|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
71.67.135.213
Are you impressed when a manufacturer keeps a model in its lineup for over a decade, or are you more impressed with rapid development?
All my gear was designed in the last five years with one exception, my Cary SLP98P tube preamp. It was designed in 1998 and still holds a place in their current lineup. Not much to change I guess. It works great. It's not their best preamp but they haven't found a way to replace it at its price range. The SLP 05 (ten years running now) sits on top and is quite a nice model.
What other products have sticking power because the builder can't easily improve it, and doesn't need to?
Follow Ups:
... as a company that 'updates' their products every 6-12 months puts me off from buying their stuff.
d
Edits: 07/06/15
It impresses me if I like the sound of it. But I don't hold anything against the new product but the new product will be compared directly against the stuff that I like that has stood the test of time.
My Audio Note J has been around for 23 years under the Audio Note name and was based on the Snell Type J 15 years prior. I bought them in 2004 and felt they were easily the best standmount available. Became a reviewer - heard pretty much every standmount speaker since moved to Hong Kong and looked around and said - gee I may buy another set of AN J speakers!! I went with the E to be "slightly" different. But listening to ATC and Harbeth that have sold for many years it would be difficult to say I have heard a lot of new speakers that sound "better"
The added bonus of a speaker that sells for 20 years is that if you put your 15 year old speaker on the used market - like a 15 year old 40.1 or AN J or E - the prices have gone way up over the years and so you put your speaker up at 50% of the current new list price - "heckuva deal" for the second hand buyer - but you may have ONLY paid 50% of the new list price 15 years ago - so in my case I can sell my Audio Note J pretty much for what I paid for them.
So umm I like what have amounted to 11 years of music enjoyment for free. That doesn't happen with speakers that change models every 4 years - the older version will be deemed inferior because it needed to be "fixed"
Lastly - models that change often can sometimes cause problems if an when you need parts. They may not make that in house or modified tweeter anymore so lots of luck getting it repaired - and the price may be more than buying a whole new set of speakers.
I've never encountered a product line that changed constantly getting consistently better.... Updates tend to be "hit or miss". It also strikes me as a "lacking of confidence" of the designers in their own efforts.
There are exceptions, generally smaller outfits that do updates based mainly on customer feedback.
"a "lacking of confidence" of the designers in their own efforts."
Todd, I don't think that's quite the right spin. I designed hobbiest consumer electronics for a decade or so in a similar market to ours both technically and demographically. And the users were definitely just as passionate about their toys as we are about ours.
There were several drivers for consistently doing new models and I think they hold true for any product that uses evolving technologies and expanding knowledge:
1. The perception of progress.
2. Actual progress.
3. Product line management.
And, I believe that these are forces for good for the users, dealers and producers. At least in the long-term. Hopefully a unit that you buy today will, overall, outperform one from say a decade ago. But that doesn't mean that the old one isn't still largely as good as ever and might actually be significantly better for a particular individual or application.
As far as "design confidence" goes I have total confidence that my designs were the best I could do given the inevitable constraints of time, money and knowledge. The latter being the big one, every new design is an interesting learning experience and the most interesting data comes from your users. "You are doing WHAT with it?"
Perfection is a limit, not an achievable specification and it's shape evolves. If your new gadget works "better" for most folks than your previous ones and than your competition's that's usually a good sign.
In the final analysis the important thing is maximizing the user's happiness-hours, pretty simple in concept really but fuzzy in practice.
Best, Rick
Sennheiser HD600
It's been in the lineup for almost 20 years, and is a small change from the HD580 before it.
It was there well before the recent explosion of headphone and portable audio interest, and it surpasses almost all of its successors and competitors, in particular for long-term comfort and true balanced neutrality.
Something else: I'm not sure the highest end Apogee planars have ever been replicated.
I've had a pair of HD600s for a very long time, and I've found no reason
to replace them - though the Audeze planar cans do tempt me.
As re: the Apogee planars, I heard them once for about 15 minutes and
remember being mightily impressed (I do love planars and electrostatics,
and have found few box speakers that can compete, the best I've heard
being Avalons).
... I think one can only be impressed with design longevity after the event or want to buy a product which has been around a long time before they buy it. Or those who buy used gear.
I am impressed with audio equipment I like the sound of. Some lasts a long time and some does not.
A product might be in a company's line-up for ten years but it means squat to me if I don't like the product to start with.
Smile
Sox
I've always placed a premiumum on good basic designs from companies in it for the long-haul that maintain a long-term commitment to advancing those basic designs, and making updates available so that your original investment is never completely obsolete. After all, I drank the Linn Kool-aide, didn't I?
What impresses me even more is a design that holds up long after the manufacturer has dropped it from its product line-or the manufacturer no longer even exists (at least in its original form). For example, some of the gear from Quad, Audio Research, Mark Levinson, Magnepan, Spendor, McIntosh...and, I'm sure, others that don't come immediately to mind.
Msybe, maybe not. A manufacturer has little control over large electronic components companies that may just decide to stop making an integral part that is necessary to produce gear in their lineup.
No. A great product will stand the test of time.
"No."?
Given the rest of your post, shouldn't that be "Yes"?
Longevity, per se, is of little consequence. Performance, tried and tested and found to be valuable, is a determinant quality of note.
Thus well-designed, high performance products (which are good value for money) will tend to sell well, and therefore be useful to continue to manufacture, from a business point of view. But its the performance which frequently (if not exclusively) is instrumental in this success, for many classic designs.
Lots of things can go wrong for a business which might frustrate sales. Quality of product/service is only one (important) element of a business, overall. Trust your ears - they're your best authority in audio!
Big J
"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."
Bose has proven that longevity can sometimes be a bad thing.
...and, importantly, also, are companies that have longevity themselves. I like knowing that the manufacturer of my equipment will be around. This plays an important role in the companies I chose to buy from: Pass Labs, Magnepan, Marantz.
Post a Followup:
FAQ |
Post a Message! |
Forgot Password? |
|
||||||||||||||
|
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: