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Vinyl Asylum Welcome Licorice Pizza (LP) lovers! Setup guides and Vinyl FAQ. |
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Vinyl Asylum Welcome Licorice Pizza (LP) lovers! Setup guides and Vinyl FAQ. |
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In Reply to: The problem isn't in the CD and the problem isn't with digital itself... posted by olddude55 on September 14, 2006 at 14:52:52:
Hold on a minute. Although mastering makes a BIG difference, the digital process still leaves a little to desire.As one of the original engineers involved with what led to redbook digital, my main complaints center around 1.it's finite dynamic reference points which severely limits it's usable range, and 2.the apparent lack of resolution within it's harmonic structure.
The lack of resolution is most likely do to the "throwing-away" of the recordings least significant bits.
Ofcourse, it's plagued with other problems as well. We will need a better understanding of what works and what doesn't in the digital domain if we are to have any real hope of improving it.
This post is made possible by the generous support of people like you and our sponsors:
Follow Ups Full ThreadTopic - The room we are in is the "Vinyl Asylum" and Vinyl is an analog format. - Teresa 12:54:33 09/14/06 (187)
- Re: The room we are in is the "Vinyl Asylum" and Vinyl is an analog format. - qualityman 02:33:53 09/16/06 (1)
- Dang, Good Thread Teresa!! - Vinyleer 17:19:51 09/15/06 (0)
- Teresa, in the business world, money talks. If only you put this much energy into selling analog Lps already out there. - jdaniel 12:21:34 09/15/06 (0)
- Looks like you have lots of free time between meals! nt - pt109 04:40:36 09/15/06 (0)
- What A Crock (Long) - Dogface1956 22:57:37 09/14/06 (9)
- Seconded . . . strongly (plonk). /nt\ - HenryH 03:57:46 09/15/06 (0)
- You do know I own a DVD-Audio player don't you? And have owned SACD in the past, but CD, CD? really CD? - Teresa 00:58:02 09/15/06 (0)
- "Forget it, Jake. It's Chinatown." - powermatic 23:24:52 09/14/06 (6)
- Re: 'Chinatown' - one of the all-time greats. - Aleksunder 14:41:51 09/15/06 (3)
- "L.A.C." good- "Chinatown" great. Superb noir, and I mean - powermatic 16:02:52 09/15/06 (2)
- Re: "L.A.C." good- "Chinatown" great. Superb noir, and I mean - Aleksunder 16:15:13 09/15/06 (1)
- Re: Dahlia - powermatic 19:26:35 09/15/06 (0)
- So are you actually saying you wouldn't prefer your new LPs to be from Analog masters? - Teresa 01:00:34 09/15/06 (1)
- Of course I'd like that, but I'd also like to live on Big Rock Candy Mountain. - powermatic 12:17:11 09/15/06 (0)
- Quit pimping your website. Once was enough. - j. barleycorn 20:08:43 09/14/06 (2)
- It’s an information only website I sell nothing. Just the happiness Analog music in all forms brings. - Teresa 20:18:49 09/14/06 (1)
- That's beside the point, and who's to know it won't turn commercial tomorrow? - j. barleycorn 04:33:19 09/15/06 (0)
- It's pretty much all in the mastering... - KyleCoppers 19:09:51 09/14/06 (0)
- you really are totally full of... - tunenut 18:43:51 09/14/06 (0)
- Many recognize the Vinyl Asylum as one of the better AA destinations - bjh 18:38:10 09/14/06 (1)
- What's wrong with people expressing there thoughts - IBSmiester 18:20:28 09/14/06 (0)
- Why you should not put this on your site, Teresa. - raphsdad 18:00:44 09/14/06 (12)
- misleading only in the fact that in is a 10kHz sine wave not a music signal. - Teresa 20:13:07 09/14/06 (11)
- er... - raphsdad 20:35:08 09/14/06 (10)
- I guess I'm just fortunate enough to enjoy both mediums....NT - nubz 17:41:04 09/14/06 (0)
