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In Reply to: RE: "ROBUSTO" 500W Sure Class D posted by Ozzy on February 12, 2015 at 16:55:04
I do understand not everyone is into imaging. Musical texture appears well presented also with the amp.
| retro-thermionic |
Follow Ups:
So this is DIY, not a kit right? What did the parts cost if I may ask.
E
T
No not a kit. The amp board come complete but the rest is off the shelf DIY stuff. I'm not going to quote a price here. The last time I was asked what it cost to build I got banned. And this was for answering a members question. Email me and I will discuss it further.
| retro-thermionic |
Oh OK. I got enough info from all the replies. The main board was the issue. The other stuff is straight forward. Again, looks nice. Well done.
E
T
Thanks for the nice comment.
| retro-thermionic |
YW! But hey the proof is in the pics for all to see. Well done! Now enjoy and report back if things change with break in hours.
E
T
Thanks for the nice comments.
| retro-thermionic |
Under $40 assembled and delivered, based on the International Rectifier Aud7 design with the IRS2092 (used by Behringer, Peavey, Crest, etc.), will run on up to ±80V, max current is 17A RMS.Another one from Sure Electronics (I own three of these):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2-Channel-250Watt-Class-D-Audio-Amplifier-Board-IRS2092-250W-Stereo-Power-hifi/110932803697?_trksid=p2045573.c100034.m2102&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D28797%26meid%3Dbdd619738f724056a019e294874a5845%26pid%3D100034%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D8%26mehot%3Dpp%26sd%3D171668071951#ht_4290wt_1084
Edits: 02/13/15
I am ready to build a three-channel Class D amplifier and I am wondering which modules to use? I especially am a little confused between the low power modules (I presume, the TI design) and the high power modules (the IR designs??). I will do the power supply myself, but I don't want to do any discrete assembly otherwise. Any advice?
Stay away from low power modules. They get harsh when pushed.
| retro-thermionic |
NCore or UCd from Hypex would be something to look at also.
How much power to you think you need? Speaker sensitivity? Listening habits?
Too much is never enough
Listening habits? Not really loud, but enough to fill a 12x12 foot room at the least and a 20x20 foot room at the largest using reasonable good stand-mounted monitor loudspeakers. That's as specific as I can get and not head-banger music. Mostly acoustic music with vocals, but some drum kit would be nice to reproduce as well.
I can find 100W Class-AB modules probably just as easily as Class-D modules, so I am really up in the air. I wanted a compact design and a fan is not a bad option if the music is going to be loud anyway.
Here is a link to HYPEX.
The latest stuff, NCore is not the Least expensive, but is well reviewed.
If your speakers are biamp capable, a pair of stereo amps using one of the smaller modules from the UCd series may fill the bill.
The designer, Bruno P. is quite the nice guy (met him several times) and has a taste for Spicey Mexican food when in Southern California.
Too much is never enough
Yes, I remember hearing a low power 5-watt amplifier at a show that sounded terrific for vocals, but as soon as the music had a mix of frequencies, it fell far flat of what one would want.
I'll take a look at the offerings and 70E is not so bad nowadays when converted to US dollars.
5 watts not enough , get out of here ,,,,,,,,,,,,, :)
I didn't use one with the IRS chip. What do you think of the sound?
| retro-thermionic |
I worked for IR for a decade PLUS. I can assure you that the guys who did the 'd' amp project are NOT, or shall I say were NOT encouraged or permitted to go in 'audiophile' directions. Any thought of choosing some parts based on listening tests was NOT on the table.
I believe IR amps were designed for the commodity installer / OEM market not for the home experimenter or audiophile fringe.
I have a stereo amp 'development' board out in the garage and one day MUST get a transformer and the goods for a PS just to see how well it works.
The guys that did the project ARE music lovers, at least the team leader was, but I think at the time he wasn't heavily involved in audiophilia.
