume. It is also demostrates what mechanical intermodulation can do in planar speakers. At max volume, some elements get audibly distorted during the worst of the main sound effect. One can actually hear some of them "warble" slightly, including the singer. The top highs get partially hidden and/or lose some sparkle. Amazingly, the whole thing still stays "musical" enough. (Max average volume hit at least 88db, bass peaks passed 105db in the 55hz range. At higher frequencies I saw graphic peaks flash beyond 110db.) I do plan to revisit this piece to measure and record the behaviors.
However, the more musical "Oompa Radar" did not get much measured -- except to verify bass db's. I simply sat back an enjoyed the wholesome, giant soundfield. Even at max volume, the strong bass, now only from the MMG's this time, returned...and remained composed...and invaded my neighbor's apartment. (yay, the woofers were not needed!) The piece projects grandly to all areas outside the room, and still retains more than enough of a credible cohesive soundstage behind the Maggies. This soundfield is also wide beyond all the walls, even behind me. The largely synthesized nature of the mix won't create much of individal 3D imaging but, at the very least, it does layer some of it behind the plane of the Maggies. The singer does keep her composure.
Thanks for this suggestion. I still have to explore more of it in the next few weeks once I have time. However, any joking aside, it has both enjoyable moments and impressively useful mixes. It will be played here, for both reasons.
I'd expect it to be useful to other planar owners, as well (and few CD remain, only used, via Amazon) since none of my test playback levels are really needed to get results.
Yup. It's like wearing headphones while sitting on a subwoofer.
Quite a history on the musicians and producers before Goldfrapp was formed. Quite the combination.
Happy listening!
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
Sounds like you already got your $3 worth :)
I just looked on amazon.ca and they had one for $ 0.39 plus $3.49 shipping! I ordered it.
There you go Watts, you beat me :) Mine was really $3.99 because of the Prime 2-day delivery.Now, about Norah Jones, I read your comment last night. This morning, I went for my weekly long walk at the Swap Shop. This is a huge local kind-of flea market here in South Florida. Figured I'd look around to see if the CD would show up used for sale. Typical dumb me, I failed to observe the title of the CD -- which you did include in your posting. So, I bought the only one I found. For one buck, it was a good risk.
Well, there's something to be said for good ol' dumb luck; it turned out to be the one! I'll let you know where the voice shows up relative to the other tracks in a few days.
Edits: 02/05/17
Regarding images emanating from a plane in front of the speakers, my experience has been that for this effect to be created, tube electronics are pretty much required. But then I've never heard some of the real expensive Pass etc. stuff.
Edits: 02/06/17
Yes, BDP24, that would have been my own impression until 2009. That's because tubes are so good at creating ample soundfields easily (not necessarily defined soundstages or 3D imaging, which they can also do well at times).However, in 2009, a set of "factors" colluded to make my MMG's recreate this phenomena while driven by just a Denon receiver. This forced me to question quite a few things that I had always thought were "a given".
Amusingly for them, in a matter of days I began to ask visitors to point to where they perceived certain elements on the soundstage. The majority of them chose the very same points in 3D space as I perceived them. (The few that did not, actually helped me to understand part of the factors that allow the phenomena to happen.)
Once I was sure that I was not "hearing things", I think I posted something that year about one of the pieces that projected sound. I am at work now but I may be able to find it later.
Edits: 02/06/17 02/06/17
I saw Pink Floyd "Pulse" and Pink Floyd "Is There Anybody Out There" Listed as CDs with Q-Sound.They were both recorded live.Does anybody hve those discs and know how they sound?
I can't speak to those ones, but I hate to admit that I have the Madonna Immaculate collection, and some of the sounds are surround. Doesn't make me want to listen to it again though :(
And Bryan Adams 18 till I die is surprisingly on the list too. I listened to my copy of it and heard no special ambience. It doesn't say anything on the credits to the effect either.
I will also confirm that the thunder sound in Amused to Death does is fact come from behind my head! and the horse with bells (track 8) travels in front of the speaker plane by a few feet.
It was not until Thursday that I could spend some quality time with the Norah Jones CD. The summary of the delightful session:-- Real nice recordings of her voice and the ensemble in an ample enough soundstage (wall-erasing wide) and at times with solid 3D imaging. There is also one outstanding surround-sounding piece (more later).
