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I read this on KLE Innovations and wondered what your thoughts on Cable Cooking/Burnin might be? I have found/noticed serious benefits from cooking/burnin and I found the highlighted part very interesting and it sort of makes sense to me...
[quote]
Burnin/Cooking Time
We believe that the Burnin/Cooking process can be thought of as an extension/finishing of the Annealing process.
This is a practice that can dramatically/drastically improve performance and has been gaining acceptance from HiFi enthusiasts :) Usually, any listener will be able to identify a marked change/improvement in audio component performance within the first 100 or more hours of use, whether it be a cable, connector, component or loudspeaker.
Burnin/Cooking time is the process whereby electrical signal/charge gradually settles/corrects/aligns dielectric, electromagnetic, and material (metal and non-metal) issues that occur/result during the construction process. These aspects are often and usually found in Cables/Connectors and usually results in a brittle, bright, muddy, non-cohesive sound that lacks the Detail, Resolution, Timbre, PRaT, Harmonic Texture, Organicness, Naturalness, and Staging which is desired for music reproduction. Burnin/Cooking Time improves the way that signal passes through the conductors and dielectrics and it is the resulting changes in signal transmission that refines and defines the performance of the audio cables.
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Follow Ups:
I hope Ping Ping can also... oh, I am PingPing, hehehe :)But to mention again, I read on KLE Innovations website that they "believe that the cable Burnin/Cooking process can be thought of as an extension/finishing of the Annealing process" which I thought was quite interesting. Perhaps yes but perhaps no because it does not seem to be permanent, or is it permanent, that is the question?
It make sense that this would apply to the signal and ground conductors but it appears that nobody knows why, that is the question? Conditioning the ground conductor makes even more sense when you consider that the "Outgoing circuit is only as good as the Incoming circuit", especially when you consider response/proximity necessary factors and variables to the equation :)
Perhaps it is to do with feedback just like Back EMF feedback from speaker driver voice coils effects reproduction of the signal, the signal itself, and the amplifier or just like feedback in an amplifier can effect the amplifiers output signal quality even though its intended use is to keep the amplifier from oscillating :)
All quite interesting and perhaps we may know one day, perhaps, just not today :)
Edits: 10/30/15 10/30/15 10/30/15 10/30/15 10/30/15 10/30/15
Other than AudioDharma what other brands of Cable Cookers/Burners are recommended...
To be technical, there is only one Cable Cooker....I created that product name in 1999.
Other conditioning devices are those made by Jim Hagerman, the Nordost unit (primarily for their dealers at approx. $4000, I believe), and the ProBurn made in China.
This is an interesting approach that I have just read about...
[quote]
Break in for cables makes a difference. Are we really burning in the cable or settling the dielectric? Both actually. The conductor takes minimal time of constant play to burn in a path of least resistance. It is the dielectric that needs to form. Constant play for many hours of break in does not allow the dielectric to cool down to form.
A method of 24 hours on (continuous playing) then 6 hours off then 6 hours on then 6hrs off then 6 hours on and so on until cooking/burnin is complete...
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This is the approach that Morrow Cables expouses. I have broken in Morrow cables using this approach and after one week of this approach then put the cables on an AudioKharma Cable Cooker. The cables significantly continued to improve.
To hear the maximum sonic effect of interconnects and power cords you have to use a good cable cooker.
To keep your system at it's maximum sonic bliss you will need to clean connections and "recook" your cables about every 6 months.
I wonder how Morrow Cables decided that 6 hours on then 6hrs off is a good approach!
I wonder if this approach will/would work with a Cable Cooker?
Morrow, like many others, have "a theory" about cable conditioning. And they put forth what they think works for their designs. This on / off approach supports their theory. And they don't use a Cable Cooker, no different than other cable makers who create their own theories.To me, this on / off approach simply lengthens the time needed to properly condition a given cable. In comparison, the audiodharma Cable Cooker is providing a high-current, high-voltage STEADY-STATE signal together with a swept square wave that subjects the conductors and dielectric materials to a level and depth of signal that those materials NEVER see in a music system....that's just one of the many reasons the multiplex signal is so effective.
In short, using such an on / off strategy along with the Cable Cooker's output signal will only make the conditioning process take longer. That's a time-waster. I've had a few inquiries over the years from new Cable Cooker owners about this very methodology, and answered those inquiries the very same way. I also suggested that they do a direct comparison....one cable using this on / off theory, a 2nd cable using my suggested conditioning times (dependent on wire gauge and amount of dielectric materials)....in every case, I was told that the cables treated per my recommended methodology sounded much better, right of the bat. No surprise to me.
Edits: 10/28/15 10/28/15
I believe you are right and I wonder how much the on/off approach actually lengthens the cooking/burnin process?
With the the audiodharma Cable Cooker what is your suggested method/approach?
What do you think of a 10hrs on/2hrs off approach, where the 2hrs off simply allows the magnetic effects that build up in the cooking/burnin components to subside/drain away, before the cooking/burnin is continued?