- Well, there'll be peace in Iraq before there's peace here ... - SamA 17:39:41 09/14/06 (0)
- Hey, I've got an LP that sounds like a CD! - raphsdad 17:32:47 09/14/06 (3)
- It could be digitally re-mastered, they don't always put it on they cover or notes ... - Teresa 20:23:22 09/14/06 (0)
- I agree about that LP. Just imagine how bad the ceedee must sound? - artemus 17:51:26 09/14/06 (1)
- Hey, you know what? - olddude55 17:56:26 09/14/06 (0)
- Troll's do not always initiate a thread Sometimes they hi-jack... - hcman 17:22:35 09/14/06 (0)
- Pure and simple - it's trash "science" and doesn't prove squat! - Don T 17:16:56 09/14/06 (5)
- Re: Pure and simple - it's trash "science" and doesn't prove squat! - raphsdad 17:23:40 09/14/06 (4)
- Read this...then you'll understand why 2.2 samples is enough - NewStevo 20:54:50 09/14/06 (0)
- But it is enough! - Don T 19:10:28 09/14/06 (0)
- Predicting the area under the curve...Not much under a 20kHz wave to predict...nt - tweakk 17:31:32 09/14/06 (0)
- i concur - blackwax@mac.com 17:29:53 09/14/06 (0)
- I wouldn't want to listen to a digital source through your system either...nt - tweakk 17:16:19 09/14/06 (0)
- The answer to your question is... - SF tech 16:32:07 09/14/06 (3)
- Yeah,..... - Ozzy 16:35:44 09/14/06 (2)
- She started a website 2 weeks ago - www.records 17:28:39 09/14/06 (1)
- LOL~! - kuma 19:52:27 09/14/06 (0)
- Just when I think you can't get any sillier........ - Ozzy 16:23:38 09/14/06 (1)
- Harumpf!!!!! ;8^) /nt\ - HenryH 16:32:31 09/14/06 (0)
- Re: The room we are in is the "Vinyl Asylum" and Vinyl is an analog format. - Ugly 16:10:53 09/14/06 (0)
- yes, the water is warm - OMalley 16:04:48 09/14/06 (2)
- OMally you nailed them "apologists for the digital heresy" (nt) - Teresa 20:32:17 09/14/06 (1)
- Re: them "apologists...." - powermatic 20:46:34 09/15/06 (0)
- I think you've gone off the deep end! - vinyl-addict 15:42:51 09/14/06 (0)
- Wide dynamic range is one thing important to accurate reproduction - nightdoggy 15:32:14 09/14/06 (4)
- Re: Wide dynamic range is one thing important to accurate reproduction - George Mann 00:47:55 09/15/06 (3)
- OK but I'm talking about dynamic range - nightdoggy 10:42:33 09/15/06 (2)
- Re: OK but I'm talking about dynamic range - George Mann 22:56:03 09/15/06 (1)
- Read this post before responding... - George Mann 23:36:34 09/15/06 (0)
- CD's biggest problem........ no '24 hour" rule to guide playback. 8^}.nt - Scottrt 15:21:05 09/14/06 (2)
- You owe me a new screen; I can't get all of the noodles off of it. )MT( - J. S. Bach 09:27:37 09/15/06 (0)
- Re: CD's biggest problem........ no '24 hour" rule to guide playback. 8^}.nt - matt67bianco 15:52:52 09/14/06 (0)
- Re: The room we are in is the "Vinyl Asylum" and Vinyl is an analog format. - Aleksunder 15:18:52 09/14/06 (1)
- Excellent story and it explains a lot of what happened here in Reno - Teresa 15:26:10 09/14/06 (0)
- Summary of Teresa's position: "Math class is tough!" -nt - Axon 14:53:11 09/14/06 (2)
- There is a digital disturbance that her tinfoil hat isn't filtering out. (nt) - Tightwad 15:13:43 09/14/06 (0)
- WRONG!!!! My position is PRO-DIGITAL propaganda belongs on Digital Drive (nt) - Teresa 14:56:33 09/14/06 (0)
- Who are you addressing? - soundnut 14:51:39 09/14/06 (14)
- Re: Who are you addressing? - Fred J 15:13:21 09/14/06 (3)
- Good one Fred! - vinylkid58 16:04:45 09/14/06 (2)
- Re: Good one Fred! (Totally OT) - Fred J 16:39:42 09/14/06 (1)
- Re: Good one Fred! (Totally OT) - vinylkid58 23:23:48 09/14/06 (0)
- You are joking? Right? (nt) - Teresa 14:57:45 09/14/06 (9)
- No... I'm not joking. - soundnut 15:01:22 09/14/06 (8)
