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Products are a funny thing. Here's a Burson timekeep, nicely built with good parts, 80wpc $2600.
And here's a Parasound A23, nicely built with good parts, $999.
I'm not saying anything about one vs the other (haven't heard either) but it is a funny thing what things sell for.
Would be VERY interesting to compare these.
"We are all in God's hands... and God is a malign thug."
-Mark Twain
Follow Ups:
But how can you compare the quality of the parts from a top down photograph??
What brand of caps, transformers, circuit boards and even heat sinks are used? I don't know from the photos.
For sure the Parasound has MORE parts, which probably weighs in its favor if you consider value based on the number of parts you get for your money but probably weighs against it sonically.
That said, both probably fall short of true high end sound.
Does it get much simpler than this?
http://diyaudioprojects.com/Chip/LM3886_CA/LM3886_CA.htm
Isn't this an opamp? If so it is not so simple inside. Many transistor make up an opamp.
Does it get much simpler than this?
Yes, it does:
Heck, I'm a circuit moron.
Do you know your differential equations?
:)
One active device. Period.
Yes, similar KISS concept, but I believe the SIT amps are based on Field Effect Transistors (vs bipolar) which more closely mimic a triode.
Cool stuff, "Keep It Simple Stupid", or load it up with a ton of parts. ;-)
S tatic I nduction Transistors are similar to the VFETs employed by Sony and Yamaha in the 70s and found nowhere else. They are unlike other FETs or JFETs commonly used today. Nelson Pass found a supplier to custom fabricate a large batch.
SIT design
Scroll down a bit to see a huge pic of the board. While at first glace, it appears to use multiple active devices, count the legs! The two legged devices are Vishay power resistors used in the bias circuit. Other than all the caps used for the power supply, you can count the number of in circuit parts on your hands. :)
...and very pricey!
when you have to spend multiple hundred k$ to custom fabricate unobtainium output devices, it don't come cheap!
If my stats didn't require more ooomph, I'd be tempted.
Hybrid tube/mosfet. Sounds wonderful on Quads.
"We are all in God's hands... and God is a malign thug."
-Mark Twain
My NAT has a simple circuit and a sophisticated power supply. The main circuit is a tube for voltage gain, a tube for a driver and ONE big industrial MOSFET for the output stage (yes it's single ended). THat one big MOSFET is strapped to a very large heat sink. The power supply is sophisticated in that it uses active regulation even for the output stage (another identical industrial MOSFET on it's own huge heat sink), choke filtering (4 chokes!) and monster power transformers with and a lot of uF of capacitance.
The circuit though is super simple, direct coupled (no caps or transformers in the path) and no negative feedback.
Not quite as simple as a SIT from Pass but not too far away.
Croft gear gets knocked a lot for how it measures, not how it sounds. First Watt gear gets praise both for good sound and for good measurement (in conventional terms).
Observe, before you think. Think before you open your yap. Act on the basis of experience.
Might be a little underpowered for my speakers. But then again, the old Cyrus II integrated is almost the same power and seems to be fine, unless I really want to cut loose and crank the tunes (which seems rarer and rarer these days!). Just need more resolution at the power end of things (the table and speakers can deliver)...
Dman
Analog Junkie
Generally speaking, I'm in the less is more camp when it comes to audio.Kind of looks like a medical joke. The doctor gave me a pill. Luckily there are three other pills I can take to control the side effects. Point being that after a certain point - what the heck ARE you doing in there?
I think that's why I like tube amps so much.
Edits: 09/22/14
Try building on of those on your own (obviously if you could). the parts alone quite expensive. Then factor in labor (China). Some little things like advertising and R&D and there you go.
I'm sure if you dissected these units you would find the difference in cost.
However, when you start getting into $10k for an amp - yeah - snake oil economics comes into play. But under $5k you're most likely in the right ballpark.
charles
As pictureguy already stated, the top picture is the Parasound Halo A21 amplifier with 250-wpc into 8-ohms and 400-wpc into 4-ohms. It costs $2500 and can be bridged for mono at 750-watts into 8-ohms. I own one of these and it powers my Thiel CS3.7, 3-ohm speakers beautifully. I don't know anything about the Burson, but I love my Parasound.
Edits: 09/21/14
Thanks! for sharing JE.
I will add Parasound to my list of power amps that drive (appropiately) Thiel loudspeakers.
Do a bit of homework. The Burson can be used as a Stereo amp,or a monoblock.
It is also made in Australia, the Parasound is made in China.
AND?
BTW, the Parasound '23 is something like 400x1 @8.
The '21? I'm guessing at 800x1 @8
The book cautions against <8ohm bridged loads, but It SHOULD work somewhat lower as long as the amp not in a confined space.
The 'key' to getting something as fairly complex as a stereo amp manufactured ANYWHERE is quality. Both the quality systems employed and the quality conviction of the workforce matter, as well as adherence to the construction process and specification for the build.
Too much is never enough
Well, more money doesn't always get you better quality equipment. Now as to the sound of the two I don't know as I have not heard them. But the Burson better sound 1 and 2/3's better than the Parasound......
Beautiful pics!
While I have not heard Parasound's newer offerings, I have heard the older "HCA" series and those amps are quite powerful.
The photo of the Parasound is of an A21, methinks. NOT the '23.
The '23 has INTERNAL heatsinks and the cover goes over them. Not like the '21, which has external heatsinks. Look where the cover attaches. My '23 has NO such attachment points.
Too much is never enough
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