Interesting Read Indeed...........

Posted by Todd Krieger (A) on April 18, 2015 at 03:09:02

In Reply to: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl posted by bquisp on April 17, 2015 at 14:20:26:

"It is a fact that vinyl sounds different from CDs. And many people prefer vinyl's sound. But it's not clean reproduction of a recording that makes vinyl a preferred format; it's the affect the vinyl adds to a recording that people find pleasing."

I've seen this claim stated before.... When vinyl is played back well, not much is really "added". (Aside from the surface noise.)

"'I don't think that [sound is] really the appeal for people right now,' Lyman says. 'They like the collectability factor. They like the whole ritual and process of listening to it. They're more engaged with the music that way.'"

I don't buy that.... The sound is solely why I still play vinyl.... There isn't really much sentimental value....

"In double-blind tests conducted by Levitin and others - some results of which were published in the Journal of the Audio Engineering Society - listeners cannot tell the difference between high-resolution audio and CD-quality audio."

Although I agree with this hypothesis (people also have a hard time distinguishing 320kbps MP3 from CD quality), I believe there are variables in the recording/playback itself which make it almost impossible to be able to distinguish the difference. Most notably RFI, which IMO makes higher digital resolutions would *worse*. (I hear things going on in analog recordings that I just can't hear when digitized, regardless of resolution.) I am also not certain that higher resolution recording and playback has ever been implemented/executed precisely enough to enable the listener to notice the differences.

"But even if humans can hear or 'feel' above 22 kHz, the experience of listening to high-resolution digital tracks is very different from listening to vinyl. If anything, it's closer to that of the CD."

This reiterates my point.... If higher resolution digital audio didn't have issues with RFI and/or data/timing precision, it should sound more like vinyl than CD. (But without the surface noise.)

"The ticks and pops are gone. There is no disc to ritually flip. The tracks sound closer to what the artist laid down in the studio, but that's only because the distortion and limitations present in the vinyl pressing are no longer part of the experience."

What digital advocates won't tell you is that for CD, the distortion is low at higher frequencies because the harmonics are cut off by the bandwidth limitation. Including the harmonic distortion that may have existed prior to digitization! The distortion would measure lower than from the original analog master tape. (For the exact same reason, the distortion of MP3 at lower frequencies would be lower than that of CD or high-rez digital. The lower bandwidth cuts off harmonics for lower fundamental frequencies.) This is why I personally think "differences in distortion" between vinyl and digitized media is one of the biggest red herrings in audio.

"'I don't think [Pono] can sound better than vinyl,' (Neil Young) said earlier this month at the Consumer Electronics Show. 'Because vinyl is a reflection and any digital is a reconstitution; it's not the same thing.'"

This is my sentiment.... I believe the "reconstitution" is why high-rez doesn't sound like vinyl either. I think the lost signal precision and RFI are the artifacts of the "reconstitution".

But in saying that, I do play CD more than anything else..... Not because I think it sounds better than vinyl, but because with the right playback, it can be almost as satisfying as vinyl, yet a lot more convenient and foolproof.

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Follow Ups Full Thread

Topic - Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - bquisp 14:20:26 04/17/15 (47)

the corporate cabal is out in force. - wolfy 15:49:22 04/22/15 (4)

perception & experience ... - TBone 12:15:21 04/26/15 (0)

You can understand why. - jusbe 14:37:05 04/23/15 (0)

RE: the corporate cabal is out in force. - huubdas 12:16:45 04/23/15 (1)

RE: the corporate cabal is out in force. - wolfy 21:11:03 04/24/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - Dman 10:15:32 04/22/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - Chris from Lafayette 09:21:17 04/22/15 (3)

Anything physical deteriorates. - jusbe 14:44:10 04/23/15 (2)

I suppose it's a threshold thing - Chris from Lafayette 10:02:12 04/24/15 (1)

I hear that - jusbe 13:07:50 04/24/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - Crazy Dave 11:31:05 04/20/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - MusicHead 2 08:14:44 04/19/15 (3)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - fantja 08:29:26 04/19/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - fantja 08:28:35 04/19/15 (1)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - MusicHead 2 09:00:02 04/19/15 (0)

As we're told - Des 17:11:03 04/18/15 (4)

RE: As we're told - huubdas 19:15:15 04/19/15 (1)

With tongue in cheek - Des 20:24:49 04/19/15 (0)

RE: As we're told - huubdas 19:00:58 04/19/15 (1)

Good point. nt - jusbe 01:23:48 04/21/15 (0)

Prefer RBCDs and lossless files - Daverz 13:35:47 04/18/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - Land Shark 10:50:37 04/18/15 (0)

The discussion began over thirty years ago - E-Stat 10:43:40 04/18/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - daleda 08:49:52 04/18/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - Ivan303 08:20:27 04/18/15 (0)

Interesting Read Indeed........... - Todd Krieger 03:09:02 04/18/15 (2)

Universal record - Roseval 06:57:12 04/18/15 (1)

RE: Universal record - Todd Krieger 23:15:30 04/18/15 (0)

I bet we don't see a 'CD Store Day'. nt - jusbe 21:28:43 04/17/15 (4)

Are there any left? (nt) - Crazy Dave 12:18:36 04/23/15 (1)

RE: Are there any left? (nt) - huubdas 13:15:41 04/23/15 (0)

RE: I bet we don't see a 'CD Store Day'. nt - Land Shark 10:53:20 04/18/15 (1)

RE: I bet we don't see a 'CD Store Day'. nt - fantja 11:31:48 04/18/15 (0)

This guy was playing LPs with cactus needles. - Dave Pogue 17:56:15 04/17/15 (7)

Writer's mistake. He was obviously playing shellac with the cactus needles. - Daverz 21:04:47 04/17/15 (1)

RE: Writer's mistake. He was obviously playing shellac with the cactus needles. - Dave Pogue 05:53:17 04/18/15 (0)

RE: This guy was playing LPs with cactus needles. - Tony Lauck 18:46:36 04/17/15 (4)

RE: This guy was playing LPs with cactus needles. - Todd Krieger 04:04:38 04/18/15 (3)

RE: This guy was playing LPs with cactus needles. - Bob_C 15:18:30 04/18/15 (2)

RE: This guy was playing LPs with cactus needles. - Todd Krieger 00:36:47 04/19/15 (1)

RE: This guy was playing LPs with cactus needles. - Todd Krieger 00:40:59 04/19/15 (0)

Tape is a natural medium. It breathes. So is vinyl. Nt - geoffkait 17:47:55 04/17/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - Awacs 17:11:37 04/17/15 (1)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - Awacs 17:12:18 04/17/15 (0)

"Let the discussion begin"........ - Ozzy 17:09:01 04/17/15 (0)

Thank you! A nice article you linked to, bquisp. - Winston Smith 16:02:13 04/17/15 (0)

RE: Why CDs may sound better than vinyl - fantja 15:10:16 04/17/15 (0)

Follow Ups

Interesting Read Indeed........... - Todd Krieger 03:09:02 04/18/15 (2)

Universal record - Roseval 06:57:12 04/18/15 (1)

RE: Universal record - Todd Krieger 23:15:30 04/18/15 (0)

Interesting Read Indeed...........

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