In Reply to: sigh. HDCD posted by farfetched on December 22, 2010 at 01:44:04:
The biggest advantage to an HDCD recording is that the A/D converter was designed by Keith Johnson. It was not equaled until about eight years ago, and has rarely been exceeded to this day.
The second biggest advantage to an HDCD recording is that the A/D converter was designed by Keith Johnson. It was not equaled until about eight years ago, and has rarely been exceeded to this day.
The third biggest advantage to an HDCD recording is that the A/D converter was designed by Keith Johnson. It was not equaled until about eight years ago, and has rarely been exceeded to this day.
All of the rest of the bullshit is just that -- bullshit.
1) There were two options that required decoding for optimal playback -- Peak Extend and Low-Level Extension. These could be turned on and off at the mastering engineer's discretion. NONE OF THE OTHER FEATURES REQUIRED DECODING, NOR COULD EVEN BE DECODED. These included the on-the-fly switchable anti-aliasing filters and the dithering.
BUT EVEN IF ALL OF THE OPTIONS ARE TURNED OFF AND NO DECODING IS REQUIRED, THE "HDCD" LIGHT WILL LIGHT UP AND MAKE YOU THINK YOU NEED A DECODER. This is just one peek at the slimy practices that the marketing arm of Pacific Microsonics engaged in.
2) That leaves two options that could legitimately require decoding. Let's look at Peak Extend first. In the owner's manual for the Pacific Microsonics (PM) Models One and Two (identical except that Model Two allowed for higher sample rates), it say DO NOT USE PEAK EXTEND WITH ROCK MUSIC. Peak Extend does not extend the peaks. Instead it compresses them. Most rock music already has too much compression well before it hits the mastering stage. Adding more compression will make for a truly horrendous sounding disc unless decoded. So PM wisely recommended not using Peak Extend for rock music.
3) All that's left is Low Level Extension (LLE). LLE boosts the gain of the system as the average signal level drops. The more it drops the more it boosts the gain. Again, this is simply a compression system. The nice thing about it is that it can be matched *exactly* upon playback, so there will be no "pumping" or "breathing".
The problem is that it only engages when the average signal level drops below -39 dBFS. Well, not only does this never happen with popular music, it rarely happens with classical music. I know of several people that have reverse engineered the HDCD code and they report that the only time that LLE is engaged is in between tracks. If their reports are accurate, LLE is essentially useless.
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The bottom line is that the ONLY thing that HDCD needs any decoding for is if you are listening to classical music and Peak Extend was engaged during the mastering process. For all else, the ONLY thing you are hearing that creates the good sound quality is Keith Johnson's brilliant design work.
I know this will come up again, so I will reiterate it. THERE ARE NO MULTIPLE PLAYBACK FILTERS. THERE NEVER HAS BEEN AND NEVER WILL BE.
I apologize for being so cranky, but there are so many myths and so much misinformation that keeps being perpetuated. This entirely the fault of PM's marketing department, who played fast and loose with the facts. To the degree that I would bet that Keith Johnson cringes when he sees some of the things that his name has been associated with.
