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At the prompting of a friend, who found me an S7000 for $18 to try and, into my Metrum Octave DAC, the Sony basically blows away the Oppo as CD transport. There is way more bass, a more solid foundation, better dynamics, words are more clear. It did significantly improve in the first 24 hours of warmup (there was possibly some glare, maybe from jitter, when cold). I'll see how many days it takes for the improvements to stop.
Putting mats on CDs, etc. in the Oppo does not come close to what this transport does.
I now have the feeling that my frequency response from CDs is flat from ~25 Hz - 20 kHz. (My speakers don't put out much below 25 Hz).
It is quite a revelation to me.
So, now I will have a new problem if or when the Sony dies. I wonder whether it can be repaired? I wonder whether there are any current transports for <$500 which can compare?
I hope this transport lasts for a while.
Follow Ups:
A short while ago, I thought about graduating on to something better than the Cambridge Audio CD3 I have been using (which I still love). It's a conventional, slightly older player that enthusiasts know to use a decent Philips transport and DAC. But it's aged and the transports (of which I have a couple of spares) is not cheap to maintain.
A plan to migrate to one of the latest NOS DACs (my attention is still captured by the AN kits DAC4) had me casting about for an affordable transport. I wanted something like the 47 Labs Flatfish but at a more reasonable price. I think I found it.
The beauty of the Lite Audio LT-ONE is that the basis of the transport is (now) a Samsung affair - examples of which can be picked up for about US$20. It used to use a SONY Pro transport but apparently that became hard to source.
As the 'sacrificial', very basic source of the LT-ONE, the flimsy Samsung SOH-AAN transport is overbuilt quite dramatically and has considerable technology on offer for its asking price. If you can find a couple of hundred more, I would highly recommend it as a fairly sustainable solution- at least for the mid-term. If you search around, it can be had cheaper too .
I also like the accompanying DAC-83 too, but that's another story.
big j.
"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."
Great info. Thanks. I will keep this in mind in the longer term.
Thanks! for sharing.
Don't know the Sony, but I have always said that the BDP-83 sounds lousy with CDs. By HDMI, S/PDIF, or analog: they all sound not that great. I asked in all the main audio forums (incl. here) when the 83 was new why that might be, and all I got back was "it sounds good to me"...
I don't remember the details since that was years ago (my 83 has over 8k hours on it now), but IIRC I narrowed it down to it being lousy with 44.1kHz, much better at 48kHz and multiples, for whatever reasons.
Your comments are interesting. I replaced an inexpensive Pioneer, now out of production, DVD/universal player used only as a CD drive with an Oppo and lost significant dynamics also. Fortunately I found another Pioneer on Audio Asylum and so far so good.
By the way I use 2Monarchy dejitter devices in series and they make a nice, obvious sonic improvement.
I concur hahax-
I still use a Pioneer Elite 59-AVi considered by many videophiles to best the companies' best player.
I have compared Pioneer Elite 59-AVi to friends Sony DVP-S7700. It was not even close match. Sony sounded flat with 2D soundstage in comparison. I have not heard DVP-S7000 in my setup so I cannot speak for that. I never understood the noise around DVP-S7700 though. Now I switched to all PC audio and only occasionally spin discs in my macbook pro.
Thanks! for sharing. While i have not heard the Sony- I do use the Pioneer 59-AVi (DVD only) and it is a killer flowing into my Sony XBR CRT.
Beautiful audio and video, especially music-themed DVD. Connected w/ a WireWorld silver starlight 5.2 HDMI, life is good indeed!
Speaking of bargain transports, my recent find is a Samsung BD-H6500 Blu-Ray player. Sending raw bitstream data to my Arcam AVR400 via optical toslink, it sounds glorious. Timing is great, sound is detailed but not harsh. Bass is clear and pianos sound like a piano. Zero listening fatigue, even at high volumes. It is the best transport I have used to date, better than Sony ES, Cambridge Audio and Yamaha CD players, Panasonic Blu-Ray and Toshiba DVD. Granted, have not compared to dCS or other super high end transport, but this player only cost $149 new. And it does a good job with video and audio on Blu-Ray disks and streamed sources (Sound and Vision compared H6500’s HT performance favorably to Oppo 103D, although Samsung build is highly suspect). The Samsung has two built-in processors – don’t know if that helps with jitter or what, but results are really quite good.
