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In Reply to: RE: Passives posted by ahendler on May 03, 2016 at 22:45:25
Unless the transformers are VERY good, I have found TVCs to be less transparent than a resistor based passive and even many good active preamps.
The only nearly invisible volume control I have tried is a shunt volume control, which passes the signal through only 1 resistor and the pot is shunted to ground.
The Luminous Audio Axiom works really well IF your source has a really good output stage. It won't do wonders with wimpy opamp outputs.
Follow Ups:
Its hard to convince the TVC lovers other passives are worthy. Resistive types are much more dependent to proper equipment suitable for passives. Id bet a sizeable percentage of people who have tried passives dont really have the ideal gear scenario for it.
ET
I had the same Placette Passive years later in another setup and it didn't work out. tI sounded a little thin and dull.
TVCs may be less finicky with the surrounding equipment choices (I haven't tried one personally to experience it) but one of the BIG advantages of the Placette (to me anyway) is that it has a 128 step remote volume control. Maybe they exist in a TVC but I don't know of any with fairly small discrete volume steps like the 128 steps in the Placette.
Yes I have the same one and like the many steps.
ET
"...but I don't know of any with fairly small discrete volume steps like the 128 steps in the Placette."
I think you're right.
My AVC has only 25 steps, 2db each, but I have never felt like I was "caught between steps".
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Morricab hits it right with his comments in my experience.
I have been using two preamps on and off for the last decade or so. A DIY SET single stage VT137 triode preamp with stepped DACT volume pot and a Sonic Euphoria autoformer volume control (SE).
In terms of tonal balance, they are virtually identical. I think the SE is slightly more focused sounding, VERY slightly less noisy (my VT137 preamp is VERY quiet four an active, tube preamp, a requirment since I use 100db+ effiecient horns) and I never have to turn it off or on.
My active VT137 preamp sounds bigger (wider, deeper soundstage), has more "air" or a sense of room accoustics where the recording occurred, actually sounds more transparent (that always get me, how can an active preamp sound more transparent than an autoformer Which is basically a long wire?) and has better bass (deeper, bigger, more). I like both sounds.
I have experiemented with many resistive based passives and agree that they are more transparent than my SE and probably a bit more than my VT137 pre but they always sound dryish, strangly lifeless and ultimately somewhat boring. I can run my PS PWD II dac straight into my amps without a preamp and I get that same sound as with a resistive passive preamp (the sound is detailed, transparent, fast) but ultimately somewhat fatiguing and lifeless.
With passives you are listening to more of YOUR amp. The review of music sound quality is more a reflection of your amp when it comes to passives.A good passive will use a very transparent resistor. So it will offer almost nothing to the actual signal.
Edits: 05/05/16
Nice post. I have not had this issue with my passive (Placette) I have an ideal scenario with a source that is rated 2.53 VRMS @50 ohmsand amps that require a volt with 100K input impedance. I bi-amp with my passive. I think the best case is that with your passive you must still be able to overdrive your amp or amps fairly easy. Ive seen a few passive set ups and most could not.
ET
Thanks. I have a pretty good setup for passive preamps too. PS Audio PWD II has a stout output section (is actually designed to work well without a preamp) and low output impedance, my amps have ~100k input impedance. My phono preamp also has tons of gain (~70db with SUT) but output impedance is a bit higher than it could be.
I used to have problems with just too much gain in my system, my preamp volume control was never above about 4-5 clicks. I ended up going from a highish gain 3-stage SET to a much lower 2-stage SET amp setup and that works great. I can basically use pretty much all of my volume control now and it maxes out at levels MUCH higher than I can tolerate.
Straight out of the DAC (without preamp) or using a resistive based passive preamp might be the most truthful and accurate setup but perhaps it is too revealing and I find it somewhat fatiguing in the long run, so I prefer the slightly more "euphonic" and dynamic sound I get from my active preamp or my autoformer preamp.
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