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Another Vinyl to iPod question (repost from Vinyl Asylum)

68.52.124.184
Posted on October 27, 2004 at 08:31:03
roadie
Audiophile

Posts: 64
Joined: July 1, 2003
 In short, if I am going to take the time to transfer my vinyl into 1's and 0's, I am going to do it at the highest quality possible. My understanding of the iPod is that it is nothing more than a hard drive, so therefore, you CAN load uncompressed music onto it. So my plan is to find a computer program that will record audio at 24bit/96K, and transfer the recording from my hard drive directly to the iPod. Question 1: is my understanding of the iPod correct...can I load a file that big onto it? is it even worth recording at 24bit/96K if the iPod is going to inherently downgrade the sound quality? (I do not care about how much space it will take up on the iPod, i plan on getting the largest GB version available, and as long as i can get about 30 albums on one i'm happy).

OK, second question. If this is theoretically possible, i still have a problem. My only computer is a stripped down IBM thinkpad. The only audio in is a little microphone jack which i'm sure isn't stereo (though someone correct me if i'm wrong). So, does anyone make an outboard soundcard that i can run L/R RCA's into, and connect to my computer via USB?

And lastly, what software programs would you recommed for this?

Thanks in advance. I've been gone from these parts for awhile. its good to be back.

 

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Re: Another Vinyl to iPod question (repost from Vinyl Asylum), posted on October 27, 2004 at 09:41:28
provny
Audiophile

Posts: 97
Location: New York City
Joined: March 28, 2002
 I will soon be trying something like this. My understanding is that you will need to do as follows:

1. Install iTunes on your laptop. You will use iTunes to manage the music and copy it to your iPod. You will be able to use Apple Lossless format.

2. M-Audio's Audiophile USB ($200 or so retail), will give you a USB connection to your laptop, and RCA connection to your phono stage.

3. Something like BIAS' PEAK LE will give you the basic ability to transfer vinyl to your computer. This software retails for about $100.

 

Vinyl to iPod- my experience- long, posted on October 27, 2004 at 13:02:58
Bill Brown
Audiophile

Posts: 53
Joined: August 30, 2001
 I have been unable to get My iPod to play back anything greater than 44k/16 bits.

I have loaded 24bit/44k, 24bit/88k AIFF files to my hard drive (vinyl recorded on an Alesis Masterlink). I then transferred them to the iPod. Won't play.

Converting 24/44 files via Apple Lossless Compression results in a file described as 16/44. Plays without problems off hard disk (in a Apple G5 dual 1.8 computer) or iPod.

Then tried applying Apple Lossless to the 24/88 AIFF files (which, interestingly, when loaded on the hard drive show up as 24/65k (?)- a separate issue that I would love to understand- they play back via the computer D/A converters normally). This results in tempo/pitch shifted music, i.e. Apple Lossless as far as I can tell doesn't work with sampling rates > 44k.

My questions/struggle has been obtaining/managing adequate resolution files on my hard drive. I haven't been troubled by the sound quality of my 24/44 > 16/44 via ALC as rendered by the iPod.

BTW, as relates to the other threads re. USB, SPDIF, etc. I have ordered a Benchmark DAC1, planning to connect it to the computer via TOSLINK (and hoping that the claimed, and perhaps demonstrated, jitter reduction of the Benchmark will result in a nice combination). I have been apprehensive re. an electrical connection between the computer and the outside world since having a hum/ground problem that I couldn't fix with an internal Lynx card.

I'd love to here others' experiences/ideas as well, though I am leaving town shortly until tomorrow evening. Good luck!