Up to this point, while high res multichannel audio was terrific with the ARCAM, I was ready to write-off the DACs in the AVR400 for two channel redbook playback, and was shopping for an external DAC as the analog-in from my phono pre and old CDP were killing streamed data played through the internal DACs. YMMV.
Very nice. Thanks! for sharing.
Knownothing, having read your post about the amazing $149 Sansung at the digital thread of Audiogon I await reading it at the audiophile CD thread at AVS.
Into a Sony XBR CRT, Fantja? I input HDMI from an Oppo 95 and DirecTV HD-DVR directly to a 46 Sony XBR8 in a secondary system. It sounds surprisingly good, but far from the sound of our primary system.
db
db-
Yes. The WireWorld HDMI cable is that good...
Yes. I own a Sony 960N XBR CRT.
Yes, I like the dynamics more now.
I think that NOS DACs are less sensitive to jitter, but not immune.
Thanks! for sharing.
I want to say that both the 7000& 7700 are still regarded today in high-quality build. If only Sony would have offered an 'ES' edition.
I am a big fanboy of Sony ES gear.
Sony built some very good transports in those days. A lot of attention was paid to the digital output circuitry
This also tells me that jitter is not the only important aspect of a transport. I suspect that the Oppo has small jitter, but this test suggests to me that it does not transmit all of the bits.
The difference in bass is huge and I don't know why since I would think low frequencies would be easiest for PCM.
Seeing as how both players also play DVD if you want to tighten up bass response & lower jitter even further , you might want to add an Empirical Aundio Synchro Mesh Reclocker to the "mix" between the transport & DAC. (After only spending what you did for the Sony, you are still within your budget)
I did think that that reclocker would create a good old transport with more modern jitter performance, but no budget for that now.
When I got my DAC, my wife asked, "now are you done?". I am mostly done.
There does not seem to be reasonably priced high quality relockers.
The reason behind better spdif lies in the signal's waveform integrity, ground noise, frequency stability, jitter etc. Japanese units of old often include relocking as well as signal conditioning. One thing you can do is to ensure 75R impedance matching by using the correct BNC plugs, sockets and cables. This has a considerable effect on SQ.
Thanks. Interesting. I was just looking at the Monarchy classic DIP for $250, but it sounds like it's possible that could not improve the Sony signal much.
I use a Transparent digital coax now. I would have to add BNCs to use those, but this is unlikely.
I may try the fiber one day to hear the difference. I have a 25 foot glass TOSlink.
I'm in no hurry to change much, given great sound and little budget. But I do hope to one day get a Revelation Audio Labs power umbilical for my Octave since I expect that to be worth then price in sonic improvement. It was for my CI Audio VDA2 DAC and the stock Metrum seems possibly more ripe for improvement.
Currently at ~72 hours warmup, the Sony does not sound as good as at 48 hours. So I expect it to improve tomorrow if it's going to stabilize to a good point.
Well getting back to the wife "Raised Eyebrow" to your Audio purchases; as
Fred Sanford would say to Lamont "You dummy".
You have to get her involved in listening to some music with you (as long as she makes you some nice snacks of course). As a last resort,figure out what bribes(inexpensine so we don't cut into our Audio purchases fund)will
lull her into a less attentive state.
Try lines like "Honey,my shirt was so comfortable today,I could'nt stop myself from working harder".
Good Luck & happy listening !
Back on a serious note:forget what I mentioned about a Reclocker!
My cognitive skils are going down the drain,you did say that your DAC was the Metrum Octave. I've used the Octave & am now using the Metrum Hex,they are absolutely excellent at "jitter rejection"
(Man, I hope these "Emily Litella" episodes I've had lately don't become a recurring thing with me. Sorry)
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