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First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment.

69.65.69.236

JBen

In Reply to: RE: Phase coherence posted by Davey on April 02, 2015 at 09:40:11

Davey, neither the day nor the week, for that matter, are proper for me to express my feelings about the manner and style of your comments.

I can say that -- on my book -- Satie's input did not warrant being called what was said. I can also say that Jim's ficus tree discussion did bring a good thing or two to the table, as well. And so did Pictureguy here, along with others.

My hope and prayers are that you can review these comments of yours -- and analogous ones in the past -- and find more constructive ways to say things. Your effort in bringing out the best of what our collective experiences may have yielded, could distil quite a few gold audio nuggets, more fun for all...and more enjoyment for you also.

Follow Ups:

RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. - Satie 22:42:33 04/02/15 (5)
I don't have a problem with Davey blatting his horn at me, but thanks for the sentiment. I am well aware that when I don't specify "electronic" on "crossover" he would be free to interpret it as either the electronic or the acoustic result and that he will inevitably interpret it so that it would grate on him and require terse and severe sounding responses. He's the pro and I am the dabbler so I appreciate him correcting me when I am not specific enough or appear to be just plain wrong. That it comes with the occasional kick in the face sort of scolding is ok. I just wish his replies had more explicit explanatory content and not had riddles and mazes.
- RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. - Davey 22:55:58 04/02/15 (4)
  Well, you might remember I gave you a long, multiple-post (off line as well) explicit explanation of your misunderstanding of the Sanders cable A/B topic awhile back. Was I successful at convincing you?? :)
  Maybe it's possible that riddles and mazes might spawn more objective thinking and less falling back to entrenched "audiophile ideas"?
  I don't necessarily enjoy banging my head against the wall trying to convince somebody who doesn't want to be convinced. Sometimes I throw my hands up and sometimes I don't. Sorry about that.
  Cheers,
  Dave.
  
  Edits: 04/02/15
  - RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. - Satie 07:29:39 04/03/15 (3)
    You don't need to convince me. What you are doing is educating all of us. Whether or not I end up agreeing is immaterial.
    I continue to disbelieve in the idealized source models for current and voltage behind the Sanders test.I still think that it is a better idea to do the test with the cable connections disconnected and connected at both ends when switching from one cable to another. Even if the assumption of idealized source is maintained then the results would still be more definitive.
    - RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. - Davey 09:59:04 04/03/15 (2)
      Some things (and electronic audio equipment) in the real-world can function pretty close to a theoretical model. (In this case a voltage-source.) However, it seemed that was a premise you couldn't accept so I understand why you continue to disbelieve.
      
      The incorrect analysis about current splitting/sharing and various other conclusions were formed after you'd run off on a tangent. I made an attempt to bring you back but wasn't successful. Oh well.
      
      I can't disagree with you that doing an actual physical switch of the cables might be more definitive...maybe...but by how much? Regardless, that option wasn't in the original premise of the Sanders evaluation technique. In fact his WHOLE objective was to set up a configuration where you wouldn't have to resort to that. :)
      
      Discussions like all of these are of limited value if an audiophile can't agree to accept basic engineering principles. I find this somewhat amusing/ironic in your case since you are an engineer. :)
      
      Cheers,
      
      Dave.
      - RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. - Satie 10:18:36 04/03/15 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. posted by Davey on April 03, 2015 at 09:59:04
        
        We were always taught to keep in mind the simplifying assumptions and approximations we are using in order to have a useful equation and to make sure they apply where we use it - and if not then how to determine by experiment how much of a fudge factor should be used. Also, we were taught that actual results matter more than sticking to the application of equations. That is why where there is a chem E there is a lab nearby.
        
        RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. - Davey 10:40:08 04/03/15 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. posted by Satie on April 03, 2015 at 10:18:36
        
        Well, did you actually perform the Sanders experiment and produce some actual results? :) At least I'm basing my opinion on a solid electronic engineering principle and previous/actual/similar experiments along those lines.
        
        Maybe considering some alternate (non-audio) examples might persuade you. Off the top of my head, how about the power distribution system in your home for example? (Think about that one a bit.)
        
        Anyways, WAY off topic for this thread. I'd still like to learn of some solid (incontrovertible) information regarding the "i" configuration of the 3.7's.
        
        Cheers,
        
        Dave.
RE: First Your "Total nonsense" to Satie, now your "ficus tree discussions" comment. - neolith 14:55:00 04/02/15 (2)
JBen,
IMO Davey's comment about the ficus was not off-base. I refrained from commenting on that post but I can assure you that the presence of a ficus (real or fake) will have no effect on the room acoustics. The "ficus effect" is an urban myth. I did not read all the comments in the thread but unfortunately the OP got bad advice and bought a 2nd ficus. Davey also did not post because I guess he felt like I did that the subject was trivial. Perhaps the OP should have posted on the Tweaks forum where this kind of thing is more acceptable.
As far as his reply to Satie, I agree it was a bit blunt but he was correct and IMO Satie should not take offense as Davey said nothing negative about him. He only disagreed with his statement. I have to say that both Satie and Davey are valuable contributors to this forum and while Davey could have been gentler in his response, the facts remain regardless how they are expressed.
I don't think Davey will change his style and if you don't like his comments, just skip over them. I suspect to some extent that's what Satie does.
BTW before I get flak about the ficus, here is a picture of my room.

�

�
- fake plants out the wazoo - wazoo 22:13:40 04/02/15 (1)
  They look better than the bass traps they conceal. They also hide some of the actual diffusors. I bought them to improve the room, but not from the standpoint of acoustics. I'm perfectly satisfied with the artificial plants - as decorative devices.
  
  Dave is a no BS kind of guy. I respect that. There's nothing I'd rather know than the truth, but we're all irrational in more ways than we'd like to admit (I obviously include myself).
  
  By the way, my cables are routed across cheap insulators that I spray painted. It satisfies an anal-retentive desire for neatness, as well as discouraging careless walking in that area of the room.
  - RE: fake plants out the wazoo - neolith 09:10:20 04/04/15 (0)
    Yes, if you look closely you can see some absorbers (DIY with Roxul 60 and burlap on wood frames) behind the pseudo-plants. I would have put real plants in the room but with my horticultural talents, I would have a lot of leafless twigs in pots within a very short time.
    �
    
    �

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