|
Audio Asylum Thread Printer Get a view of an entire thread on one page |
For Sale Ads |
50.131.189.29
In Reply to: RE: No, I do listen...the problem is you don't read.... posted by kuribo on August 09, 2015 at 13:50:23
"Likewise, your theory, which is all it is, that all mods affect sound in some meaningful way, is patently false. Human hearing, like all human senses, has it's practical limits."How do you know it is false when you don't listen?......again, you have no idea of what you are talking. You cannot measure most things that change the sound....it is that simple. You cannot measure them.....how many times do I have to say it. Forever, I guess, because you won't listen and find out for yourself directly.
If you came over to my house I could blow your mind in five minutes.
I had an employee who had never listened to a high end stereo sit in front of my modded Quads years ago. I had her just listen to the cymbals only. Then I went into the bedroom and did something and played the cut again. I asked here if it sounded different this time. She said it sounded smoother and cleaner but did not have any of the audiophile jargon like "less grainy", etc.....so that is all she could say. Then she asked me what I had done and I told her that I had unplugged the digital clock from the wall next to my bed (the whole apartment was on the same power). She could hear this without any prior listening experience.....a total virgin. This game is really subtle....everything makes a difference.As to what is better sound.....well that is all in the ears of the hearers.....simple as that. But everything you do makes the sound different.....so how can you say you like the straight wire approach when every piece of wire sounds different. If he thought the stock NC700 was perfect then why did Bruno put a newer input stage and better output filter caps on the Mola Mola? Does it measure better because he did this.....you know it does not......the game is never ending. Perfection is light years away. The Mola Mola amp is not a straight wire with gain device......try the amp bypass test and then you will know. Nothing passes the straight wire test....not even wire.
I do read what you say......but all your posts are the same......a veiled subtle way of saying that Ncore and measurements are God......it is really too bad you don't get out more....your life would be more fulfilling.
Edits: 08/09/15Follow Ups:
You are as close minded as those you chastise.
There have been loads and loads of tests and research that refute your claims that any and all changes are audible. I am not saying two pieces of wire can not sound differently, only that human hearing has it's limits. Perhaps there is much below our level of auditory perception. You offer nothing but hand waving and a "please believe me"...I have tried lots of tweaks, cables, etc. over the years. Some things are audible, some aren't, and some perceived differences were probably based on biases, not actual differences.
And you completely misunderstand my comments about ncore and measurements. I have only mentioned measurements when someone tries to pull the "mine is better than yours" BS. The only way to judge qualitative differences is through measurable performance. So if you want to talk objective performance, then you have only specs. If you want to claim your amp sounds better than my amp, you are talking subjective performance and there is no way to prove this. This is the reason for all the debate here: some have tried to "prove" their subjective preferences are superior to others by citing pseudo-science based on objective performance measurements.
Again, enjoy your tweaks. Just don't tell me they are anything more than seasonings....
try it! you know you want to!
That explains everthing. :)
The only way to judge quantitative differences is through measured performance".....
The point being, there is no way to measure subjective performance and thus no metric to prove claims of "superior" or "better sound". There is no proving one's tastes are superior to another's. That's been the whole point.
If you make claims about the superiority of one topology or amp over another, the only claims that can be verified are those made about the quantitative, or measurable performance. If you want to argue specs, fine. Ncore can stand against the best.
The "live music" argument is a failure. We all have our own perceptions of what live music sounds like. Just like we all have our own preferences when it comes to which amp sounds best. It's subjective.
try it! you know you want to!
And what are yours?
nt
try it! you know you want to!
nt
try it! you know you want to!
It is through listening to familiar recordings.
But don't tell me your amp is "better" than mine. Or try to tell me my amp is inferior based on objective criteria unless you have the specs to back that up.
try it! you know you want to!
your metric charts give you the greatest listening pleasure.
Others recall musical performances. I get a regular dose with wifey playing her baby grand. :)
nt
try it! you know you want to!
Funny story about recording a baby grand in a friends house some 20 yrs ago , a real eye opener for sure ...
Finally to the meat of the argument. The old objectivist vs. subjectivist diatribe. I don't know about you though, my oscilloscope has never told me whether or not a particular input sounded good...yet.
I dont believe that Cab, your scope has never told you what sounds bad , how is that possible..
umm, you aren't making much sense...did you drink a bit today?
We are drinking the same my friend , cheers.... :)
Too much i guess ..
Edits: 08/09/15
Yeah, I got a few of those...but no longer have a deck to play them on. I sold it when I moved to London for a year. Wasn't getting much use at the time though. I was making recordings of small classical ensembles (up to quartet size) of my ex (a very talented violinist).
I don't know about you though, my oscilloscope has never told me whether or not a particular input sounded good..
It is evident that his exposure to the sound of live, unamplified music is limited.
All I can say is that for me the measurements should be viewed more as a quality control tool for the accurate replication of more audio devices. It allows the designer to see if something went wrong somewhere; either in the design or in a part gone bad.
It CAN be used for design optimization if used in conjunction with psychoacoustics, both models and listening tests. Supposedly Mr. Lamm developed a hearing model in his past and tunes his amps to match what his theory says should be the best for most humans. Seems to have worked pretty well overall I would say...so there are guys out there that know.
So she went in a virgin and left not ..? im sure thats not a unique situation ...
Lol
Edits: 08/09/15
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors: