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In Reply to: RE: What the world needs is a good 10-12" LF driver for horns !! posted by Rafaro on January 31, 2016 at 12:41:55
Hello Bill and groupIn my modeling of 10-12" driver sub woofer horns the limiting factor in producing high SPL DEEP bass has always been the Xmax more than the power tolerance of the driver. This negates the advantages of 10-12" drivers... the sturdy the cones, the good power tolerance with 3" or greater diameter VC. There has been, over the last 20 or so years, improvement in driver design. The use of 2 or more points of magnetic interaction with the VC by using 2-3 magnets gives a stronger push to the cone but Xmax has seen little improvement. Experimentation with driver suspensions has shown me that there is potential for several inches of Xmax but the difficulty has been in maintaining magnetic flux linearity along the contact point(s) of the V.C.
A compact but expandable subwoofer horn cabinet 1/2 wavelength at 35 Hz with a 10" driver has already been designed but the driver requires an Xmax of about 30mm for maximal performance. Manufacturers have not yet reached this potential that I am aware of but maybe somebody knows different??Regards to all
Rafaro
Edits: 02/03/16Follow Ups:
I've not found 12-15mm xmax insufficient. A good horn will easily deliver 6dB more output than a direct radiator, so 15mm in a horn is the equivalent of 30mm in a direct radiator anyway. There's also the matter of throat distortion. There does come a point where the throat pressure is so high that all you'll get with more excursion is distortion, as well as the potential for shredding cones.
Good points Bill but easy enough to increase throat volume which will reduce distortion, pressure and cone shredding. And imagine what a 10-12"driver with 2-3 inches of Xmax will do in a 1/2 wavelength horn !!
Rafaro
When you increase throat area you lose sensitivity and increase ripple. An optimal horn for the LAB 12 has only 142 sq.cm. throat area. And as it would have 132dB maximum output to 22Hz I'd call that sufficient.
Hello Bill
When is "sufficient" enough for live sound?? For me, in live sound, speakers can never have too much output. When I noticed that a 1/2 wavelength sub woofer horn can put out up to 5 dB more than a similar 1/4 WL that was the end of 1/4 WL sub woofer horns for me. In my cab design it only meant adding two feet in depth but would require 4 or 5 of the 1/4 WL HORN cabs to match itīs output. (Please note that the output in subhorns increases about 5 dB when the freq reaches 1/2 WL). So excuse my compulsion for the ultimate efficiency it means less to carry but from a manufacturers point of view it also means less to sell.
Rafaro
Rafaro,
Let's do a "think back". Back in the day (late 60s to late 70s), it was cool to have a giant PA system, 'cause that was a badge of achievement. I'm talking about local/regional/national bands.
Then, someone got the idea that hauling a couple of truck-fulls of speakers (and setting them up), was stupid and a waste of money. Enter Meyer Sound. High output, high efficiency, low distortion. In 1980-81, I tried to promote Meyer Sound speakers. Could not sell 'em. They were expensive, and bands still wanted big over-sized P.A. systems, 'cause they were cheaper and cool.
:)
I have several Sonic Impact amps based on a Tripath chip. I took the amp to Klipsch headquarters in Indy and one of their engineers tested it. It put out 6 W/ch. with low distortion. He was impressed. Too bad Paul Klipsch didn't live long enough to see one. I certainly would have taken one to him in Hope when I was there in 1985 if it had even existed then.
It cost me 27 bucks and sounded really good. I put AA batteries in it, and plugged a Sony Walkman CD player into it and SOLD my 1977 Khorns with that demo in about 2 minutes. Blew the guy's mind, to put it mildly.
I still use one for curving drivers, since it's really portable and with a $20, 1A Radio Shack wall wart, it works great for that purpose.
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