Digital Drive

Posted by budburma (A) on April 20, 2007 at 10:15:23

Hi All-
First, I really like my present setup and sound. A little on the warm side and very musical, but still has plenty of detail.

Cary 306/200
AES AE3 DJH Sig (syl 6ns7w's, Valvo ez81)
Plinius P8
Dynaudio Contour 2.8's
Gabriel Gold I/C's, Stealth MLT S/C's, various P/C's

But, with over 1000 cd's and the same number of vinyl albums, I think the time has come to check out a hard drive with lossless noncompressed tunes through a DAC. Especially with the i-phone style interface that I think will become available in the next year or two and that will be the cat's meow! (but that's another thread....and I digress...)

So I need a DAC with a similar sound....my short list is:

Audio Note Dac 2 sig.
Electrocompaniet ECD-1
Audio Aero Prima Dac SE (also has the pre included...maybe that's an advantage)

Any comments on their individualc sonic and/or ergonic qualities along with comparisons would be really appreciated....

Enjoy the tunes!

Thanks, Art

• Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - aljordan 18:06:37 04/26/07 (5)
  In Reply to: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 10:15:23:

  Hi Art,

  I own the Audio Aero Prima SE DAC. I use it as my preamp also (I sold my Audible Illusions Modulus 3A since buying it). The DAC is very musical, and the preamp section sound very good as well. One nice aspect of this piece of equipment is that it can drive any amplifier I mate to it, even ones that are notoriously difficult on preamps.

  Interestingly, the Audio Aero sounds different depending on whether the single ended or balanced outputs are used. The single ended outputs sound a bit thick in the mid bass, while the balanced outputs have a less bloated mid-bass. Directly driving an amplifier, the dac and preamp sounds very musical, fast and snappy in the highs, nice texture in the mids, with a slight thickness in the bass depending on what outputs I use. Ergonomically it is very good; lots of digital inputs, two analog inputs, full finctionality via remote control, and a very good volume control (balance control too, but I don't use the balance much).

  I originally bought the Audio Aero because I wanted to feed both my CD player and computer into my system and retain a nice tube-like texture. Since then I have dropped the CD player from the system because the computer gives more presence and detail with the capability of DSP based room correction, and sounds extremely musical with the Audio Aero.

  I also have a Lynx Two B semi-pro card in the computer that has highly regarded DACs (for a computer card anyway). Sometimes I will use it to drive the amps directly or use it to digitally feed the Audio Aero DAC via an AES/EBU connection. The Lynx DACs are more detailed all around with more impact in the bass. The Audio Aero imparts a more analog sound with a slightly softer, hazier deep bass, but the tubes make the mids and highs sound glorious with while still retaining excellent detail.

  The Audio Aero DAC is not particularly transparent in that the upsampling and tubes definitely impart their own signature, but that signature is very nice. The DACs in the Lynx card sound more transparent, but in the same manner can sound a bit harsh conpared to the tubes.

  I do think the best sound I have acheived using the Audio Aero is with a balanced AES/EBU digital connection. I have also tried it using coax from an M-Audio card, and both coax and toslink from my CD Player. The AES/EBU sounds full and smooth coming from the Lynx card. I don't think a DAC like the Audio Aero requires a card as expensive as the Lynx because the reclocking and upsampling offers excellent jitter immunity. The AES/EBU connection of the Audio Aero does sound a bit better to me than the other connections, which is why I like using the Lynx card.

  Regarding preamps, I own a Transendent Sound Grounded Grid, I owned an Audible Illusions Modulus 3A, and had a Cary SLP 98 (F1 version) in the system for a good long time. All have their strengths but I think the Audio Aero preamp section is the most well rounded of them all, and tosses in the ability to drive pretty much anything. I would love to have the opportunity to try an Audio Note DAC, but unfortunately can't give any feedback with a comparison.

  Hope this helps,
  Alan
  
  

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  • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - budburma 06:38:19 04/27/07 (4)
    In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by aljordan on April 26, 2007 at 18:06:37:

    Hi Alan-
    Thanks for the very thorough reply. If i understand it correctly, the Lynx sound card is used to convert the signal to a useable AES/BSU type and the AA still acts as the DAC (and preamp). A very simple solution and the Lynx L22 is a little less expensive and offers only audio functions.

    I am new to the Mac world with an iMac now, but will have a dedicated music computer when I get it all together to launch this pc system. It is not quite as apparent how to install the sound card into a Mac, but I am sure I could get the help I need....I may need to use a Mac pro, which is far too expensive for this endeavor.

