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In Reply to: RE: RMAF 2014? posted by Frihed89 on October 13, 2014 at 08:43:58
Linkwitz doesn't sell loudspeakers, but he does sell the plans to build the LX521, one of the best sounding speakers I heard at the show, for $150. You can purchase a kit from Madison which includes everything you need, all the drivers, the active crossover, and the pre-cut panels, for $3,058. You can also purchase two 5 channel Emotiva XPA-5 amps, for $1,998.
For a little over 5k, and some of your time, you can own a world class speaker and the amplification to drive them, which in my mind is pretty damn significant, considering there wasn't too many speakers that impressed me as much as these did, and those that did, cost 10 to 20 times as much.
In the Mega buck world of High End Audio, The Linkwitz LX521 restores sanity, and certainly readjusted my perspective on what one could expect from a modestly priced loudspeaker.
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Follow Ups:
I certainly enjoyed the Orion's a few years back at Axponia. Without question one of the most enjoyable full range set-ups being driven by Pass Electronics. A room you didn't want to leave. I would expect the same from this design. If only it could be a bit more attractive.
Link to Stereophile LX521 and LXMini coverage at 2014 RMAF: http://www.stereophile.com/content/rmaf-2014-reichert-Sunday(all text removed per JA; also removed jive paraphrasing because it offended one brotha).
Edits: 10/15/14 10/15/14
Summing Up
I have not tested or even briefly listened to every high-end loudspeaker out there, but of all the speakers known to me none equals the Linkwitz Lab LX521 in my opinion. I have been to a few audio shows fairly recently and auditioned the most highly touted speakers there, and after each listening session I just shook my head, wondering how they could charge so much money for such obviously canned, unlifelike sound. It’s as if the designers had never heard live acoustic music in a concert hall. Siegfried Linkwitz has not only established a new paradigm but has also proved that throwing money at each component of a speaker design, and then charging the consumer with a huge multiple of the cost, is not the way to go. Instead, the simple and cost-effective principle of the “spectrally neutral radiation pattern” rules!
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N/T
Is Aczel saying it's even better than the Fourier?
Am I the only one here that finds the "paraphrasing" of JA racist and offensive?
Just curious.
... tedious, boring and untalented.
One sentence would be OK, one paragraph is way over the top, entire post - is just plain silly.
> Am I the only one here that finds the "paraphrasing" of JA racist and
> offensive?
And childish. All I am asking is that material from Stereophile not be
quoted in almost its entirety, as it originally was from Herb Reichert's
comments on the Linkwitz room at RMAF. We may give readers free access to
our content, but that doesn't mean others are entitled to steal it.
John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile
Even if you include a link to the original, as you have done here, please
do not repost this much content from Stereophile on third-party sites
like the Audio Asylum. A sentence or two is almost certainly fair use;
two long paragraphs is almost certainly not.
Thank you.
John Atkinson
Editor, Stereophile
Pity about the looks!! awful!!
An ugly speaker that sounds good will look pretty after awhile. A sexy speaker that sounds ugly will be be seen as ugly after awhile.Indeed, plain and boring and ugly speakers that last is a pretty decent indicator that they probably sound pretty good. They're probably surviving on their sound not their looks.
Edits: 10/15/14
My wife would not agree, an ugly speaker will stay an ugly speaker.
Maybe they sound better than they actually are as you would not expect such ugly speaker to sound that good?? :)
Those speakers could certainly be made to look better than the basic forms shown in the photos. The cost-to-performance ratio would be rather handily destroyed that way, of course.Taking a cue from the Decware archives, something that looks like this might be the alternative using butt ugly PVC pipes and fittings...
Edits: 10/15/14 10/15/14
The edges of plywood don't do anything for me either and I would agree that much can be done about the looks. The top baffle takes a little getting used to but given the choice between great sound and looks, I'll take the sound any day. If I want furniture I'll go to the furniture store.
A fellow named Bill Schneider did wonders to make them look quite good. Here is a picture of his LX521s as well as a link to his build documentation. I think his web page has been a real asset as well as a benchmark to many builders.
Linkwitz labs also has this link to some others who have a different look. Some are quite nice. I actually like the looks of them and have all along.
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/LX521/PhotoGallery.htm
Especially for those ugly bass drivers.
Fundamentally as ugly but with a nice finish.
I could live with those quite easily, especially considering their sound.
The biggest issue I have is amplification. As good as they sounded with the XP5's, I'd like to use something a little more high end, but that could get quite costly with 6 channels of amplification. Just curious what other LX521 users are using.
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One word: Hypex.
I'm currently using a pair of Channel Islands D200 mk. II's which use the Hypex chip set.