- I'm only talking to the Pro-Digital propaganda crowd, your not one of those are you? - Teresa 15:06:21 09/14/06 (7)
- If you mean by pro-digital... - soundnut 15:13:42 09/14/06 (6)
- My Confession :-(... - Fred J 15:41:33 09/14/06 (2)
- Close... from what I gather, it is the cousin of the lowly mp3. - soundnut 19:44:50 09/14/06 (0)
- me too.... - raphsdad 16:54:58 09/14/06 (0)
- wait until you here Patricia Barber on Vinyl LP. (nt) - Teresa 15:27:44 09/14/06 (2)
- I'd like to. I'd bet it sounds lovely. - soundnut 15:35:01 09/14/06 (0)
- Yeah. Gotta here that there vinyl . . .;8^) /nt\ - HenryH 15:31:29 09/14/06 (0)
- Theresa I have to tell you...I have some digitally-mastered LPs that sound terrific. - olddude55 14:51:32 09/14/06 (5)
- Re: Theresa I have to tell you...I have some digitally-mastered LPs that sound terrific. - Sherlock 17:07:12 09/14/06 (2)
- Irrelevant if the mastering sucks. - olddude55 17:24:25 09/14/06 (1)
- Re: Irrelevant if the mastering sucks. - Sherlock 18:04:04 09/14/06 (0)
- Agreed. There are good and not so good examples of both. - HenryH 15:05:43 09/14/06 (0)
- I concur. - soundnut 15:04:30 09/14/06 (0)
- Well, I'll give you one thing.... - Marshall W 14:50:05 09/14/06 (2)
- Cassettes are for the car and jogging. Just make sure it has Dolby and 70us EQ. - Teresa 14:55:10 09/14/06 (1)
- Dolby...ugh - derekva 22:51:06 09/15/06 (0)
- Teresa....there are a wide number of AES papers and graphs depicting correct information and not bogus lies. - tubesforever 14:48:58 09/14/06 (22)
- Tubes, keep an eye on my web site I will be posting the real deals over the weekend - Teresa 15:09:59 09/14/06 (0)
- The problem isn't in the CD and the problem isn't with digital itself... - olddude55 14:52:52 09/14/06 (20)
- Re: The problem isn't in the CD and the problem isn't with digital itself... - George Mann 21:45:11 09/14/06 (3)
- If you are going to come in here and debate; at least have the courtesy to register. )MT( - J. S. Bach 09:11:17 09/15/06 (1)
- I'm not here to debate... - George Mann 09:27:23 09/15/06 (0)
- Re: The problem isn't in the CD and the problem isn't with digital itself... - mothra 00:52:00 09/15/06 (0)
- Re: Yes! Thankyou olddude55, the truth will out! (nt) - MattC 15:29:37 09/14/06 (0)
- I don't buy this excuse either! (nt) - Teresa 14:59:24 09/14/06 (14)
- Well, that's entirely up to you, but it happens to be the truth. - olddude55 15:19:17 09/14/06 (13)
- Compare Reference Recordings early CDs with the same album. . . - risabet 21:30:12 09/14/06 (2)
- You miss my point - olddude55 02:29:03 09/15/06 (1)
- Indeed I did miss your point. . . - risabet 08:54:48 09/15/06 (0)
- But it would all be on better sounding analog if Digital hadn't hijacked our music. - Teresa 15:31:57 09/14/06 (6)
- Re: But it would all be on better sounding analog if Digital hadn't hijacked our music. - George Mann 22:33:06 09/14/06 (2)
- George you have free use of my web site if that will help. - Teresa 22:37:34 09/14/06 (1)
- Re: George you have free use of my web site if that will help. - George Mann 22:45:19 09/14/06 (0)
- And if my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a wagon. - olddude55 15:44:56 09/14/06 (2)
- but most new recordings are still recorded Digitally. I thought Tony Falkner would lead everyone back to analog - Teresa 15:51:13 09/14/06 (1)
- As long as those new recordings have great sonics, I don't mind at all. - olddude55 15:57:09 09/14/06 (0)
- Yup. - soundnut 15:31:20 09/14/06 (2)
- God's own methane? That must be a heavenly stink! (nt) - Orso 16:52:29 09/14/06 (1)
- Hey Jesus...pull my finger! - derekva 22:54:36 09/15/06 (0)
- Time for a little Ethnic cleansing ? - Fred J 14:44:43 09/14/06 (3)