-- Pretty much always, her voice is solidly centered, endearingly warm and textured, and pretty much forward. However, at no time did it go forward of the plane of my speakers.
-- "Cold Cold Heart", which you perceived as perhaps passing the plane, did not do so in my system. It generally behaved as the rest of the songs in space. That said, this rhythmic song features a very active role by the bass player which is mixed in at the center, right behind Norah's voice. I bet that this can trigger a perceived forward-of-plane perception of her voice, in some system configurations.
-- More to the point, my system is being reconfigured. In its previous config, a few recordings did easily project into that forward-of-the-plane center spot that you perceived Norah in. Off the top of my head, I can only remember Lee Ritenour's guitar always doing so. This was in one of the pieces in the "Amparo" album. In fact, I believe that a strong bass and the robust piano are playing behind it. If you have it, the piece may be called "Joropo Peligroso", if my brain cell is still on (it's 2:30am).
All in all, it actually was a curious evening. While I began with Norah, most of the night was then devoted to Tchaikovsky's first movement of the Concerto No.1 in B-flat minor (played by Igor Zhukov, piano; an oldie but mouth-watering performance.)
This was done for my listening pleasure while also measuring its SPL peaks at full blast volume (0db passive). After a few hours of this very enchanting performance - despite several repetitions - I was also very satisfied that I had captured the measurements with the microphone.
It was close to midnight and, suddenly, a particular song from Norah's CD begged to be played again. And so, I ended the night's pleasures with "The Long Day Is Over".
When played earlier in the evening this piece took sound-field ownership of the full room, much into the adjacent room to one side, and well into my neighbor's apartment to the other side. And I mean front to back. It is significantly different in imaging from the other pieces in the album. It also is a beautiful piece. And it is yet another example of a recording mix that planars can use to display surround sound impressively.
Edits: 02/11/17
It is not hard to understand why this album has sold over 10 million copies :) Not often a "pop" album has been recorded well enough to appeal to audiophiles as well.
Unfortunately won't get a chance to listen until later this week. I used to play them both a lot but always in the background, not in "my chair."
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
I ordered Pulse because I like P.F. and their LPs and CDs usually have been very good sounding.Hopefully it will be here by the weekend.
Got a chance to listen to first two songs on Pulse. Holy smokes. Can you say "guitar". Really fills the soundstage. Crowd down below and all the way past the speakers. Poor Nick, his drums in the background. Vocals laid back a bit whereas Roger Waters would probably be more prominent if he was present. Nice sax imaging.
I didn't feel as immersed as Amused to Death in regards to Q sound. But then it's studio vs live and you don't get the black backgrounds with crowd noise present.
The talent and song writing. Was nice to revisit and feel those shivers again.
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
I had a chance to listen to one of the two Pulse CDs as well.I agree with the above review on it being well recorded with good imaging.Most of my Pink Floyd is on vinyl and I found that the vinyl renditions have better low bass than the Pulse CD.
"In The Flesh" has more bass. Otherwise, like Pulse, same good imaging. Again it's "live", can't really say excellent imaging in terms of being immersed. I checked out "Ummm Gumma" live CD out of curiosity. Realized my search was heading in wrong direction so wound the session down. Except for "Ummm Gumma", I don't have any live PF or RW on vinyl.
Cheers!
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
Do you have In "The Flesh" On CD? is it good?
In the Flesh is good. Pulse CD and Video typical Pink Floyd/David Gilmour with the music and imagery at the forefront. In the Flesh CD and Video more dramatic in the usual Roger Waters way. It's interesting to hear the same songs delivered differently. I'm a big fan of Water's solo stuff too. They are nicely done.
Roger Waters is surprisingly less camera shy In the Flesh" and it's nice to see. Video highly recommended as well.
Cheers!
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
I will look into Flesh.My wife and I listened to some of the other CD in Pulse which are DSOTM selections.It also sounded quite good.Sitting in the middle seemed to be more critical than usual for some reason for the best imaging.We also played Alan Parsons Turn of a Friendly Card & Steely Dan Gaucho lPs which were both excellent for sound stage & imaging.
nt
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
Look forward to comparing some notes next week.
Cheers!
Ed
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
I have/had a copy of Pulse on CD and a copy of the video. One of them went mysteriously missing. I can't remember which. Will look around over the next couple days.
Cheers!
Jonesy
"I know just enough to get into trouble. But not enough to get out of it."
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