    Is it necessary to use the Lynx cables? I guess the more important question is do different brands of the same type of cable sound differently if they are just carrying digital information?

    I have also had the AI Modulus 3, but didn't own it for long. It was a bit thin and a little noisy for me. The AA seems like a logical step, but the idea of using the equipment I have now is also seriously appealing. If I could only afford to have both and a/b them, I'd be set! Why do you also own the Transcendent?

    And, by the way, great photos! You should offer them up as screen savers....selfish of me, I know.

    Best Regards,
    Art

    
    
    

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    • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - aljordan 09:32:03 04/27/07 (3)
      In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 27, 2007 at 06:38:19:

      Hi Art,

      I can't imagine how one would get a PCI sound card into an iMac. I think you would be limited to using an optical out from the iMac, or buy an external DAC which supports USB or Firewire. Yashu's suggestion of the Trends UD 10 looks good also, but I have no experience with the device.

      Regarding cables for the Lynx, other companies do make cables snakes that will fit some of the Lynx connectors, and other Lynx users have brewed their own cables. I have only used the Lynx cables so far. I am not one to get into the discussion of whether different cables sound the different carrying digital information, but the digital cable is not carrying ones and zeros, it is carrying an electrical representation of ones and zeros in the form of a varrying voltage.

      I can hear some differences between differing digital inputs on the same device, but of course using different inputs requires different cables, and I don't know if the differences are due to the output on the outgoing equipment, the input on the fed equipment, or the cable type. I generally stick to purchasing well constructed, good quality cables over using cables as a means to tweak the system sound. A good, judiciously applied subtractive parametric EQ allows me to get far better results over playing with cable configurations.

      I own the Transcendent Sound preamp because I like to build things, and it is one of those pieces of equipment that sound far better than I could ever sell it for, so I keep it for my second system.

      I think I may have given the wrong impression in my earlier note when comparing the sound of the Lynx DACs against the Audio Aero. I said the Lynx was slightly more harsh, but I don't think that is correct. I went back and listened again after writing the last note. The difference is more of a fleshed out midrange and more midbass warmth with the Audio Aero. I don't think the Lynx is more harsh, but has a different balance due to the lack of tubes. I will say that the Lynx is more transparent, and that transparency can lead to a bit of harshness on poor recordings. The Lynx has a slightly more etherial sound, with less instrumental solidity than the Audio Aero, but on good recordings it does sound very nice - much better than the other internal sound cards I have played with.

      Good luck with whatever you choose, and have fun!

      Alan
      
      

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      • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - Dawnrazor 10:59:00 04/27/07 (2)
        In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by aljordan on April 27, 2007 at 09:32:03:

        Hey AJ,

        Based on your listening, do you think if there were tubes in the system some other place, say a tubed pre-amp, that you would get the added transparency of the Lynx and the mid/midbass warmth of tubes??

        
        
        

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        • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - aljordan 12:56:02 04/27/07 (1)
          In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by Dawnrazor on April 27, 2007 at 10:59:00:

          Hi Dawnrazor,

          Most likely. I'll try it. It will be a very easy thing to do. I'll run the digital out from the Lynx into the Audio Aero digital input, and a pair of analog outs from the Lynx into the Audio Aero analog input and make a comparison between the two. The analog inputs of the AA doesn't convert analog to digital and back again so I should be able to compare the merits of each DAC and more precisely see what affect the tubes in the output stage of the AA have. I'll also try going from the Lynx into a different tubed preamp and see what affect it has. I'll let you know.

          By the way, if I haven't made this clear, the bass warmth of the AA is really a trade-off. It is the typical tube / solid-state argument when comparing the Lynx to the Audio Aero.
          
          

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          • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - Dawnrazor 13:24:50 04/27/07 (0)
            In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by aljordan on April 27, 2007 at 12:56:02:

            Hey Aj,

            Thanks for the info, and let us know how it goes.

            I did think your posts smacked of the ss/tube debate. That is why it would be interesting to see if you could have your cake and eat it too.

            One day, i will get around to making a cable box for the lynx and use some home brew cables to see if that offers and improvement. The stock cables sound good to me, but I think that may improve things even further.

            Cheers.
            