- I'm ready....I've got that militia pot belly going on...sign me up* - Ernie L 14:54:04 09/14/06 (2)
- By Golly Then it's time to lock and load ! ;-) (NT) - Fred J 15:24:54 09/14/06 (1)
- Chili dogs at ten paces! )MT( - J. S. Bach 09:05:41 09/15/06 (0)
- After two weeks offline . . . - Tightwad 14:30:49 09/14/06 (1)
- It's not dissent! Pro-Digital propaganda belongs on Digital Drive not here!!!! - Teresa 14:34:21 09/14/06 (0)
- The linked thread is still fresh. What do you hope to accomplish? (nt) - soulfood 14:18:19 09/14/06 (19)
- To send the Digital brigade back to Digital Drive and to NEVER have them post there Digital propaganda again ever! - Teresa 14:28:03 09/14/06 (18)
- We are sooo infiltrated. - soulfood 15:56:15 09/14/06 (0)
- It is YOU who are posting digital propaganda (i.e., falsehoods). We're trying to explain the truth..n/t - NewStevo 14:34:31 09/14/06 (16)
- Wrong! Go back to Digital Drive where you belong! (nt) - Teresa 14:35:38 09/14/06 (15)
- Halp! The paranoids are after me ! Mwahahaha! /nt\ - HenryH 14:58:36 09/14/06 (1)
- Infamy! Infamy! - raphsdad 17:39:34 09/14/06 (0)
- You are quite the analog terrorist, aren't you...LOL!..n/t - NewStevo 14:48:03 09/14/06 (4)
- No I want back the music you Digital Monsters stole from us! (nt) - Teresa 15:00:34 09/14/06 (0)
- Allahu Akbar !!...........it's a vinyl Jihad********************* - Ernie L 14:59:53 09/14/06 (2)
- No it's common sense against the Digital Jihad which DO NOT BELONG in the VINYL ASYLUM! (nt) - Teresa 15:02:00 09/14/06 (1)
- Oh...............I stand corrected * - Ernie L 15:04:47 09/14/06 (0)
- Observation... - the_spaminator 14:44:48 09/14/06 (6)
- You sir are a very rude person. Vinyl Asylum has been under attack for over 3 months by these Pro-Digital posters - Teresa 15:16:02 09/14/06 (5)
- Re: Vinyl Asylum has been under attack for over 3 months by these Pro-Digital posters - George Mann 22:39:24 09/14/06 (0)
- stay on your new website - BAN TERESA!!!! - blackwax@mac.com 17:47:32 09/14/06 (3)
- You are a very bad, insulting and rude man. Your mother would be as ashamed of you as I am. - Teresa 19:23:37 09/14/06 (2)
- Re: You are a very bad, insulting and rude man. Your mother would be as ashamed of you as I am. - blackwax@mac.com 21:18:24 09/14/06 (1)
- Go to your room without supper! Read this whole thread you are the head Analog basher and you own a great turntable! - Teresa 22:29:16 09/14/06 (0)
- Maybe this should be called the Analog Kindergarten. (nt) - Biff 14:41:35 09/14/06 (0)
- Here's a challenge for you. Report back what you see... - NewStevo 13:29:22 09/14/06 (12)
- I don't listen to oscilloscopes. Round here we listen to music, that is analog music. - Teresa 14:16:10 09/14/06 (5)
- It isn't about listening. It's about a plot that you think is correct but is NOT. - NewStevo 14:32:03 09/14/06 (4)
- My beef is this is an is the "Vinyl Asylum" not "Digital Drive". It's not only about liking but which sounds like music - Teresa 14:39:52 09/14/06 (3)
- Re: My beef is this is an is the "Vinyl Asylum" not "Digital Drive". It's not only about liking but which sounds like m - Biff 14:43:18 09/14/06 (2)
- Re: My beef is this is an is the "Vinyl Asylum" not "Digital Drive". It's not only about liking but which sounds like m - zedisdead 17:50:00 09/14/06 (0)
- They know me better and know not to cause me any pain if they can help it. (nt) - Teresa 15:34:21 09/14/06 (0)
- One of the worst sounding pieces of equipment I've ever bought had fantastic specs. - artemus 13:51:22 09/14/06 (2)
- What are you talking about?! I didn't say anything about... - NewStevo 14:25:21 09/14/06 (1)
