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In Reply to: RE: They are here, You are there posted by ahendler on September 05, 2014 at 15:22:42
Some systems engage you actively in the music - draw you to it - while others put the music in front of you to listen to, as an observer.
He's in the latter camp. This has since become the "truthful" camp in his mind, and I can't argue with him.
But I'm in the other camp.
Or did I get it backwards?
Observe, before you think. Think before you open your yap. Act on the basis of experience.
Follow Ups:
I'm not ready to be in a camp yet and the camps you are describing involve a lot of overlap. Let's just say that some dacs (amps, speakers) interpret the information more than some others, yielding various results which we take to be degrees of presence or transportation!In my house, as you {Frihed) know, I move among combinations of Audio Note, Blue Circle, Resolution Audio, Crimson, Jean Marie Reynaud, and Tocaro equipment, getting various amounts of interpretation, all of which please me in their different ways. I'm not ready to decide where I'll end up when I shut Amherst Audio down. Let's just say that the best of the most ambitious manipulators of sound can seduce the hardest of hearts, at least for a while; and that the best of those that manipulate the least can restore your sense of balance and truth.
Whether the dac, as the original poster has more or less been taken to suggest, is the principal in this matter I'm reluctant to conclude. But when I compare an Audio Note Dac 4.1 Signature to a Resolution Audio Cantata, it does make a significant difference of the kind he describes, even if you change around the rest of the gear down the chain. The AN dac will always warm/refine/enrich; the Cantata will always clean the windows.
Edits: 09/07/14
Ever get stuck in a revolving door?
Yes, that's a fair statement.
I think it comes down to which "sound perspective" for any particular recording is someting that works for "you" in that particular moment. As "Audio Fanatics" we listen for aspects of the sound of recordings that most people don't even consider. The crazy thing is you can get several different "equally valid but different perspectives from the same recording..
It comes down to just that "perspective", & everyone's is slightly different. The only thing you can do is to go with what works for you ! (Unless you want to drive yourself insane
wondering which of the choices before you is the " more correct " one ; In which case you're fighting the "physical laws of personal perspective" : I made that up, but it sounded good)
Sure, which is like giving peace a chance and finding the golden mean, etc etc.
Which is another way of saying what I said to Mac, which is that the "camps" can "overlap."
But.
But if you want beauty and involvement maximized or clarity and transparence maximized, "having both things going on at once" won't get it, will it? For some ears, compromising one goal or the other equals boredom.
So since one can't get REALITY through the speakers, one opts for the aspect of reality one wants most. Or, as you imply, one goes for peace, which in audio is sort of overrated. Not that we don't all do something of the sort. But we don't want to fool ourselves that compromising is the same as not.
The only time I heard a full Cantata-Crimson-Tocaro system was at an RMAF a few years ago (Bob was waiting for his Tocaros when i visited him), and I found myself engaged by the truth. I had the same experience at a Copenhagen show, listening to a Gryphon Diablo integrated.
So, I guess this is an example of overlap i had overlooked.
And I acknowledge it is dangerous to put people in boxes.
Observe, before you think. Think before you open your yap. Act on the basis of experience.
Putting people (like me) in boxes is how you start a conversation. I have no problem with that if you have no problem with my wriggling out of it!
If you are the kind of dealer I am, who only sells what he likes (not a great way to make money, by the way but it does tend to keep you honest), you are apt to move about a bit. You get used to one presentation because it does something really well that you value highly, it becomes your favorite/norm, then somebody (John Geisen, Creston Funk) tricks you into hearing something really good that's different, and you..move about a bit. Because everything you have has its virtues, you're likely to move back and then about some more.
None of this matters in dealing with customers because you just play the stuff and let them figure out where they are. But as a pontificator, it can make you sound like a cad who plays the field. Or a politician. You have known me long enough to have looked in on various points in my odyssey, so you should know how unfaithful a lover I can be. I would like to think I have been on a generation long odyssey toward Ithaca. But in fact, I've just been a peripatetic like the rest of us, attracted first by the sirens/gods of beauty, then the sirens of clarity, then the sirens of warmth and savoriness-- Aphrodite, Apollo, Dionysus. I'm never attracted for long by anything that's not really good at what it does. But there are a lot of different things to do well.
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