I'm quite happy with the sound, but at 4k per channel of amplification, it would be too expensive to use with the LX521. Which Hypex amplifiers are you referring to?
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Sunfire 5 channel amp that's been out of service for a while and I'm looking for another one to match up with it for the 521s I'm building. A secondary plan is to use the Sunfire for the 4 woofers and get a Bryston or something similar for the mids and tweeters. From the people I've talked to there seem to be a lot of people mixing amps and being perfectly happy with the results. You're right though, the amps are an outlay of cash to consider. IMO I think Mr Linkwitz is using those Emotivas to prove a point. Chinese amps aren't in my future though. I've been burned on Chinese quality issues enough that I stay away if I can.
I suspect that the baffle shape has to do with managing diffraction effects. However, it's quite likely that another shape can do just as well, so for those folks who are considering the basic design, don't limit yourself to the specific shape. But be mindful of any serious issues your newly-thought-of shape might introduce.:)
Edits: 10/16/14
To me, the main value of the reviews is that, based on your own experience and opinions expressed by the reviewer, you kind of "get to know" him - and that helps to establish certain degree of trust. Not literally, of course, but after a while you know whose opinion is more likely to resonate with your own - and whose you can safely ignore.
Case in point: I certainly feel somewhat "in tune" with M. Fremer's opinions, after his less than flattering Bryston monos review.
With that in mind, and based on the coverage by Herb Reichert that you linked to, I know whose opinion I need to take with a huge grain of salt.
the "perfect amp" was an Emotiva XPA 200 ($399). - a'aight then, whatever you say.
So many systems have all these good audiophile traits but play music in a woeful joyless manner - again, whatever. Not my experience at all.
Experiences hopefully widen as one grows older. However, it's tough to do if you're locked into preconceived notions, who's opinions you can blindly trust/reject, and other such things, etc.
There's a growing number of positive comments about the LXMini debut at RMAF, so there's no need to base your preconceived negativity on this particular Stereophile report. IMO.
Get out and hear a pair for yourself. Linkwitz will likely be demo them again at the next Burning Amp Festival.
p.s. I also think you're taking the Emotiva reference by the SP reviewer out of context. (Not seeing the forest for the trees). There's also the fact that the LX521 (and LXMini) can sound different/better when used with top-shelf amplification (which is what prompted my reply in the first place).
Could these speakers be driven by a robust 24 watt SET amplifier? Does it need high power SS?
I think I spent enough bandwidth trying to explain it, but whatever.
I hogged that center chair in the front row for almost an hour on Friday and was happy to hear they sounded so good as I had sprung for the drivers and plans about 6 months ago and hadn't heard them till the show. Madisound sold quite a few kits after last years show and I would bet they'll do well again this year. It was the busiest room of that size that I saw all day and people seemed genuinely interested. I would agree, some pretty good bang for the buck.
Hey, are you gonna have them done by Christmas? (I'm just askin'. ;) )
BTW, I hope you got that tree out of the kitchen sink - it didn't really add to the decor.
:)
Probably not by Christmas. Rotator cuff surgery in July has me pretty much one-armed for a while yet and I haven't been able to work on the speakers since you were here. After hearing them though I'll probably try to get started here again shortly.
They should be done with the construction/repair business on the house in another week.
Not questioning what you heard, but "world class speaker and the amplification to drive them" - is the amplification, 5 channel Emotiva amps, "world-class" too? In what sense - watts per dollar? Watts per pound?
Or the speakers themselves are so head and shoulders above anything else, that even the middle-of-the-road (to put it nicely) Emotiva amplification can't f.. up the sound enough, for you to be able to notice it?
Or - and I'm REALLY going on a limb here - amplification doesn't matter much at all? Because after the ASP module does its thing, nothing is going to be able to make much of a difference anyway?
I said world class speakers, not amplification. I'm aware that the 5 channel Emotiva amps are not top tier performers. That being said, the system as a whole sure sounded good, which makes me question just how important amplification and for that matter, the front end is. Of course I wonder how much better the LX521's would've sounded with a better front end and amps. I'm sure the sound would've been elevated that much more.
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Edits: 10/15/14
the superiority of his speakers.
Btw, they can be used with either an ASP or DSP.
I'm not an open baffle advocate. If I do build speakers it will probably be a D'Appolito in a closed box. But I've heard it at a friend's place with Parasound 3 channel amps. They replaced Sophia 3's and the sound is excellent. If they fit my environment they are easily one of the very best buys in medium large speakers, if not the best buy.
That was a room I missed out on and regret. I liked the open baffle designs from Spatial and Emerald Physics.
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