- Geez. Are specs derived from machinery or the human ear? - artemus 16:32:12 09/14/06 (0)
- here's another-- listen without an oscilloscope. - stuck.wilson@gmail.com 13:47:09 09/14/06 (0)
- not on the radar - OMalley 13:31:08 09/14/06 (1)
- Re: not on the radar - Biff 13:47:03 09/14/06 (0)
- I like LPs and I like CDs and I like SACDs and.... - Biff 13:18:40 09/14/06 (12)
- So do I. - jbcortes 14:34:41 09/14/06 (8)
- It's not extreme. Digital is just not an acceptable music carrier. - Teresa 14:50:53 09/14/06 (6)
- Re: It's not extreme. Digital is just not an acceptable music carrier. - mothra 00:56:06 09/15/06 (1)
- Cassettes poor frequency response further proves Digital is just not an acceptable music carrier. - Teresa 01:23:43 09/15/06 (0)
- Re: It's not extreme. Digital is just not an acceptable music carrier. - jbcortes 15:28:09 09/14/06 (3)
- Even SACD or DVD-Audio are not close. And I do own a few DVD-Audio's I can't get on LP. But I am not buying any more. - Teresa 15:43:25 09/14/06 (2)
- "All of my money goes for LPs and 7 1/2-IPS Reel to Reel tapes." I sure hope that you meant "disposable" . )MT( - J. S. Bach 05:32:22 09/15/06 (1)
- Yes "disposable" I still have to eat and pay rent! (;-) nt - Teresa 22:37:25 09/15/06 (0)
- Well said. Thanks. (nt) - Biff 14:39:37 09/14/06 (0)
- Re: I like LPs and I like CDs and I like SACDs and.... - artemus 14:03:44 09/14/06 (2)
- Re: I like LPs and I like CDs and I like SACDs and.... - Biff 14:26:17 09/14/06 (1)
- Where better to be zealous? Or even "over zealous" which calls for a judgement on your part? - artemus 16:34:34 09/14/06 (0)
- It has nothing to do with digital vs analog. It has EVERYTHING to do... - NewStevo 13:13:24 09/14/06 (7)
- Guessswork algorithms not recovered data - FR Drew 14:43:08 09/14/06 (4)
- You simply do not understand the Nyquist-Shannon sampling theorem... - NewStevo 20:32:17 09/14/06 (3)
- Bollocks! if the information isn't there then... - FR Drew 21:59:17 09/14/06 (2)
- The point you are missing...the information IS there. Please read the paper at the link... - NewStevo 07:38:11 09/15/06 (1)
- I'm sorry, but if you don't sample it, it cannot be there. - FR Drew 23:50:36 09/15/06 (0)
- You have never seem me post on Digital Drive to make sure of the ludicrous statements made there are 100% accurate. - Teresa 14:23:48 09/14/06 (0)
- actually.. i see what you're saying.. - stuck.wilson@gmail.com 13:59:38 09/14/06 (0)
- I think some people must enjoy setting off bombs........ - Terry P 13:10:09 09/14/06 (0)
- Well then answer this .... - Garth 13:07:19 09/14/06 (6)
- Music you can find that on any of the analog formats, that is where it resides. (nt) - Teresa 15:47:31 09/14/06 (0)
- And I must ask why you keep bringing up the analog vs. digital debate??? /nt\ - HenryH 13:10:08 09/14/06 (4)
- I've had posts here that were mischaracterized as that and it wasn't her that did it. Saying anything negative . - artemus 13:38:16 09/14/06 (1)
- "she (or anyone else) should have a right to be a vinyl zealot in the Vinyl asylum" - Ernie L 14:10:49 09/14/06 (0)
- Uh, not Garth . . . Teresa. /nt\ - HenryH 13:11:07 09/14/06 (1)
- Uh,, thanks! :-) (nt) - Garth 13:14:33 09/14/06 (0)
Follow Ups
- Re: The problem isn't in the CD and the problem isn't with digital itself... - George Mann 21:45:11 09/14/06 (3)
- If you are going to come in here and debate; at least have the courtesy to register. )MT( - J. S. Bach 09:11:17 09/15/06 (1)
- I'm not here to debate... - George Mann 09:27:23 09/15/06 (0)
- Re: The problem isn't in the CD and the problem isn't with digital itself... - mothra 00:52:00 09/15/06 (0)
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