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In Reply to: RE: DBT or not DBT posted by Ozzie on December 02, 2014 at 19:07:52
DBT testing or an evaluation or an audition of any kind are for naught until there is a way to determine that the participants involved are capable of distinctive hearing. This goes for reviewers too.All too often we assume just because one is engaged in this industry, consumer or professional, they must have well-trained ears. Especially if they've been at it for 30 or 40 years.
And although I've encountered a few (as opposed to many) well-trained ears, my general experience tells me this alone is the industry's greatest single deficiency.
Without this minimum qualification or requirement, it's all a charade.
Somebody should fix it forthwith.
Edits: 12/05/14Follow Ups:
Oh boy the Golden Ear fallacy!
Nobody's talking "golden ears". Just ears to hear.
Sure there are a few with extremely well-trained ears and I happen to know one. It's pretty phenomenal to observe. I imangine there's only a handful with that ability.
What I'm suggesting is well-enough trained ears that's somewhere between the very few extremely well-trained ears and the host of those who can't hear a bloomin' thing where every last system and component they hear sounds like live music to them.
Considering that mfg'ers sometimes invest everything they own into bringing product to market and many consumers put a lot of weight into some so-called "experts" when purchasing product, I don't think that's asking too much.
The Bored. Please be so kind as to explain where the discrepency is.
Manufacturers, dealers, reviewers, etc. are welcome but it is deemed useful for posters to understand your potential bias. You'll find quite a few here who serve to enhance the quality of the asylum with their input.
If you represent a product or magazine, then...
I believe the discrepancy is that your profile contains a link to a web site for an audio related business. The Asylum rules require that inmates identify any industry connections. Inmates with industry connections must follow different rules than ordinary inmates.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Thanks for the note. Yeah, that's my website and product but I have not sold or manufactured anything in 4 years.I took the link out of profile.
Edits: 12/09/14
John,
We don't have an issue with the link to your site (so long as it is in your profile only) and you identify your role in the business via your registration. The short story is that if you are doing any audio-related business at all, it's only fair to disclose that. Your linkedin profile suggests Dynamic Contrasts is a going concern.
If you are not doing any business, sorry to hear that things didn't work out for you.
Fax mentis incendium gloria cultum, et cetera, et cetera...
Memo bis punitor delicatum! It's all there, black and white,
clear as crystal! Blah, blah, and so on and so forth ...
Mr. Stehno,
Please be so kind as to go into your profile and change your "Inmate Industry Association" status to accurately reflect your role in the trade.
Thanks!
Fax mentis incendium gloria cultum, et cetera, et cetera...
Memo bis punitor delicatum! It's all there, black and white,
clear as crystal! Blah, blah, and so on and so forth ...
...would you require standards for automobile reviewers, restaurant reviewers, wine and craft beer writers, book reveiwers, etc?Audio equipment reviewing is a form of entertainment for our hobby - it requires good critical listening skills, insight AND good writing skills to communicate what is heard.
Anyone who buys a piece of equipment unheard from a review deserves what he gets.
After reading reviews for a while you should be able to identify the particular listening biases of the reviewers - what things they hold most important in music reproduction - so that you can find one who matches your biases.
Consumer Reports has more objective criteria and charts for their audio equipment reviews - perhaps you would prefer those.
Edits: 12/06/14
I have never learned M. Fremer's biases, e.g., unless they are in favour of high prices. In a city of about 1 million where I live, few outlets carry much vinyl-related equipment. I might try to make special arrangements to hear certain pieces, but I'd like to know what to ignore first, and I'd have thought that organs such as Stereophile should consider helping with that tantamount to an obligation.
For example, turntables are mechanical contraptions, easily measureable for certain basic capabilities. Hypothetically, Fremer might love a particular high-rumble turntable for what he perceives as its sonic virtues, but rumble can significantly suck away amplifier power and/or damage woofers, and it is not always easily audible.
"Subjectivists" today have prevailed to such an extent that many manufacturers no longer even make claims about the wow, flutter and rumble performance of their tables, the friction performance of their tonearms, and so on. I believe only Ortofon provides a 15 KHz spec for cartridge stereo separation (much more meaningful than the 1 KHz spec usually given).
No reviewers even checking allows manufacturers either to claim whatever they want or, more often, to reveal nothing beyond the light sparkling on their polished wood, chrome and/or plexiglass assemblage -- magic then governs.
Jeremy
> Hypothetically, Fremer might love a particular high-rumble turntable for what he perceives as its sonic virtues, but rumble can significantly suck away amplifier power and/or damage woofers, and it is not always easily audible. "Subjectivists" today have prevailed to such an extent that many manufacturers no longer even make claims about the wow, flutter and rumble performance of their tables, the friction performance of their tonearms, and so on.>
Or on the level of turntables and tonearms Fremer is reviewing, WOW, flutter and tonearm friction are no longer factors in their performance or they would produce an audible effect.
> No reviewers even checking allows manufacturers either to claim whatever they want or, more often, to reveal nothing beyond the light sparkling on their polished wood, chrome and/or plexiglass assemblage -- magic then governs.>
No, experienced critical observational listening on a highly resolving reference system governs.
n
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