Too much is never enough
Do you know someone that could exploit an idea for a better class D amplifier?
Dead-time is critical, too little and the amp gets hot (from cross-conduction), too much and the sound quality suffers.
I have an idea that eliminates the dead-time issue.
Send me an e-mail if you can help.
Here is link to one of IRs white papers on 'd' design and considerations.
ABout 1/4 the way down is a discussion of dead time and bus pumping.
Too much is never enough
I read that years ago.
It defines the problems, but does not offer solutions.
I have a method that self-adjusts dead time, even with variable loading and drive, and over temperature too.
You need to get a PATENT than see if anyone is interested in paying you to use it.
It might be too late right now or has been thought of and is impractical for one reason or another. Also, if another way to do the SAME thing is found, your patent might get 'worked around'
Than, after the idea gets STOLEN you have to scrape up the funds necessary to take 'em to court.
Some intellectual property types (patents and software) I know tell me a patent is worth something after defense in court.
And yes, the IR aritlcle is NOT meant for heavy engineers of 'd' amps. But rather for informed consumers and technical types wanting a peek under the hood. One of the articles authors, Jun Honda, was my connect guy.
Too much is never enough
I don't want a patent, I have had problems related to patents in the past.
I was looking for someone that had the skill to develop it, and then see where it goes. I don't have the time, or energy, to do it anymore. I don't even care about credit, ideas used to be worth a dime-a-dozen, now they are worth about a dime-a-gross.
I would expect people to rip off the concept when they see what it is, and how simple it will be to build. It might be possible to pot the core drive circuit to conceal it from the lazy, but anyone that really wants to know would de-pot it and figure it out in short order (we have a lab at work that does just that).
Yes, I worked with FA people for several decades and some of the techniques got better over time.
Competition was looked at from cosmetics (how much CAN you really do with a TO5?) to electical performance. Delayering semiconductors was difficult for some layers but could be done.
People don't, and corporations almost for sure don't, fully think things thru. The assumption will be that any idea you try to give them will be worth what you are charging them for it.
You MIGHT have better luck at a college or university where electrical or electronic engineering is taught?
At this point I'll put out a feeler back to my old stomping grounds and see if Jun Honda is still there. HE'S the guy you want to talk to. Write him yourself and see if you get a reasonable answer, open a correspondence with him and see where that leads. Hell, CALL him. He is in the corporate directory if still there.
Too much is never enough
"You MIGHT have better luck at a college or university where electrical or electronic engineering is taught? "Thanks for the ideas, I'll give them a try. I know a recently retired EE prof, he might give me some names to persue.
I have an employment contract that assigns all rights to my employer, even in a field far removed from their core business (not audio related). I asked for a release, and they said no. OTOH, a co-worker that I previously worked with when I was in the audio business asked for a release, and they gave it to him (even though it used technology from our present employer). He was granted the patent, and then the problems started (he could not defend the patant without going broke).
'The Case Against Patents' by Don Lancaster is a good read, my current employer receives a negative mention in there.
Edits: 02/15/15 02/15/15
That's what I've been told. 'A patent is only as good as the court defense'. And that those with really deep pockets trump patent holders.
Too much is never enough
2 items here.
Please read the International Rectifier White Paper which covers the dead time issue as well as MANY other considerations of 'd' design.
and
I'm Out of Touch with my old IR cronies now for quite a few years. I don't know WHO works there any more AND, as a matter of fact, the company was BOUGHT by a European company, so even THAT is unknown to me.
Too much is never enough
Easy article to view. Gives a good overview of Class D amps.
| retro-thermionic |
Thanks for the link to the article. From what I can workout from Sure is there are two different types of class D modules. Ones with IR chips and ones without. I friend who got me into these made a 6 channel with 6 X 100W modules. But when they came from Banggood (i think) two modules were very different. It works out that the two different modules (possibly based on the IR chips) sounded poor compared to the others.
| retro-thermionic |
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