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In Reply to: RE: Where do you get your "audibility" theorem? posted by kuribo on September 23, 2015 at 13:16:52
Lets pretend you were asking me this question.
"How's the SNR and the frequency response with load on the 300b?" (2A3)
-I don't know.
"Max power output?"
-One watt.
"How does it work with planar or electrostatic speakers"
-Irrelevant, since it is not practical to power those pigs with a top-shelf amp.
"in average or better sized rooms?"
-Excellent.
"At what level does it start clipping?"
-These amps don't clip baby!
△ᴉʇɐuᴉɯnllI oᴉpn∀△
Follow Ups:
I believe Tre was using the weightings that were originally developed by D.E.L. Shorter in the early 1950s. He felt that his rather simple weighting scheme was superior to unweighted harmonics...Cheever later found that it didn't go far enough and that level dependence should also be included in the calculation of impact from high order harmonics.
What this also means then is that the sensitivity of your speaker is relevant when talking about what distortion pattern your amp should be generating as it will effect the output power drawn and the harmonics generated vs. what is audible.
Agree , speaker to amp relationship , ur finally admitting to this importance ....
What the obvious implication is that an inefficient speaker in a big room at high volume can never sound optimally as it will be hindered by the quality of the amps that are required to get the desired volume levels. Sorry if you missed that point.
So, unless you have a sensitive, relatively easy to drive big speaker that is not a horn, like the original Wilson X1 Grand SLAMM (95db/watt and an easy load) then your screwed with regard to ultimate sound quality...sorry...
A line source is a possible exception that will work with moderate power because they project the sound into the room as a cylinder rather than a sphere.
"How does it work with planar or electrostatic speakers"
-Irrelevant, since it is not practical to power those pigs with a top-shelf amp.- Garyoyle
Hey Now ,
So planers and ESL are pigs because your desktop radio has only one watt
:)
"Hey Now ,
So planers and ESL are pigs because your desktop radio has only one watt"
Pretty much lol. Only a dump truck needs dump truck tires!
△ᴉʇɐuᴉɯnllI oᴉpn∀△
Well no sensible person would use a desktop 1 watt radio to drive one ...
"Well no sensible person would use a desktop 1 watt radio to drive one ... "I agree, same as me not using 200w to drive 101 db per watt speakers. lol
Horse for courses.
Like Tre's, my system goes louder then I can comfortably stand to listen to.
I sit around 4' or 5' from the speakers, that location can see 104 db peaks, if I am estimating correctly. That's fackin loud enough for me man! lol.
The volume slider rarely goes over 1/2 way.
△ᴉʇɐuᴉɯnllI oᴉpn∀△
Edits: 09/23/15
I actually don't have enough gain in my system to clip my tubes.
In fact, full output of my CD player would cause my 300b to produce 2 watts.
And I run my AVC about 6 to 10 clicks down (2db per click).
So I'm no where near clipping.............ever.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
2 watts max, what! you listening at the level of inaudibility, you have Morricab beat by 28 watts ..
:)
Edits: 09/23/15
"...you have Morricab beat by 28 watts"I don't understand.....
"2 watts max, what! you listening at the level of inaudibility...."
No. My speakers are 97db per watt. I have two of them in the room and 2 watts to drive each with.
That would give me 103db peak.
If the music I listen to has 16db peak to average then I can listen at 87db average. If 20db peak to average then 83db.
85db for 8 hours straight will do permanent hearing damage.
I don't think I ever listen that loud.
BTW I don't use tubes amps for bass for a couple of good reasons.
Edited to correct math errors.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Edits: 09/23/15
Tre,2 watts wont give you 106db from 97db ... not to mention listening distance ..
Edits: 09/23/15 09/23/15
To start with listening distance only enters the equation when your speakers are outdoors.When inside a room the reverberate field takes over at just about one meter in most rooms. (just look it up or ask Paul Joppa)
But yes, I misspoke. 2 97db speakers drive by 2 watts each would give 103db. 100db from each, so added together that's 103db. My mistake. Sorry!
BTW You didn't say what you meant by "you have Morricab beat by 28 watts "
OK I got it.
His Pure Sound A30 doesn't even belong in the same room as his SET.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Edits: 09/23/15 09/23/15
in fact its not! tv duty only... the SETs are upstairs in the big rig
Smart man.
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
In case you missed it, from PC audio forum:
"Gargoyle, you need to refrain from stepping into threads with the intention of trolling, or just adding nothing of substance.
You've been officially warned."
try it! you know you want to!
In case you missed it from THIS forum:
"TO: kuribo and E-Stat
- Cease responding to one anothers' posts.
- If you disagree with each others' response to a post, whether a matter of fact or opinion, direct your alternative perspective to the original poster (so long as it was neither of you). When doing so, do not refer to, obliquely or otherwise, or in any way comment in a manner that impugns, the other; The Bored will be the sole judge of whether or not this has happened and will act accordingly.
- Failure on either of your part to hold up this directive will result in a ban.
- Don't use the Asylum Emailer services to communicate with each other.
Thank you for your immediate cooperation.
BTW kuribo, your non-communication orders with morricab, Jim-whatever-he's-calling-himself-these-days, and jackman stand."
lol.
△ᴉʇɐuᴉɯnllI oᴉpn∀△
nt
try it! you know you want to!
Flying a little to close to the sun in Morricabs thread? lol
Anyhow, I really do want to see your setup, it would help us have some context.
Is it because you are running 85db bookshelf speakers? That is OK, we are not here to judge.
I'm assuming you have the pucks in a chassis by now?
I can share my info if you want, I got build threads, pictures, WinISD, and SPice! Nothing to hide here!
Cheers
△ᴉʇɐuᴉɯnllI oᴉpn∀△
... we really do want to see your setup, too. It would help us have some context. Unless, of course, you're just trolling, again; something for which we are rapidly losing patience.
Fax mentis incendium gloria cultum, et cetera, et cetera...
Memo bis punitor delicatum! It's all there, black and white,
clear as crystal! Blah, blah, and so on and so forth ...
"Unless, of course, you're just trolling, again; something for which we are rapidly losing patience."How is this possibly considered trolling, are you having a bad day?
"... we really do want to see your setup, too. It would help us have some context."
Sure, go nuts, there are pages of information already on here!
△ᴉʇɐuᴉɯnllI oᴉpn∀△
Edits: 09/24/15
> > ... are you having a bad day?
Nope. Just taking into consideration your posting history here and elsewhere on the Asylum. It speaks for itself.
Fax mentis incendium gloria cultum, et cetera, et cetera...
Memo bis punitor delicatum! It's all there, black and white,
clear as crystal! Blah, blah, and so on and so forth ...
If I might jump in here for a moment...
I haven't posted my equipment largely for two reasons: People use the info to judge another person's "audiophile credentials", and, I don't like to broadcast what's in my house. Know what I mean?
:)
nt
try it! you know you want to!
"I don't like to broadcast what's in my house. Know what I mean?"
That's the other reason I like my "not so pretty" DIY stuff.
Who would want it? Most audiophiles aren't thieves.
On the other hand, that pretty, shiny, sparkly store bought stuff........
Tre'
Have Fun and Enjoy the Music
"Still Working the Problem"
Yeow Gary , Why not post yours while you are at it ......
Regards
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