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In Reply to: RE: 12awg and or 14awg 6 or 7N ofc solid wire... posted by Tweaker456 on February 01, 2015 at 15:21:08
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I have used 2 different types of occ @ 16awg in my interconnect experiments against regular magnet wire. In the audio realm I felt that the gold plated wire was somewhat bright and unntural in the treble and bass shy compared to the regular magnet wire (rmw). Of course it was smoother and somewhat clearer but I couldn't live with it. Pure copper OCC won out over rmw, smooth, slightly clearer, very natural timbers in the treble and prefered over rmw, but still slightly leaner in the bass. So rmw wins in the bass. My thinking is that ofc might be the best compromise. I am up to 14AWG in my interconnect and will go for one more gauge, the 12AWG . The 14 went to a whole new realm of body and realism, at least in my headphone situation. The GPOCC is very good as a digital cable. Better than rmw and unplated. Yes , I'm not a skin effect believer. Not at these gauges for audio. Tweaker
The cool part about skin effect is that it exists whether you believe in it or not.
I'd personally love to experiment with some OCC / DIY interconnects.
Any source of 75ohm RCAs out there?
Too much is never enough
This message has been moved to a more appropriate venue .
Unless you wish to build a DIY digital cable or video cable, there is no benefit in using a 75 ohm friendly rca connector. In fact, the notion of a "true" 75 ohm rca connector is kind of an oxymoron. BNC is a more ideal if not a proper 75 ohm connector. However, a number of rca connector designs can function very well if terminated properly for a DIY 75 ohm digital cable project. That way you can choose good sounding rca connectors in their own right as well as maintain the proper 75 ohm characteristic impedance of a coaxial cable. Maintaining the 75 ohm characteristic impedance of a coaxial cable avoids digital cable reflections caused by an improper termination method that *deforms the shape* thus relationship of the dielectric positioned between the center conductor and the braided shield. The shape of the dielectric needs to be consistent (not compressed) along the entire length and to the very ends of a 75 ohm coaxial cable, right up to the connector termination point. In a nutshell, don't squash the ends of a 75 ohm coaxial cable unless you don't care about digital cable reflections...
I suggest you take the very large gauge solid core copper interconnect cables to a local audiophile shop and ask a salesperson to discuss what you both may hear when compared to a reference quality solid core copper interconnect cable, which most likely will be a small gauge (22 AWG or smaller, sometimes much smaller) design that, in regards to skin effect follows what has become common knowledge among cable designers and many audiophile end users.
By increasing the gauge of solid core wire, you are affecting the tonality of the signal, along with other vital listening cues. When the increased gauge presents audible skin effect, phase anomalies most notably affect tonal characteristics within the treble region, while still audible further down into the bottom end. Things only get worse as the gauge is increased. The sonic result is similar to an overly polite cable that is said to be forgiving, but what's actually happening is the smearing of information. Signal smearing is an audiophile sin of commission rather than a more humble sin of omission, IMO.
An important test you might do in order to identify audible skin effect is playback a pristine piano recording with plenty of harmonic overtones along with a clear sounding bass fundamental, as well as plenty of ambient information including reverberation/room refections, and other spatial cues including airy spaces between images within the soundstage (if the recording is an ensemble), as well as delicate treble air/extension.
Larger wire (round) sound better to me. Too many "audiophile" cable use silver, plating, solder... which I don't like. The interconnects I'm experimenting with use no silver at all. When I go up in gauge I go up in fidelity. No amount of theory will dispel this notion for my ears. Phase shift is one thing but roll off from skin effect is not an issue, IMO. We have been through this before Duster. Putting this up mostly for others. Tweaker
Most audiophile cable designs do not feature silver plated conductors, so the opinion of "too many" is simply an argument against the notion of audible skin effect. Most audiophile cable conductors are either pure copper or pure silver, and involve smaller gauge conductors rather than larger gauge conductors unless the design involves stranded wire which is less prone to audible skin effect than solid core wire, but stranded wire has sonic caveats of its own. BTW, my responses are for the benefit of others. You may do as you wish.
I was talking about using silver at all. Silver plated rca's and or silver content solder. Acording to Noxindo Cables there is little or no difference in the skin effect between the two because stranded wire is touching each other. In any case I dought that the math would be(many many) orders of magnitude difference at 20k to make any difference in terms of roll off. My experiments so far go up to 14awg with the same type of wire (same company and specs) , same rca's and same solder. Fatter wins every time. Last stop, 12AWG. Tweaker
Interesting Duster. Would be cool if we could all get on the same page with a few reference recordings like you suggest. One has to discover and hear for themselves, but there are sooo many directions, it is inpracticle (for me anyway) to try them all.
Maybe thought for another thread would be to discuss specific songs and specific passages of the what you hear, don't hear or trying to hear.
Solid Core/Stranded, silver/ copper/gold, OFC/ OCC, big gauge/ small gauge, teflon/cotton, foil/round ???....
Lots of golden eared folks like myself have come to the conclusion that stranded (non litz type) wire is not suitable for audio. Stick to solid or litz type, IMHO. Wires not touching each other. Tweaker
I like your answer:
Too much is never enough
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