            

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• PC audio is not automatically better - Tom Schuman 03:10:56 04/25/07 (3)
  In Reply to: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 10:15:23:

  While a PC/Harddrive to DAC sounds fine, the amount of noise from the PC can be objectionable if you use a regular electrical S/PDIF coax cable, in my experience, in part cancelling out the theoretical advantages of harddrive playback as opposed to real time optical pickup (the laser in a cd player).
  Optical interface between PC and DAC avoids this, but generally has higher jitter.
  Note that you can archive CDs on a PC without necessarily needing to play them back from there. The Cary is an awfully good CD player, and getting a computer setup to sound as good will take a lot of attention to detail.
  Archiving and playing back are 2 separate problems that take separate solutions, which is why I have decided not to merge PC and hifi after some experimentation with it.

  
  
  

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  • also.... - Tom Schuman 03:17:48 04/25/07 (2)
    In Reply to: PC audio is not automatically better posted by Tom Schuman on April 25, 2007 at 03:10:56:

    AN, Audio Aero, etc, are all very pricey, reflecting the low manuf. volume (and the pocketbooks of the well heeled audiophile). You might be just as happy with a less expensive dac as long as you are solving the jitter and computer power supply/rfi problem somehow.
    I do use a MHDT Renaissance DAC, a cheap 16 bit non oversampling dac which is quite nice on not too complex music (though it does not have the leading edge impact and presence of the DAC inside my Sony receiver on more complex music).
    If you are going to spend a lot of money, look into the modified Benchmark solutions (or, if you really like the tube sound, the Wavelength or the MHDT) and think carefully about what kind of PC you want to configure.

    
    
    

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    • Re: also.... - budburma 11:51:49 04/26/07 (1)
      In Reply to: also.... posted by Tom Schuman on April 25, 2007 at 03:17:48:

      I have recently seen a lot of modified less exppensive dacs whose mods actually make them pretty pricey.....notably at the empirical audio site. i do think one could get by on the more inexpensive side of things and have found many bang for buck good deals and that price doesn't always mean it sounds better.....as have we all. quality is quality in the end and what sounds good is just that.

      as for configuring a pc..i have been checking out ripping programs and really doing a lot of due diligence for signal porocessing and transmission. jitter is always a little confusing for me, but maybe an auiophile sound card would reduce that effect? certaily another device to reduce jitter would just present more links int he chain and start to obviate the goal here....fer cryin' out loud!

      i think a mac will do and the promise of the groovy iphone type audio interface plays no small part in that choice.....

      
      
      

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      • Re: also.... - Dawnrazor 20:19:37 04/27/07 (0)
        In Reply to: Re: also.... posted by budburma on April 26, 2007 at 11:51:49:

        There are definately some advantages for the mac route. I didn't go that way because I didin't know Lynx supported them, but they do, and may be an option.

        If the iphone is blue tooth enabled, you can use it on a pc too.
        
        

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• Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... - Yashu 22:13:08 04/21/07 (13)
  In Reply to: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 10:15:23:

  Check out the maker MHDT.

  The Paradisea DAC has a tubed output buffer and is very nice. Very musical and can handle full 24/96, there is a + version, the Paradisea+ that has USB input and improved PSU.

  The Rennesience II is also tubed, but I think it only does 16bit. The Dialogue II is the budget version of this without a tube.

  The Constantine is the Paradisea without a tube.

  These are all Non-oversampling DACs. They have a very smoothe sound and can be almost analog with the right setup, however being non-os means that they are going to be more sensitive to jitter, but if you have a good transport or a good usb s/pdif adapter it is going to sound great.

  For the PC I would suggest the Trends UD-10 that gives you toslink, coax, and XLR from your PC, and it has a good clock so very minimal jitter. You could also consider the hagUSB by hagtech, this is a very well built usb to coax s/pdif adapter. All these devices are ASIO compatable so you can get bit-perfect streams from your PC.
  
  

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  • Re: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... - luvmusic8 16:46:24 05/21/07 (0)
    In Reply to: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... posted by Yashu on April 21, 2007 at 22:13:08

    Is USB Paradisea+ true I2S USB without conversion to spdif? If not is the sonic quality compromised? Can this be used with CDP besides PC? Anyone A/B compared this to Scott Nixon tubed DAC? Thanks.
    
    

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  • Re: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... - budburma 12:00:07 04/26/07 (2)
    In Reply to: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... posted by Yashu on April 21, 2007 at 22:13:08:

    alrighty then. i took some time to look into your suggestions and the trends ud-10 i have to sy looks great. i think i would like to keep as much of my present setup as i can as i have invested a lot of time getting it wheere i want it to be. the tends allows for that and will maybe take take of the dreaded pc jitter problem?

    thanks!
    
