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I know this has been discussed before whether it makes a difference with cable directionality, but i'm curious about whether this is true after the cable has been burned in. Supposedly it aligns something in the cable??
Follow Ups:
"sounds" better one way than the other regardless of break-in.........
Your part of post about signal going both ways is right, but the part about one way sounding better (than the other) is still cloudy. Are you being sarcastic? :)Cable directionality should only be observed on balanced ICs since the shielding part of balance cable which doesn't carry signal should be terminated at the destination (which arrow should be pointing at) rather than the source.
For unbalance ICs since the shield also double up as signal carrying path, directionality make no sense-because as you said, the signal is moving in both directions :)
[ Cable directionality should only be observed on balanced ICs since the shielding part of balance cable which doesn't carry signal should be terminated at the destination (which arrow should be pointing at) rather than the source. ]Not the widely accepted method of grounding an overall shuield for a twisted pair, the source is usually recommended to be the grounding point. This is upheld in several major texts and papers.
While folks should try it both ways, more often than not, unless there are special circumstances, grounding the source end shields better and sounds better.
[ For unbalance ICs since the shield also double up as signal carrying path ... ]
This is only true for simple coaxial unbalanced interconnects, twisted pair with overall shield unbalanced interconnects will not have this situation.
Once again, this has been pointed out many times to you, I know that you should know better, but you insist on posting otherwise as if you were truly ignorant of the facts.
With that in mind, I take this as a troll, rather than an actual question to Bob.
Your simple minded way of looking at audio cables, and expecting everyone else to follow along that same path is not helpful, nor is it appreciated here.
Consider yourself warned about taking this tack, and please refrain from it in the future.
Jon Risch
I think Bob is right. Suggest you take any pair of RCA terminated cables you have in your system and reverse them, play them in the new direction for a few days; reverse them again to the first direction, and see if you prefer one direction to the other. Just keep an open mind during the trials.Bet you prefer one direction over the other.
highest image height with single ended interconnects...... The phenomenon is much more apparent with solid core wires than stranded wires. The directionality of the return should be reversed from the signal......
Bob,Can you please provide a bit more explicit explanation of what you mean here?
How do you "reverse the directionality of the return from the signal"?
If you have an IC that's already made up then it's not appropriate to take it apart and reverse one of the wires?
Or do you mean that if you have some wire you plan on making up ICs with, you should make sure the writing on the 'return' leg is pointing the other way from the writing on the 'signal' leg ... so you get an "out & back" direction flow which follows the cable writing.
Then you can plug in the IC one way and use your image-height test to see whether it should be plugged in, in the other direction??
Regards,
Andy
The folks there would appreciate it and maybe folks here could try a few things and listen for themselves and make up their own minds rather than try to follow your rants whose premise is that wire is wire......Yes wire is directional and yes some of us can hear it and some use this knowledge to build better wires......Oh, they all sound the same anyway? Take your nonsense elsewhere and sell it to someone who is buying.....
From the people from AR that have no place to go now! What a pity!Lost without a following."All cable sounds the same",yeah maybe next year!
Were are they now?
are actively towing the "we can't hear the difference-you must be imagining something line" over at AR. You'll still find Jit, er Zappo, Witchcraft, Mr. Cocaine, Spastic, etc.Boy they must lead an exciting and perceptive life.
rw
...but I don't follow advice of anybody blindly about cables.Just provide one good reason why would an IC sound different in one direction than the other? If you hear it, then there must be a reason.
HowdyIf you want to pursue your "Just provide one good reason why would an IC sound different in one direction than the other? If you hear it, then there must be a reason." please go over to prop heads.
The best advice you'll get here is to listen for yourself. If you don't hear it then it doesn't matter to you. Whether someone has a good reason doesn't change whether we hear it.
-Ted
Tony,I have heard that one factor in cables sounding better one way is due to the dielectric getting 'burned in' this way. IE. if you were able to make up ICs out of unshielded wire, you would find they sounded the same either way.
Bob ... care to comment (as far as I am concerned, you're the expert ... I'm merely an enthusiastic amateur!)?
Also, Tony, re. the following statements you made:
1. "... since the shielding part of balance cable which doesn't carry signal should be terminated at the destination."
My understanding is that shields should be terminated at the source end, not the destination (Jason, you put me right on that!).
2. "... For unbalanced ICs since the shield also doubles up as signal carrying path ..."
My ICs are made from 2 solid-core wires (the signal and the return) with a shield over the top which is earthed only at one end - so it is not part of the signal chain. (My amps are not 'balanced'.)
Regards,
Andy
Hey AndyYou said:"I have heard that one factor in cables sounding better one way is due to the dielectric getting 'burned in' this way".
If the signal was DC, then we might have something to talk about since electrons are moving in one direction only. But the signal is AC which mean signal is going both ways. So electrical potential is varying at any point along the wire. The same concept (remotely) also can be applied to TV's screen. As long as pixels are not static and change in [light] intensity frequently, there is no chance of phosphor burn in.
You also said:"My ICs are made from 2 solid-core wires (the signal and the return) with a shield over the top which is earthed only at one end - so it is not part of the signal chain. (My amps are not 'balanced'.)".
It sound like a twisted pair [unbalanced] configuration. Electrically, one of the solid core wire have the same potential as the shield-because for unbalance systems, one leg of the signal path is grounded. So whether one end of the shield is left open or grounded makes no differences since the ground of destination and the source are connected together via one of solid core wires.
Wire is directional whether it has dielectric extruded over it or is bare....Wonder Wire (bare 19ga solid core internal hook-up wire) had instructions to this effect almost twenty years ago now....I didn't trust them so I listened to the wire both ways and said I'll be damned!......No such thing as an expert on audio frequency wire or it would all be configured the same...It all works, it all looks different and it all sounds different.....I just have noted changes in the soundstage occasioned by orientation of the wires.......Break-in has nothing to do with the directionality of the wire whatsoever...It merely sounds better one way that the other, cleaner and it has higher image height.......Much easier to hear the differences with speaker wire and much easier to deal with four separate pieces of wire BTW.......
rcrump
What makes you believe wire to be directional? Wire is able to carry a current because of conduction electrons, which are valence electrons in the atoms making up the wire. They are loosely bound and therefore can move. You can use the pipe analogy. A wire is like a pipe with water in it already (water=conduction electrons). Applying an electric potential difference between the two ends then gives rise to a current. The current is the same regardless of the the direction it's going. It's as simple as that. I am an electrical engineer and so I believe I am qualified to rebuff your statement or wire being directional. Maybe you mean like in a single ended coax configuration that the signal should be applied to the inner conductor and the shield used as return path. If you were to reverse that arrangement, then there might be some noise issues. If that's what you mean, then you're absolutely correct. I am sincerely interested in what makes you believe wire to be directional. It pains me to see folks believe things like this..Sincerely
Brian
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