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In Reply to: RE: Finally, an accurate amplifier... posted by Pat D on December 12, 2014 at 16:27:01
I saw no perfection in the amplifier measured by JA. One can not conclude from measurements that a piece of gear sounds good. One has to listen to a system containing the device in question. One is still at risk of reaching the wrong conclusions as to the cause of what one heard. The measurements were far from perfect, as JA's equipment was showed.
If you want to convince me by measurements that an amplifier is transparent then I will have to be able to pick the source material. I will conduct a null test, comparing the actual output vs. the "correct" output. If the null tests shows that the error was -160 dB below the correct output measured with a 200 kHz bandwidth, then I might be convinced by measurements. (You will be responsible for providing the accurate test equipment. It might be available from the appropriate sources. I suggest going to the experimental physcists at CERN. They might be able to help you. I am talking far beyond Audio Precision. Test equipment needs to be 10x better than the device under test, and this is difficult with audio, where high end equipment is already at the state of the art.)
In the absence, I will just go with my ears. Why am I right and you are wrong? Because we are talking about audio amplifiers intended for listening to music, not laboratory instruments intended for conducting measurements.
As to perfection: "God made the integers, all else is the work of man."
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Follow Ups:
Did anyone tell you not to buy the amplifier you prefer? Certainly not me. In fact, I suggest people buy the equipment they prefer.
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"A fool and his money are soon parted." --- Thomas Tusser
Do you, by any chance, print your suggestions on toilet paper, too? Because that way, they could really be put to their intended use...
Because we are talking about audio amplifiers intended for listening to music, not laboratory instruments intended for conducting measurements.
You'll never convince the deaf who lack exposure to better gear and don't have the foggiest notion of what you're talking about. :)
Yes, I agree. Useless to try and convince the willful deaf.
One minor point of disagreement. One does not need exposure to better gear if one has access to the real reference. One can do this if one makes live recordings, or one can guess what one should be hearing if one listens to live acoustic musical performances. People who listen only to commercial studio recordings and amplified concerts can not possibly have a basis on which to judge sound quality. But then, does this matter? Today it's called "high end". It used to be called "high fidelity". Big difference between high price and high quality.
Maybe you will enjoy my recent post.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
One does not need exposure to better gear if one has access to the real reference.
That is my sonic goal as well. While I do regularly attend live concerts and enjoy listening to wifey play her baby grand, the majority of music I listen to is from commercial recordings. Having a ready reference of what any given recording can do provides a useful reference for comparisons.
I've been enjoying rediscovering my library following a recent preamplifier upgrade. I live to hear deeper into my favorite recordings.
Your linked story and background illustrates to me the only real way to compare various recording types. If Meyer and Moron compared live feeds at 16/44 vs 24/192 instead of using their Rube Goldberg approach, I suspect even they would have been convinced that Redbook is anything but "Perfect Sound". Over at AR, there's a Disney engineer who works largely with multi-channel soundtracks who likewise uses live feeds for determining recording quality all the way to up the DXD master.
The part in your story about having to really force the issue of worn cartridges with the subhumans was funny!
The sub humans are still around, but they tend to hang out on other audio forums.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
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