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In Reply to: RE: BC 8PE 21 8" midrange driver...................112 USD ea. posted by Cleantimestream on June 30, 2009 at 07:55:05
The Morel 9" is a vary nice woofer but it is not a 90db unit. as above can your sub reach any higher than 30HZ this would open your search a good bit.
Borus
Right now I am using a ScanSpeak 7" Revelator driver to cover 30-2750 hz. I cross them at 2750 to a 91 db/watt MBQ titanium mid tweeter and then cross that at 10k to the ribbon. I thought I might try to get the crossover at 3-4k just to keep the mid tweeter out of the female vocal range.
So yes, I could run a lower crossover any where under 200 hz, I generally prefer to set my subsonics below 150 hz since these are big 12 inch Peerless XLS models which don't do mid-bass very well.
So I could run something 150 to 2750 and change nothing else....
150 to 3500 hz would be even better. The speaker needs to be ultra fast and detailed. I need to keep up with the ribbons or the magic collapses.
Hope this helps.
"Music Matters" Help support our schools music programs.
He was asking for advice.................first things first............do not go by what the speaker manufacturer says for efficiency ...........at best it is a guesstimate........resistors are a part of my life building speakers. Personally, I care not trying to achieve SPL below 32 HZ. Had the gentleman mentioned he was shooting for 95 decibels the recommendation would have been Another BC driver ........MOST important would be information on if he is using closed box/infinite baffle VS bass reflex/tuned port/transmission line. I only WISH the BC 8 inch was 98DB {more like 95}> The cabinet is the hard part~~~~~~> Polyurethane construction adhesive {sorta like gorilla glue liquid nails}for 1/2"and 1/2" baltic birch glued together {superior rigidity coupled with slight air gap I perceive as beneficial}. Elmers wood glue and brass screws via pre-drilled pilot holes {gorilla glue for the pilot holes} Am presently experimenting with cork/baltic birch/aluminum sandwich.
"The Sound of One Hand Clapping is Crashing by Design" HKM
Baltic birch is a wonderful material. Sandwiching the material with aluminum or other material sounds great. I often thought it might be fun to cut up old newspapers and use an acrylic or building glue and coat the inside with about 1/4 inch of the stuff for resonance and hf attenuation.
While my box is a bass reflex design at this time. I really want to build another set of boxes and use a HE midrange that is ultra fast. I really need speed to keep up with the ribbons or the magic will collapse.
My current Scan Speak Revelators are only 86db per watt but are very fast and warm.
Cheers!
"Music Matters" Help support our schools music programs.
I understand what you are saying...............is why I will not part with my Quad ESL 63's...............nothing like film diaphragm drivers. The B&C's ARE fast but only up to 3000............although the specs have them starting to drop off around 5000................ I prefer 1st order crossover's which limit my driver range {I have to set crossover into a tighter bandwidth} and make having top flight speakers a must. Another problem I am beset by is I like low watt tube amps {the only SS I own is a Bedini 100/100 Class A} so I do not have the flexibility you have with driver choices {Watts ARE cheap but, I am picky about that 1st watt like Dick Olsher made mention so many years ago} Scan Speak were always a cut above with their drivers.
"The Sound of One Hand Clapping is Crashing by Design" HKM
I love the Quads, I used to sell the Martin Logans. For me the speed and accuracy of the electrostatics were their best selling point.
I wanted to get that in a dynamic driver that could have some serious xmax capability.
Do you have a favorite source for the purchase of a B&C and which model would you recommend for say 150-2750 hz.
My Bedini 150MKII is modified with Black Gate caps in the electrolytic positions. John Bedini modified this one with Sampson electrolytic power supply capacitors.
On the coupling cap I am using a Dynamicap bypassed with a Russian teflon FT-3 0.10uf 600v piece that really airs out the amp. It sounds amazing at about 110 watts per channel sliding A/B.
Yours has all positive feedback and pure class a operation. It has a very tubelike sound to it from my memory. Low output tube amps, especially an SET design can be very seductive. The lack of feedback or carefully chosen feedback can really allow the midrange to come through unscathed.
Thanks for you feedback. This is very helpful information. I hope others will chime in as well!
Cheers!
"Music Matters" Help support our schools music programs.
Hello Sir! Would you please give me John Bedini's work/home? phone #?.................Have been trying for months to reach him and am unable to reach via Email or phone. Kind Regards.........Ken
"The Sound of One Hand Clapping is Crashing by Design" HKM
B&C 8PE21 8" Midrange sourced from parts express. The reason many people like horn drivers is there is NOT a lot of cone movement in proportion to other drivers hence LOW distortion {almost like we are shooting for a speaker with no moving parts..............ala electrostatics which is why they have to be so big to play loud and or deep} The less a driver moves................the less distortion can occur ........contrary to what car speaker manufacturers would have us believe. 20 HZ is 20 cycles per second ............... I am not sure my eyes can witness a diaphragm moving back and forth 20 times in one second...........and that is for the deepest bass most guys strive to achieve for complete bandwidth. Here is where I make my compromises........{even Paul Klipsch did} as my Khorns only go down to 35 hertz. For efficient bass to 20 HZ the cabinet would border on encompassing half the room. Someday I will install Altec 511's for the all important midrange in the Khorns. My idea was to hand off the driver I mentioned above to an Aurum Cantus G3Si Ribbon. I lose the ambience from a dipole design but all in all gain the SPL's and dynamic range of Horns.............everything is a compromise.
"The Sound of One Hand Clapping is Crashing by Design" HKM
Hmm... Bedini 100/100 is one of a nicest SS amps I heard.Bassy , warm and with decent tonality.I borrowed one from a friend.The amp was old and PSU really needed update but still sounded surprisingly good.My friend have tons of other amps but he didn't want to part with this one ;0)
I have a 2 pairs of unused B&C 8E21E drivers from parts express still in boxes gathering dust if anybody is interested.I wanted to swap one pair for faital M5n12-80 without much of luck.
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