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Follow Ups
- THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Charles Hansen 18:33:31 12/23/10 (98)
- Not a lot of HDCD out there... - Charles Hansen 09:21:08 01/06/11 (0)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Rob Bertrando 20:28:15 01/03/11 (12)
- The Grateful Dead HDCD discs I have looked at are FAKES! - Charles Hansen 10:15:50 01/06/11 (9)
- RE: The Grateful Dead HDCD discs I have looked at are FAKES! - Rob Bertrando 16:26:29 01/08/11 (1)
- RE: The Grateful Dead HDCD discs I have looked at are FAKES! - Charles Hansen 10:43:08 01/10/11 (0)
- RE: The Grateful Dead HDCD discs I have looked at are FAKES! - farfetched 07:54:12 01/07/11 (5)
- here, to be specific - farfetched 07:56:36 01/07/11 (4)
- I analyzed several cuts of each disc - Charles Hansen 12:05:21 01/07/11 (2)
- RE: I analyzed several cuts of each disc - August West 23:35:47 10/07/14 (1)
- RE: I analyzed several cuts of each disc - fantja 05:32:48 10/08/14 (0)
- RE: here, to be specific - Charles Hansen 08:45:02 01/07/11 (0)
- RE: The Grateful Dead HDCD discs I have looked at are FAKES! - Tony Lauck 19:15:48 01/06/11 (0)
- thnx - farfetched 00:46:19 01/06/11 (0)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Charles Hansen 23:16:01 01/03/11 (0)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - audiophilect 11:03:53 12/31/10 (47)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Charles Hansen 15:52:07 12/31/10 (46)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - glen55 20:35:38 01/04/11 (1)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Charles Hansen 17:26:40 01/05/11 (0)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - audiophilect 07:43:29 01/01/11 (27)
- Foobar is a very quirky product! - Charles Hansen 13:34:20 01/01/11 (26)
- ABORT, FAIL, RETRY!!! - Charles Hansen 17:52:23 01/01/11 (25)
- RE: ABORT, FAIL, RETRY!!! - audiophilect 18:58:53 01/01/11 (24)
- Nice work! - Charles Hansen 19:27:02 01/01/11 (23)
- RE: Nice work! - audiophilect 12:33:30 01/02/11 (22)
- Actually backwards... - Charles Hansen 13:33:01 01/02/11 (21)
- RE: Actually backwards... - audiophilect 14:20:16 01/02/11 (3)
- I think we're on the same page - Charles Hansen 15:08:16 01/02/11 (2)
- RE: I think we're on the same page - audiophilect 17:51:02 01/02/11 (1)
- RE: I think we're on the same page - Charles Hansen 18:21:31 01/02/11 (0)
- appreciate all of the info - Joe Murphy Jr 13:58:43 01/02/11 (16)
- RE: appreciate all of the info - farfetched 07:52:17 01/07/11 (10)
- I've been pissed at Pacific Microsonics for 15 years - Charles Hansen 08:38:35 01/07/11 (9)
- that's very obvious ... so much so ... - TBone 15:07:06 01/11/11 (6)
- RE: that's very obvious ... so much so ... - Charles Hansen 22:01:11 01/12/11 (5)
- c'mon Charles ... life's to short .... - TBone 10:40:39 01/13/11 (4)
- RE: c'mon Charles ... life's to short .... - Charles Hansen 16:09:30 01/14/11 (3)
- c'mon Charles, you lack experience & perspective in this matter ... - TBone 12:33:05 01/18/11 (2)
- RE: c'mon Charles, you lack experience & perspective in this matter ... - Charles Hansen 09:58:54 01/20/11 (1)
- more HDCD player perspective ... - TBone 11:47:46 01/20/11 (0)
- RE: more HDCD player perspective ... - Charles Hansen 21:57:26 01/23/11 (0)
- MP filter/more player history/perspective ... - TBone 11:47:58 01/25/11 (0)
- probably - farfetched 01:45:46 01/09/11 (1)
- RE: probably - Charles Hansen 17:56:26 01/09/11 (0)
- Thanks - Charles Hansen 15:09:49 01/02/11 (4)
- whadayaknow - Joe Murphy Jr 20:35:21 01/02/11 (3)
- Kind of pathetic... - Charles Hansen 08:24:16 01/03/11 (2)
- that's some serious gear - Joe Murphy Jr 12:14:32 01/03/11 (1)
