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In Reply to: RE: time alignment ... posted by andyr on May 15, 2015 at 23:22:36
Andy, you put the finger on what was frustrating me during tests, for years. The simplest manner in which I can say it is this: I have to stay in analog after the initial Digital-to-Analog conversion. Furthermore, if I ever add a turntable again, I'd never want the signal to undergo conversion to digital, at all.
No manner of DSP could help me because it needs to reconvert to digital. I tried many DSP computer-based programs and most types of High Rez algorithms. They solved timings...even facilitated changing slopes & xover points. However, they always spoiled other things dearer to me.
After many experiments, the stark reality hit me. Unless I found a key to analog "time travel", it was better to align the drivers physically as best I could. The surprise was NOT that this worked as far as timings, which was a given. The surprise was that I did not have to filter the Maggies feeds at all...they are running full-range, which I was hoping for but would have bet against (mainly due to some peculiarities here).
The net result is tonal & textural seamlessness to a degree that I never expected. I am now trying to figure out more fully what is helping the most. Of course, had driver timings not been aligned well enough, I'd be drowning.
Follow Ups:
I would say you could have a problem with your current placement, JBen?
The - what, 18dB ... 24dB? - LP filter on the subs causes a timing difference. If you are running your Maggies full range it will be less (the way I understand it) than if you have a matching HP filter on them ... but the subs need to be in front of the main speakers, if you want to use physical time alignment to delay the mains, rather than DSP.
In my situation, the subs have to be in the front corners of the room - so I already have a physical time delay, compared to where the panels will be, as well as the filter-induced delay. So DSP is the only choice.
Regards,
Andy
Andy, I expected much more trouble getting time integration. Subconsciously, however, I did some things right (that's me not admitting to the reality..."dumb luck" : - )) .
Oh well, one design "accident" was that I made the boxes 6" deep. I coulo explain, but the long story short is that it was for other reasons. Yet, this wound up allowing me to place each woofer right in front of each MMG. (Less than one inch separates them.)
At the frequencies involved, this is good enough to "help the cause". It does allow, for example, for some gorgeous textures on bowed bass strings to be better heard. They become stronger but do not lose their rosin-impregnated texture vibes in the process. LOL, you may take these things for granted on the Frankies right now. Me, I need to strenghen their volume without their losing their personality...hard work it is.
One other thing may have helped much. Yes, it is 24db/octave, though I also got commendable results with 12db using a pair of cheapo filter boards ( <$18US) from China. The specs for he 24db low filter system I ended up with (UK-design, Chinese made) read like a dream solution for me. It is still under test for a couple more days and I am asking the supplier a few things. I'll look up the link when I get home and send it to you and Satie. (I am staying with friends tonight.)
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