 

Re: Another Vinyl to iPod question (repost from Vinyl Asylum), posted on October 27, 2004 at 15:10:59
Olav Sunde


 
Hi,
I do not own an iPod, but re. your second question I have had a test setup for some time, learning how to do vinyl transfers to digital. I use a M-Audio Transit for AD to USB to a 500MHz laptop.
The most difficult was actually to find a good recording software that did not use all the CPU power while recording and having the necessesary functionality. After trying maybe 100 (!)different programs I settled for CdWave http://www.cdwave.com. This is by far the best PC app I've found for recording from analog/vinyl to HighRez LPCM. It is very easy to split the resulting wav into tracks and saving standard format .CUE sheet that can be read by players like Foobar2000 etc. The program has support for 24bit, is small in size, very fast and uses very little CPU. And it is Shareware, only $15 with secure on-line purchase.
I use a passive volume control between my phono stage and the line input of the Transit. The digital recording level should be set to full, ie. no attenuation in the digital domain, to use full digital resolution.
The M-Audio Transit is VERY good for the price, but could be tweaked a little for better performance - separate power supply instead of feeding off the USP port, changing the electrolytic capacitors in the signal path and maybe a better clock to replace the on board crystal.
For a permanent setup I will probably look at a better AD converter like the new Apogee Rosetta 200 with the FireWire card installed.
Hope this helps

regards Olav Sunde

 

DAC is the issue, posted on October 28, 2004 at 09:39:08
Gordon Rankin
Manufacturer

Posts: 2928
Joined: June 9, 2000
 Bill,

I think it has too do with the dac in the iPod. I think it is only capable of 48/16, I am looking for my schematics too see if I can find that out... but my office is a mess.

AHHHH Oh well... each of the last few iPods have had different dacs but I think the top output is 48/16. Though I have not tried to convert anything to 48/16 it might be worth a try.

Thanks
Gordon
J. Gordon Rankin

 

Re: Another Vinyl to iPod question (repost from Vinyl Asylum), posted on October 28, 2004 at 13:12:44
Ross


 
I use a PC but the general process is the same.

I use the M- Audio Audiophile USB. This is a self powered external ADAC that has a USB output and RCA line level inputs. It is capable of up to 24/96 conversion.

For software, I use 2 shareware/freeware programs. I tested probably 20 seperate programs, but decided that these 2 satisfy my needs.

Wave Repair and Audacity.

Wave Repair is very easy to use and does not use a lot of system resources. It is limited to 16/44 resolution however. It has rudimentary editing capabilities. The interface is intuitive and resembles a tape deck.

Audacity is also easy to use, but consumes a lot of system resources. This program as extensive editing capabilities. I would suggest a minimum of 256mb of RAM for this program.

I have converted a number of cassettes to digital using Wave Repair and then edited using Audacity. Audacity can import your entire unbroken file and has the ability to export selections as discrete files, in whatever format you choose. What I do is highlight a section corresponding to a track, and then export as a .WVE file.

I have verifed that Audacity can record, save, and edit a full 24/96 file.

A simple web search will give you the download sites for each.

Best,

Ross

 

Re: DAC is the issue, posted on October 28, 2004 at 22:37:22
Bill Brown
Audiophile

Posts: 53
Joined: August 30, 2001
 I suspected that was the case. The iPod (hard drive) seems to store/handle the files fine, just not replay them via the DACs.

Now, if I could just figure out why my 24/88 AIFF files all store in iTunes as 24 bit/ 65.535Khz. Any ideas based on your advanced technical knowledge/understanding?

Thanks,

Bill

 

Bill as a programmer I can only assume...., posted on October 29, 2004 at 10:59:05
Gordon Rankin
Manufacturer

Posts: 2928
Joined: June 9, 2000
 Bill,

Bill as a programmer I can only assume that it is an unsigned integter of 16 bit quantity and therefore the maximum it will take would be 65535.

Seems unlikely though as I did some work with iTunes and Firewire dac and there it was 2 channel and 24/192 but I never actually look at the data going out much as the circuit that Apple/Oxford Semiconductor was pushing was complicated and high in jitter.

I know Atkinson is pushing higher rates in some other applications, why not ask him.

Thanks
Gordon
J. Gordon Rankin

 

Thank you, good idea (nt), posted on October 29, 2004 at 18:36:51
Bill Brown
Audiophile

Posts: 53
Joined: August 30, 2001
 nt

 

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