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In Reply to: RE: Why are Siltech cables sooooo expensive? posted by Jagdeep on June 21, 2010 at 06:17:53
Because "people" are afraid to buy the "wrong" cable and use price as an indicator of "quality".
Remember, for some people, spending $1K is like buying going to BurgerKing.
Best from Tucson
Bob
"He (R.M. Nixon) was a foul caricature of himself, a man with no soul, no inner convictions, with the integrity of a hyena, and the style of a poison toad." H. S. Thompson
Follow Ups:
They play into the audiophile fears that something is always better, and if you pay more, it has to be better.
I been in this for 30 years, and I played that game, worried all the time of what I should upgrade next and if I do god will speak. Well I found that is not true, all I did was chase my tail and spend money year over year.
I had great systems, then ruined it, then had to start over. Now when I get the itch I go to a audio store and listen, come home and say no need to upgrade.
In reality for me now to upgrade I would not have the funds to do so in this age off ultra high-end costs. So I worked with what I have and man it sounds great.
I improve my room and that made more of a difference than any piece of gear did. I purchased several sets of tubes and by switching them I can alter the sound more that any cable could.
I am now waiting for some Bremer 12ax7, so once I receive them I will try them in place of my Tele's and see if they work with my McIntosg C2300 tube preamp.
Small costs can give you huge returns without having to keep buying new gear. Only thing I might buy at some point is a pair of Quad speakers one brand I have liked but never owned.
PJB
If you have access to a the peer review journal "Nature" you'll find a decades old article "Prospect Theory" by Kanahaman and Traversky showing a Sigmoid curve response to risk.
Plus it seems as if consumers sometimes use price as an indicator of quality, especially when the outcome of a purchase cannot be ascertained a head of time.
Best from Tucson
Bob
"He (R.M. Nixon) was a foul caricature of himself, a man with no soul, no inner convictions, with the integrity of a hyena, and the style of a poison toad." H. S. Thompson
Read that.The physiological make up of us is very easy moved into direction by what we hear or read over and over becomes truth, be it truthful or not. You see it in current politics, a lot towards Obama and his past, his religion, his name etc.
It is easier too follow than to become informative of the facts, so today 30 second sound bites become all the facts some need to make up their opinion on a subject. Where real scholars will tell you "you never stop learning" and of course your opinion and beliefs change with the added knowledge and experience.
In audio for many years reviewers held sway as being the guru's and the their reviews that implied was something is always better, I remember the knock on ARC was why buy it in a few months they will make another version that is superior to the one I just purchased and the reviewer would say so, so you buy version a,b,c etc.
So as the hobby grew the myths became fact, and during the peak years audiophiles were always look for something better even when they just purchased a new piece of gear, the guy at my store would always take me back to listen to a system that was x-amount of $$$$ more, and I go wow! Then I started planing on how to afford that system.
Then the second reinforcement came from the audio review magazines that this new product was so much better than the old model X. So chasing the tail started. I knew philes who went through systems like socks, it was never good enough, they learned to look for what was wrong, they wanted to find a flaw be it real or not.
They change the gear, call me and say I never heard nothing like this, 6 months later system in flux again.
Some gear today is a work of art visually, but that does not mean it will sonically sound better then a piece of gear where its exterior is not built to such high artistic standards which really added very little to the sound quality. But if that buyer values the sound with those ultra looks well he is right to spend is income on it, he or she perceives its value.
In the end, you have two different buyers, one like most of us has to really watch how we spend our money, then the other buyer who can afford 6 figure systems.
Cables makers knew they be in a no lose position, because very cable will react differently to any component that is attached to. The outcome is an unkown.
This is not to say some did not really research how cable designs impacts the signal, but at some point they figured it out, then where to?, we have to stay in business, well good marketing, making them much more expensive, thus the perception that cost equals quality.
Then the small hobbyist started making cables and selling them. One look at Audiogon and you will see many cables makers besides the major players.
I have no issues with cable makers or electronics manufactures for that matter, but the cable makers have slid a lot of spin in as fact, but some things have and will improve as time marches on as far as electronics goes, but there is no holy grail, work with a system and built it to what you enjoy hearing, or what you feel is correct reproduction.
How many pictures I see of good gear setup wrong, with no room treatments, speakers pushed into corners or against furniture to just fit them into a room, I always say why spend that type of money then to that with the gear. They never hearing what they paid for.
The bigger issue also is most of us are not electronic engineers, so our knowledge is limited to trial and error (gaining experience), and reading reviews. So we have to depend on those we feel know more than us. We have no facts to combat their claims.
I read once when someone who really did have a degree and posted some facts and the anger and backlash against them was unreal by those who bought into the myths and just closed their minds and did not want their beliefs challenged or threatened.
The Pengea power cord is a good point at $79.00 some felt it was as good as anything they owned costing much more. No can't be! Its rubbish worse than a stock cord! The other extreme would be the its the best power cord in the world.
Well in some system it could sound better on a piece of gear better than the $3,000 one did, or it could add to a system by just replacing the one one power cord a certain piece of gear. You just don't know till you try it. That is a fact.
Once your system gets so good any change will be noticeable if you have an ear for it. I get the same unknown results when I switch out a pair of vacuum tubes to another brand, I never know what to expect as far if I will like it or not, and the way I do judge now is not to prejudge anything because you never know.
Example.
The PS Audio AC12 one guy wrote it was awful on this CD player, on mine this is where it works he best. Go figure. I like it better there than on the amp. The amp is where most say it works the best!
Telefunkens might be the cats meow in one system and so so in another. So when others ask what the best 12AX7, I would say it depends on your system, on mine this is what I like, my opinion carries not more weight than that.
But today with the internet the information is out there to find, but 20-30 years ago we had limited information sources, mostly from the review magazines and their advertisers. The knowledge we gained back then set up our beliefs on audio and gear.
Audio is a great hobby, but at some point stop looking and enjoy what you have. 99% of the people in the USA don't have what we have invested in a audio system, that makes us special, and we all love music of various forms, which also makes us special.
We shall pass this way but once!
PJB
Edits: 06/28/10 06/28/10
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