- RE: that's some serious gear - Charles Hansen 13:11:42 01/03/11 (0)
- further "reference" - Joe Murphy Jr 00:07:00 01/01/11 (4)
- I don't have them here at the house - Charles Hansen 13:27:16 01/01/11 (3)
- Two more RR discs - Charles Hansen 11:38:28 01/02/11 (0)
- Update: RR-90, Jose Serebrier with the London Philharmonic - Charles Hansen 15:31:49 01/01/11 (1)
- Correction on LLE details - Charles Hansen 22:25:26 01/01/11 (0)
- And three more Joni Mitchell discs - Charles Hansen 22:38:31 12/31/10 (0)
- Finally! - Charles Hansen 22:04:28 12/31/10 (0)
- Another FAKE "HDCD" - Charles Hansen 21:54:21 12/31/10 (0)
- Another FAKE "HDCD" - Charles Hansen 21:43:50 12/31/10 (0)
- Another FAKE "HDCD" - Charles Hansen 21:31:51 12/31/10 (0)
- Another FAKE "HDCD" - Charles Hansen 21:18:18 12/31/10 (0)
- Another FAKE "HDCD" - Charles Hansen 21:08:14 12/31/10 (0)
- Another real HDCD disc - Charles Hansen 20:55:02 12/31/10 (0)
- Finally! - Charles Hansen 17:39:24 12/31/10 (0)
- Another FAKE "HDCD" - Charles Hansen 17:11:45 12/31/10 (0)
- A real fake - Charles Hansen 16:14:31 12/31/10 (0)
- ok, talk about timing: the newest TAS on KOJ - farfetched 21:21:53 12/29/10 (0)
- For the 1st time, during an audition, my HDCD player easily blew away your Ayre ... - TBone 10:16:47 12/29/10 (7)
- Actually our new DX-5 decodes HDCD - Charles Hansen 15:36:40 12/29/10 (6)
- Charles, look at me ... - TBone 10:37:21 01/11/11 (1)
- Fair enough - Charles Hansen 15:42:07 01/14/11 (0)
- RE: Actually our new DX-5 decodes HDCD - audiophilect 10:45:53 12/31/10 (1)
- RE: Actually our new DX-5 decodes HDCD - Charles Hansen 16:17:51 12/31/10 (0)
- this for some reason is starting to remind me of sam tellig - farfetched 20:27:31 12/29/10 (1)
- RE: this for some reason is starting to remind me of sam tellig - Charles Hansen 21:06:23 12/29/10 (0)
- since you're on a roll... - Joe Murphy Jr 19:55:51 12/25/10 (6)
- RE: since you're on a roll... - Charles Hansen 16:40:32 12/27/10 (5)
- you're saying all 16-bits are "music" - Joe Murphy Jr 07:45:38 12/28/10 (4)
- No - Charles Hansen 20:27:20 12/28/10 (1)
- got it -- thank you [nt] - Joe Murphy Jr 20:59:43 12/28/10 (0)
- RE: you're saying all 16-bits are "music" - John Elison 09:08:18 12/28/10 (0)
- licensing, not encoding - slider 08:58:15 12/28/10 (0)
- here is the orignal AES paper and more info on HDCD - Ole Lund Christensen 01:45:08 12/25/10 (11)
- I'm not missing anything - Charles Hansen 14:01:14 12/25/10 (5)
- RE: I'm not missing anything - Ole Lund Christensen 04:31:15 12/26/10 (2)
- RE: I'm not missing anything - Charles Hansen 19:11:00 12/27/10 (0)
- RE: I'm not missing anything - John Elison 18:12:46 12/26/10 (0)
- RE: I'm not missing anything - Tony Lauck 16:00:52 12/25/10 (1)
- RE: I'm not missing anything - Charles Hansen 17:47:21 12/25/10 (0)
- RE: here is the orignal AES paper and more info on HDCD - Tony Lauck 07:50:12 12/25/10 (4)
- RE: here is the orignal AES paper and more info on HDCD - Ole Lund Christensen 12:58:34 12/25/10 (3)
- RE: here is the orignal AES paper and more info on HDCD - Tony Lauck 13:33:16 12/25/10 (2)
- RE: here is the orignal AES paper and more info on HDCD - Ole Lund Christensen 04:53:46 12/26/10 (1)
- RE: here is the orignal AES paper and more info on HDCD - Tony Lauck 06:17:53 12/26/10 (0)
- Low Level Extension - fmak 06:55:32 12/24/10 (0)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Todd Krieger 19:49:19 12/23/10 (4)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Charles Hansen 10:24:22 12/24/10 (2)
- RE: THE TRUTH ABOUT HDCD (For the 39th time) - Todd Krieger 20:00:57 12/25/10 (1)
- as good as the Spectral HDCD DAC was ... - TBone 10:23:08 12/29/10 (0)
- Don't forget the Superb one Mike Moffat-- - Des 22:20:48 12/23/10 (0)