    

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    • I think you will like it. - Yashu 14:33:43 04/26/07 (1)
      In Reply to: Re: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... posted by budburma on April 26, 2007 at 12:00:07:

      I think the UD-10 is probably the best value out there when it comes to providing digital out for the PC. It has every connection, PSU isolation, and a good clock.

      I bought a hagUSB and a monarchy DIP, I could have killed two birds with one stone on the Trends UD-10, and I would have come out ahead, since I prefer the sound of toslink (DIP has no optical out).

      The kicker was that the ud-10 came out just after I made my investment.

      You should post back a review.
      
      

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      • Re: I think you will like it. - budburma 14:48:32 04/26/07 (0)
        In Reply to: I think you will like it. posted by Yashu on April 26, 2007 at 14:33:43:

        You know, the Monarchy DIP was the exact extra piece I was referring to that would fix the jitter etc. The more pieces to the puzzle the more confusion as well as ppportunity for exploration and improvement

        I would really prefer to limit that, though. It can make any one of us crazy with options and the audiophile's devil of synergy. To my mind, you can't keep looking to catch lightning in a bottle with each change influencing the whole system. Ah, but i might start to was philosphical.

        I am happy trying to keeps simple as I can. As i get closer to the pc system with the Trends or whatever I try in the end, i will defintely be relating the experience.

        Enjoy the tunes!
        
        

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  • How's the Dialogue II? Anyone heard it? - goks 16:00:36 04/22/07 (4)
    In Reply to: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... posted by Yashu on April 21, 2007 at 22:13:08:

    nt
    
    

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    • Re: How's the Dialogue II? Anyone heard it? - tvr2500m 17:37:14 04/26/07 (0)
      In Reply to: How's the Dialogue II? Anyone heard it? posted by goks on April 22, 2007 at 16:00:36:

      First DAC? The Dialogue may be my LAST DAC ;) After diggin' deep into the DAC thing, rolling through a dozen or two players, DACs, jitter filters, cheap to expensive, I actually like the Kusunoki-inspired, Philips TDA1543-based, 16-bit, non-os, filterless Dialogue II the best of anything I've listened to. Weighing in the price and it really is a nice value, me thinks. I have the Dialogue version that immediately preceded the most current version - 2.1 vs 2.2, or something like that.

      It's not the most extended or detailed DAC, but the soundstage and tonal character and density are very nice. The DAC sounds "natural", "organic", "analog" (to use those well-worn descriptors). The DAC has a very healthy dose of palpability. It breathes.

      I'd like to try the Renaissance, which as mentioned, is a tube-buffered version of the Dialogue. The Paradisea is a Philips TDA1545-based DAC. I found my way to the Dialogue because I wanted to try a TDA1543 DAC, but I'm curious about the Paradisea, too.

      I heard very good things about the Zhaolu D 2.5 from diykits (www.diykits.com.hk/), and you might want to consider Dusty Vawter's latest DAC, the Channel Islands Audio VDA-2.

      - SJ
      
      

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    • I have it... It's nice. - Yashu 09:00:53 04/23/07 (2)
      In Reply to: How's the Dialogue II? Anyone heard it? posted by goks on April 22, 2007 at 16:00:36:

      I like it, it has a smoothe sweet sound, *almost* analog. I would say that it is very musical and not meant for clinical listening, but enjoying the music.

      It is only 16bit, but it still sounds great. It is extremely dependent on the transport, IE it is greatly effected by jitter because it is a non-oversampling DAC.

      It is a wonderful value, it has toslink, BNC, and coax, and I liked the toslink the best. If you have a good transport, you are going to get a great sound. A good transport or a good USB s/pdif adapter (hagUSB, trends ud-10) will make this thing sing.

      If you have the money, though, I would get the paradisea+. Better transformer and PSU, and USB support, not to meantion a tubed output stage. If you do not like tubes, the constantine is the same DAC but wthout the tube.

      The dialogue II is a wonderful value, though... it makes a great first DAC.
      
      

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      • thanks - goks 12:52:19 04/24/07 (1)
        In Reply to: I have it... It's nice. posted by Yashu on April 23, 2007 at 09:00:53:

        the only thing that might worry me is a number of s/h pieces you can see in classifieds. it seems everyone wants something better.
        
        

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        • Re: thanks - Yashu 08:03:44 04/25/07 (0)
          In Reply to: thanks posted by goks on April 24, 2007 at 12:52:19:

          As I said this is a good "first DAC". It certainly has wet my appetitte for more, but I can't afford a new one yet. You may see a lot of them go on sale, but many of the people that sell their MHDT are buying a better MHDT model. Many of the people with the regular paradisea are selling it and buying the + version. I think that says a lot about these products, if many are willing to go through the trouble to get the latest version even if it only has incremental improvements.
          
