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In Reply to: RE: Question for John Atkinson posted by stehno on April 26, 2015 at 20:11:27
IMO, Mr. Atikinson's quote in the Vandersteen ad,"... the hairs on the back of my neck stood up, so powerfully physical was the presence of the singer in the room.... musically perfect across the board!"
is perhaps the most overly hyped comment I've yet seen from somebody of John's supposed caliber.
With regard to John Atkinson's comments, it's important to note that Robert Harley, editor-in-chief at The Absolute Sound said in the Mar/Apr, 2009 issue, "I believe that the primary reason reproduced music doesn't sound like live music is some kind of catastrophic loss that occurs at the microphone diaphragm."
Jonathan Valin, senior editor at TAS said about one year earlier, "We are lucky if even our very best playback systems can capture even 15% of the magic of the live performance."
And again, quoting John Atkinson from the Sep, 2009 Stereophile issue, "I'm starting to feel that it is something that is never captured by recordings at all that ultimately defines the difference between live and recorded sound."
All 3 get it as do some others. Or so I thought. And to the best of my knowledge none have retracted their statements uniquely describing the very real gulf that separates live music from reproduced music. And even though Harley's speculated cause is inaccurate, the key thing to remember is what I consider Harley's very accurate use of the word "catastrophic".
Yet, here is Mr. Atkinson claiming among other things musical perfection and across the board to boot.
I have nothing personal against John so I have no intention of going to town on his comments. Nor do I intend to go down the conspiratorial path, and though such possibilities always exist, there simply is no reason to, even if such an endorsement was exchanged for profit.
That said, John's quoted comment is perhaps the best concise example of what I and some others have already surmised for some time. That, contrary to popular belief and the wishful thinking of many, from a performance perspective the "high-end" audio industry remains very much in its infancy.
And until somehow the industry as a collective whole comes to this realization, stratospheric prices, bling bling, higher resolution formats, more channels, and measurements will continue to substitute as the holy grail instead of real playback performance in this supposed "high-performance" industry.
I can think of no other reasonable explanation for John's quoted comments. Unless perhaps he was eating his favorite ice cream at the same time he was listening to the Vandersteen speakers.
.
Edits: 04/30/15Follow Ups:
After spending enough time in and around recording studios I have to say the major issues happen after the master are past on, the sound captured in the studio on the demo's never really seem to make it to final release.Microphone issue..?
Mastering issue..?
re-generation issues ..?We used to make transfers straight to acetate discs directly from tape masters, they sound pretty close to the tape, yet released LP's and cd's not, master tape copies are now making a so called "come back" for those never exposed..
Regards
Edits: 05/23/15 05/23/15
and comparing stereo to a live music event is nearly as meaningless ...
Geez ... if the level of my system capped my enjoyment to only 15% compared to a live performance - I'd have left this hobby a longggg time ago.
And besides, this hobby isn't so much about replicating a "live" environment, it's MUCH more about recreating an archived RECORDED event (rarely "live").
It's no wonder JA didn't respond.
Tbone, you've never really given audio much thought, have you?
Last time I checked, every piece of music ever recorded was live.
So in your opinion, Valin and Harley don't know what they're talking about but you do? That's ok. It's good to know where you stand as most people don't have the courage to do so.
Regardless, Atkinson already responded and he responded again with his silence. Can you blame him?
> > Tbone, you've never really given audio much thought, have you? < <
Well, let's hope you didn't hurt yourself "speculating" ... yet another meaningless response.
Tbone, stop being a goof. Meaning that until now you have been.
Did you notice that I used the phrase, "... you've never really given much thought to audio, ..."?
I was taking the chance that you understood the difference between audio and music.
My bad.
> > > > I was taking the chance that you understood the difference between audio and music. < <
Why take that chance, just speculate ...
As to this:""I believe that the primary reason reproduced music doesn't sound like live music is some kind of catastrophic loss that occurs at the microphone diaphragm.""
There used to be a music series on IFC when it was a good channel called Live at Abbey Road I think. One week there were a few bands playing at Abbey Road, same board. First Massive Attack who I really like plays and the singer is using what looks like a Shure SM-58. Then Trisha Yearwood comes on using what looks like the $100K microphone from Manley. What a huge difference!
So as long as we have mostly shit recordings I can't see buying Odin - 2 unless I had a net worth north of 25 million minimum.
E
T
Excellent, and well thought out post.
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