With the the audiodharma Cable Cooker what is your suggested method/approach?
The method that works best, and consistently, is Cooking a given cable (or multiple cables) for a set amount of time, then re-installing it in the music system, then allowing the cables to settle in with the music signal (AC draw with power cables). Tried-and-true over 16 years of practice. To further define the process, I always recommend progressive "Cooking-and-listening sessions", which sort out the optimal amount of hours a given cable needs to sound its best. This process is addressed on the FAQ page of my website.
What do you think of a 10hrs on/2hrs off approach, where the 2hrs off simply allows the magnetic effects that build up in the cooking/burnin components to subside/drain away, before the cooking/burnin is continued?
Again, another theory, and wasted time. Why not fully Cook the cable, then let those pesky "magnetic effects" drain away afterwards? Time saved, at the very least.
Please note that the conditioning process is similar to a sine wave....there are peaks and valleys. It's always possible that an arbitrary time period will produce a (temporarily) bad-sounding result, and in the real world that occurs frequently. That's why progressive Cooking-and-listening sessions best determine when a cable is "done". One's ears determine that.
Could it be that those pesky "magnetic effects" are occasionally (from time to time) producing a (temporarily) bad-sounding cooking/burnin result?
Could very well be, PingPing....good insight. And another reason NOT to perform the on / off conditioning method. If indeed magnetic effects are contributing to bad sound, then it makes good (and better) sense to fully condition a cable (such as what the Cable Cooker can do) rather than start-and-stop the process.
[quote]Could very well be, PingPing....good insight. And another reason NOT to perform the on/off conditioning method. If indeed magnetic effects are contributing to bad sound, then it makes good (and better) sense to fully condition a cable (such as what the Cable Cooker can do) rather than start-and-stop the process. [quote]By on/off, my thoughts are, leave the cables connected and turn the cooker OFF then after about 2hrs turn the cooker back ON and continue the cooking process for about 10hrs, and so on... hopefully, this will negate any magnetic effects that might creep into the cooking process.
Edits: 11/07/15
Firstly, you are presuming that "magnetic effects" are occurring, and that those are "bad". Neither of us knows if that is true. There are, of course, electromagnetic "effects" occurring through all wires, as current travels down those wires. With power cables, it's much stronger, and that "halo" of electromagnetic energy is measurable.
But these electromagnetic "effects" will occur regardless....turning off the Cable Cooker will not stop them, nor will the laws of physics stop working, anymore than shutting your system off from playing music.
Who came up with this theory of "magnetic effects" being deleterious?
I know Rick Schultz of High Fidelity Cables uses actual magnets to control and effect signal flow....but he also uses the audiodharma Cable Cooker with his cables, and has for many years. He's never mentioned this as an issue. In fact we recently talked about his newest technology at the Rocky Mountain Audiofest, and spoke briefly about the idea of combining technologies.
Sorry, I meant electromagnetic "effects" which I assumed in the scheme of things are the same as magnetic "effects" :) Won't the electromagnetic "effects" dissipate to ground once the electronics is turned off? I am definitely not saying audiodharma Cable Cooker although, I suppose/guess, all electronics is affected by electromagnetic "effects" in some way :)I cook my cables using an old CDP and an old 25watt integrated amp, where I can set the volume, into a 10watt 5.5R resistor using a couple of music CD's that I like for this process :) Hence my interest in cable cookers, so, all information that can help make up mind is good information :)
Edits: 11/09/15
Cable burnin/cookin has always worked for me and I burnin/cookin my cables using an old CDP and an old 25watt integrated amp, where I can set the volume, into a 10watt 5.5R resistor using a couple of music CD's that I like for this process :) Hence my interest in cable cookers, so, all information that can help make up mind is good information :)
Edits: 11/10/15 11/10/15
Electromagnetic effects have never been a concern to me or my consulting engineers....to me it's not an issue. Delivering the most effective / highest quality output signal, together with reasonably heat-efficient circuitry has always been the goal. Hence, we are in our 7th generation.
Much more important than any theory about conditioning cables are the results. Your ears do the judging. My 3 cents.
How long can a full conditioning (generally) take with a cable cooker and can magnetic effects occur during the cable cooker process?
I have found that 5 days generally works well for my power cords, 3 days for interconnects, and 5 days for speaker cables. After conditioning and reinstallation I use the system realizing that the system will take 2 to 3 days to settle in from the connections being reestablished.
The newest develpoment in power cord conditioning is conditioning of the ground wire on power cords. AudioDharma sells an adaptor that runs a signal through the ground at the same time the hot and neutral wires are being conditioned. On my previously conditioned power cords, I heard a major improvement when the same cord had the ground wire conditioned.
I hope Ping Ping can find a source in Australia to experience what his cables are truly capable of after being fully conditioned.
nor even anything approaching apathy.
All I've read are good things.
Due to EXTREME procrastination have yet to do it.
Most recently Luminator has posted on the subject,
but many have over the years at the link.
"Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination" -Michael McClure
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