          

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  • Re: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... - Gmood1 08:08:38 04/22/07 (0)
    In Reply to: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... posted by Yashu on April 21, 2007 at 22:13:08:

    Having owned several of these dacs. I agree completely with what you've said Yashu. The guys at MHDT labs take care of their customers. With well over 400 perfect transactions on Ebay and I would think many more not through ebay. I wouldn't stress one bit about them doing what's right. You get more than what you pay for with these fellows.

    Good listening
    
    

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  • Warning - NO US distributor = potential big trouble - Frihed89 00:58:57 04/22/07 (2)
    In Reply to: Mhdt: Paradisea, Paradisea+, Rennesience II... Trends UD-10, hagerman hagUSB, ect... posted by Yashu on April 21, 2007 at 22:13:08:

    Good news: it keeps the price lower.
    Bad news: you get what you pay for.

    For those of us who have been stranded by equipment mfrs in other countries, the experience is both memorable and edifying.

    Give it some thought before you buy.
    
    

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    • However... - Yashu 10:19:09 04/22/07 (1)
      In Reply to: Warning - NO US distributor = potential big trouble posted by Frihed89 on April 22, 2007 at 00:58:57:

      MHDT seems to be reliable, I bough mine used on audiogon, and that seems to be a good way to grab one. Since the USB versions have come out, a lot of people have been upgrading to those versions, so there have been a lot of the non + versions popping up on the used market.

      I think that is a good sign, that so many people are willing to upgrade to something that is almost the same as what they had.

      If you buy directly from MHDT on ebay, and there seems to be at least one for sale there at any one time, you will get it shipped straight from the manufacturer, arriving in 2 weeks or less, that seems to be the average. That is pretty good from Taiwan.

      I bought it not knowing what to expect, but I can say that I am now a fan. I also bought the hagUSB, but if the trends ud-10 was out at the time, it is what I would have rather haved, although the hagUSB is remarkably good.
      
      

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      • Yes, but you never know - Frihed89 02:41:19 04/23/07 (0)
        In Reply to: However... posted by Yashu on April 22, 2007 at 10:19:09:

        I am not talking about fraud here. That's another issue.

        I am quite experienced in export and import of audio equipment. Maybe about 80% of all transactions are smooth and the equipment is a solid performer and outlasts the warranty period (if it exists). But 20% of the time, in my experience, there are problems that could have only been solved by a local distributor with warranty service and schematics. To solve these problems you have to find a repair person who can figure out what is going on without schematics and then fix it.

        Just a word to the cautious.

        My rule: don't import it unless you are prepared to lose ALL your money. I still find deals that pass this test! And some of them fail, but I don't feel bad.

        
        
        

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• Kora Hermes (nt - Eldragon 18:18:44 04/20/07 (1)
  In Reply to: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 10:15:23:

  nt
  
  

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  • Re: Kora Hermes (nt - budburma 19:38:01 04/20/07 (0)
    In Reply to: Kora Hermes (nt posted by Eldragon on April 20, 2007 at 18:18:44:

    Yeah, you know I was looking at an equinoxe not so long ago. I think they may be a little soft? I would need to find a place to give them a listen.....
    
    

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• Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - clio09 17:17:10 04/20/07 (2)
  In Reply to: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 10:15:23:

  My plan is to use my North Star Model 192 DAC and Empirical Audio USB to I2S converter. Not a cheap combination but I'm using the I2S connection between my North Star combo right now (I have the transport as well) and it is the best digital interface I have used.
  
  

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  • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - budburma 19:42:04 04/20/07 (1)
    In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by clio09 on April 20, 2007 at 17:17:10:

    Clio-you mad thing! how are those gg's coming along? I am unfamiliar with Nortstar and could definitely use some schooling regarding usb to ? adapters/cables. I have had Empirical Audio i/c's in the past ( about 5 years ago?)and thought they had insane air, but a little thin otherwis in my system at the time....
    
    

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    • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - clio09 21:51:36 04/20/07 (0)
      In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 19:42:04:

      See my post on Audiogon. The GG's are very nice. Take a look at Empirical Audio's webiste. Steve Nugent is the expert in computer audio IMO. He is really putting a lot of research into it.

