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In Reply to: RE: Crown X4000 follow up posted by E-Stat on October 14, 2014 at 14:05:12
your findings are exactly what I expected you would find just by looking at the amps technical data.
The grain you heard is the sound of 0.5% transistor distortion.
It's not nice.
Follow Ups:
with low impedance loads. That is clearly not the case with this unit. As for the grain, it was not always present. It varied depending upon the speaker driven and the level. With the Acoustats (worst case), it sounded ok at lower levels, but got exceptionally grainy well below clipping.
The distortion I heard was clearly many multiples of 0.5%. Consider that my VTL tube amps are rated at 2% and never sound grainy or strained below clipping.
... like LabGruppen, Crest or MC2, not a prosumer pastiche thereof.
If you google your amp, as I did because it does not appear on the manufacturers web site (its a stripped down special they made for Guitar Center and Musician's Friend) you'll find that even their rep recommends that particular amp to be only used for subs as it is 'a bit dirty'.
Personally I've been using MC2s for quite some time now, they start at £1000 ($1600).
Over the years and across a number of fora I've heard of people preferring them to Chord, Boulder or FM Acoustics. to name just a few.
Not sure if you would call an amp that costs around £2000 and beats those a 'giant killer'.
...not a prosumer pastiche thereof.
That's pretty funny. Perhaps there's a Crown fan here who might take exception to your description of that companies products.
you'll find that even their rep recommends that particular amp to be only used for subs
I'd love to see your reference. Would you kindly provide a link?
I have no issues with Crown amps per se, just these particular bottom-of-the-range models.
Go to post 8 in the link below. Not the original but somebody quoted it verbatim.
Nor does it...
"...or go down to 2 ohms stereo "
I discovered that would be 4 ohms stereo.
Note that the distortion figures are identical to "less dirty models" like the XTI series of switchers
...all I'm saying is that in the end a $300 amp will sound and behave like a $300 amp, regardless if it is aimed at semi-pros or consumers.
Some people say that all amps sound the same but I'm not one of them.
Where pro amps shine is the upper end of the market since they don't feature the almost grotesquely inflated prices of domestic ones.
Once you get into the thousands of dollars per unit level it is quite possible to find pro amps which easily hold their own compared to domestic amps costing tens of thousands.
Then you have to decide for yourself if getting rid of the cooling fans is worth that much extra cash to you. Personally I've made my decision and if the fans annoy me I just turn up the music a notch or two! ;-)
Once you get into the thousands of dollars per unit level it is quite possible to find pro amps which easily hold their own compared to domestic amps costing tens of thousands.
That's always the claim, isn't it? Somehow the *pro* designers have discovered something that others haven't. LOL! Maybe that makes those who own them feel better about the compromises. Requiring fans to me is an indication of poor design. I guess if your primary listening is to Black Sabbath and dub at high levels, then I suspect you'll never hear the difference!
If, however, your musical taste runs to wide dynamic range acoustical music, then fan noise at any level is intolerable. I'll pass on any design that requires such crutches.
Nelson Pass' designs are robust enough to obviate the need for any such distractions. :)
You either need fan or heat sinks.
The rest is surprisingly similar. There are quite a few striking similarities between Nelson's higher powered designs and those of Terry Clarke and Ian McCarthy.
As for my musical proclivities: Those are mostly acoustic blues but otherwise cover everything from classical to aforementioned dub except Jazz and Heavy Metal.
You either need fan or heat sinks.
One maintains low level resolution while the other fails. In the pro world, who cares about low level resolution anyway?
Fans are a poor crutch for sound design.
nt
Dman
Analog Junkie
is most certainly "non-musical". :)
...define as clipping.
The way the maker of my amps and phono pre define it as the point when THD+N rises above -70dB (0.03%) and -80dB (0.01%) respectively.
By their measure that amp of yours is always 'clipping'.
By their measure that amp of yours is always 'clipping'.
Or, as I indicated overloaded past a certain output threshold while driving the low impedance Acoustats. Not, however, when driving the New Advents.
The results are load specific. The Crown by Harman amp (as touted on the box and manual) has difficulty driving low impedance loads.
...if you buy cheap amps: They get unstuck when faced with a difficult load.
Doesn't really matter if its a domestic or pro amp.
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