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In Reply to: RE: if you haven't actually tried the remedy reclocker posted by mbnx01 on July 06, 2015 at 08:47:16
what is your contribution to the question?
Follow Ups:
'He asked for MY opinion?'
Wow.
"A lie is half-way around the world before the truth can get its boots on."
-Mark Twain
...of course I meant 'an' opinion.
So I gave mine.
Did you want me to give him your opinion? Apparently so.
If we had a rule that people can only post their 'opinion' about gear they've actually heard this forum would be cut in half.
I think it would be a good idea, but I suspect that's a minority opinion.
"A lie is half-way around the world before the truth can get its boots on."
-Mark Twain
look, I've seen and heard enough of digital band aid products to know that the effect of such things is generally very small and usually barely, if at all, noticeable. whether this box does miracles befitting a $400 price tag (for which you one can buy a decent integrated amplifier)... I doubt it. but let the poster decide for himself...I said so myself.
Are you a dealer or what?
No, I'm someone who has ACTUALLY HEARD THE PRODUCT.
A concept you seem to have trouble grasping.
Audiophiles - opinions without experience our specialty.
"A lie is half-way around the world before the truth can get its boots on."
-Mark Twain
I've never used a streamer. It could be that the W4S box is designed for and actually does improve the sound of an inexpensive streamer.
The OP isn't using a streamer though.
Cheers
right...another specialty: the more money spent, the more improvement heard ;)
I appreciat both of your opinions, and the insight they provide. Mbnx01, I'm curious what DAC you have used the reclocker with to good result?
Magnepans are great for some recordings, but for rock and blues, I might look elsewhere. There is no way a reclocker is going to make your Magnepans sound different!!
I think what you're missing is certain aspects of box speakers and conventional drivers, i.e., the bass bloom and punch that makes blues and rock satisfying.
OTOH, if you can get the positioning right so that the speakers really give you the bass as you like it, Magnepans can be absolutely wonderful with the right amplifier.
The best I ever heard them was a pair of 0.5s at home hooked up to a Counterpoint pre and amplifier (hybrid designs), EAD CD player (Ultradisc 2000) listening to a Mapleshade recording in a small 150sq ft room. Great stuff.
But most remastered 1970s rock on CD doesn't sound that great on any system, to be honest.
Edits: 07/07/15
Unless the DVD player, the digital cable, and the DAC are not working correctly, they should give you a good idea of what's on the disc.
I still believe the more musically significant changes occur elsewhere in the chain, speakers, speaker positioning, how the speakers interact with the room, listener positioning, and of course, one the greatest contributors to the sound quality is the recording/mastering of the CD itself (that's ultimately what is meant by 'improve the source!').
When you go for a reclocker, you're looking at another digital cable, etc...the cost rises and the benefits are very small. If you buy another transport, the differences will also be very small and hard to hear (you may be able to compare one input into the DAC against another, though, which may be interesting, but again, very tiny differences)
Also you have not said what your system is like, or what you are trying to achieve with the change.
Tom, You make some good points.
I have found that, at least in my room, Magnepans have plenty of bass. In my experience, Maggie's are very amplifier dependent for good performance. Old 70's Marantz gear never drove my old SMGas well, but a little Adcom GFA535 did. When I ordered my Amp from Klaus, he said "you haven't heard your speakers yet", he was correct. With the Odyssey, my little SMGas could shake the floor, literally. I loved the sound so much I sprung for the 1.6QR, they are a mixed blessing.
The best way I can describe it is an apology regarding TVs, the SMGas are like a good cathode ray tube, nice vivid colors but not the highest resolution. The 1.6 are like a 1080p Plasma, the colors are there but now the resolution is vastly improved. My musical taste swings pretty far, from Diana Krall to ZZ Top. The 1.6s (and even SMGas) make the guitars on ZZ Tops Tres Hombres have an energy that I haven't heard on any other speaker. Both of my pairs of Maggie's do something with Ben Folds piano that must be heard to be appreciated.
The 1.6s may have too much detail for my current source, there is something that is hard to put your finger on. I have swapped back in the SMGas, they have been rebuilt by Magnepan and are functionally perfect, but I miss that detail. I have made small changes in the system that equate to noticeable improvement, cables are actually one of them (I had really hoped they wouldn't). I guess I am seeking ways to get closer to that "ideal" sound and wonder what direction to go from here. I also feel that my Preamp, Amp, and Speakers now outclass the source, but budgets being what they are, I need to improve the source for reasonably low outlay if possible.
As for the character of my system, it is what I would describe as fast, pretty dynamic, and detailed, to that I would like to add some more body, and smoothness if that makes sense. Thanks again for the advice and input.
Matt
All of your equipment is on the sonically 'lean' side, including your DAC, preamp, cartridge (I've just bought an Ortofon Red too, very detailed sounding) phono preamp, and speakers, so I am not surprised.
It's a tough balance in this hobby...there is almost no way to optimize one area without making another area less apparent or seductive.
To answer your original question, buying a different transport and using it into your current DAC is not going to solve the problem you describe! And definitely buying a $400 reclocker won't either.
Though either option wouldn't hurt (well, except for your pocketbook).
I would still play with speaker and listener positioning.
And I still think the 1.6s are generally lean sounding.
I also suggest:
-a tubed preamp with a suitably low output impedance. Even if your digital is not perfect this may improve it.
-lose the Nordost cables. They may be picking up excessive RFI and to me, they always seemed to lack in 'body'. Cardas are equally expensive but go another direction, which may complement your system better.
-plug all of your components into the same outlet strip, and try losing the Monster conditioner for a few weeks. Unless you're worried about
thunderstorms, you may not need it.
-you may be dealing with excessive room reflections, though the Maggies are very directional. Still, this is a sorely underappreciated topic: you are not only hearing the loudspeakers, but the room they're in along with them.
-finally, if you want more 'body and smoothness', don't expect it from electronics :)
Tom, you make some more good points. As I sit here listening to The Who, I can't help but disagree with your assessment of the 1.6s :) With the wrong amp though, you are absolutely correct. Perhaps I should look elsewhere in the system for improvement, and keep one eye on the various online markets, if I see a good deal on a transport, as you mentioned it can't hurt. Thanks again.
Matt
The Who on CD or original LP pressings?
The original masters were fine, to me remastered stuff doesn't usually sound good.
Someone else suggested an Audio Note tubed dac. The audio notes not only have a tube output stage, but also don't do any oversampling or digital filtering, leaving the filtering aspect to the output stages. This has its advantages and disadvantages.
In particular, the advantages might not outweigh the disadvantages (lots of out of band noise) in an otherwise solid state amplification system but it might be worth a try.
An integrated CD player with a true tubed voltage/output stage might make you happier than what you have. Take a look at Jolida, Bada, Cayin, etc.
Cheers
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