      I'm using the GG's between the North Star DAC and preamp. I was worry the lack of shielding would be an issue, but it the cable has performed fibe versus other non-shielded cables I have tried. Perrotta Consulting will sell you a North Star DAC on trial. Give it a whirl. if you like tubes I have also had great luck withe the Monarchy M24.
      
      

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• Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - Dawnrazor 16:30:37 04/20/07 (4)
  In Reply to: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 10:15:23:

  Kudos on seeing the future.

  Am I missing something?? I looked on Carys site, but I didn't see the 306/200. I thought it had digital ins? If that is true, then why not use it?

  If not, you may want to look at some USB dacs, like the Wavelength brick or cosecant.

  Empirical audio has some usb spdif convertors or usb to i2s convertors that you may want to look at for getting from the PC to whatever dac you choose.
  
  

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  • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - budburma 19:50:46 04/20/07 (3)
    In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by Dawnrazor on April 20, 2007 at 16:30:37:

    You are right downrazor, and I have a little egg on my face to prove it. The 306/200 does have digital ins....(and the manual is on the cary site under the customer service tab i think). Getting rid of the cdp along with going hard drive my just be tossing out the baby with the bathwater, but it's pretty tempting.

    I like the simplicity of the AA pre/dac and the size and sound of the Audio Note, but I have only heard it in an all AN system. Pretty amazing in that scenario though.

    As for cabling, I am in serious need of schooling, but you are the second to mention Empirical Audio. I do have some past experience with them and it is memorable as mostly positive as for the air and overall presentation...a little thin to my memory, but it was some time ago in a different system, etc. Excelsior service also sticks in my mind.

    Have you checked out the iphone music (ipod portion) interface. Man, is that slick. The interface is all that has been missing and Mac seems to tap into that in spades for the consumer...
    
    

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    • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - R7 10:42:04 04/22/07 (0)
      In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 19:50:46:

      Well if you are really hell-bent on spending big dough :), you could add the Audiomat Maestro to your list... NOS, and uses the same DACs as your Cary.

      It might not be quite as warm though, but is apparently so good, you probably won't notice. Reviews here:
      http://www.mutine.com/Pages/info_presse_en.html#

      Ususal disclaimer: I have no connection to Mutine, Audiomat, or the review rags.
      
      
      

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    • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - Dawnrazor 01:29:33 04/21/07 (0)
      In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 19:50:46:

      SOunds like a serious case of salmanella brewing...

      There is something to be said for simplicity.

      I didn't go the external dac route, opting instead for a Pro sound card.

      But, before my computer days, I did buy an external dac (Birdland Audio Odeon AG) that had a pre built in. Unless you have Vinyl or some other source, I just never saw the reason to add some other gear in the chain, and more cables.

      Right now, I run right out of the PC into the power amps, and have no desire to get a pre amp (when you are triamping using the pc as a digital crossover, you would need 3 pres).

      FOr a transport, you may want to look at the Zere One audio peice. It is a custome built PC for audio purposes. But if you are comfortable with PCs, then it should be pretty easy to make one alot cheaper.

      As for the iPhone, I think it is slick, but tiny for controlling a pc. I use a wireless touch screen from Viewsonic, and love it. Chek out my system and it shows a pict of the viewsonic piece. Also, controlling a pc with a blue tooth PDA is farily easy these days, and may be cheaper than the iPhone.

      Please note, that I wasn't talking about Emperical for cabling (not that theirs is bad or anything) but for getting the digital signal out of the PC. They have a few devices that connect to the PC with USB and outputs SPDIF (coax). One even outputs i2s which is supposed to be better than SPDIF if your dac can take it.

      Lynx makes a PCI card that outputs AES/ EBU digital that is supposed to be stellar. Some are using a chaintec 710 I believe taht is cheap but good.

      YOu should try the PC with the Cary if you dig how it sounds. before buying a whole other dac...or send it to me if you do pull the trigger on a dac :)

      If you are buying a mac, than you should look at the Wavelength products. Their Dacs seem to be built with the computer in mind, and macs specifically.
      
      

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    • Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! - clio09 21:55:42 04/20/07 (0)
      In Reply to: Re: I could really use a DAC suggestion! posted by budburma on April 20, 2007 at 19:50:46:

      From a NOS pespective Audio Note is a pioneer. Along with Shigaraki (47 Labs) they have a lot of experience in these designs. However, lots of newcomers to the market. I have a TRL modded Audio Mirror that is great with an active preamp (1.5V output). Other OS DACs are out there including Scott Nixin, Altmann, Paradisea, Lite, etc.
      
      

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