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Singzer SU-1 USB Converter

108.249.169.177

Posted on September 22, 2016 at 14:19:32
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
I have used various USB converters between my Macbook Pro and Audio-GD Master 7 dac
Ihave used the Breeze, Gustard 12 and the Melodious.
The melodious has been my favorite improving the sound as opposed to using the USB inpute of the Master 7. All 3 of these dacs use the XMOS 8 converter chip.
Now XMOS has a new much faster chip called the 2Xmos 208 chip.
The Sinhzer SU-1 is the first converter to use this chip. I am currently going from the chip to the Master 7 using digital cable with BNC connectors. I will eventually use the I2S hdmi connection once I receive an adaptor. This is supposed to be the best sounding way to go using a short HDMI cable
The sound of this converter is stunning. Bass definition is the best I have heard. The resolution and transparency is outstanding. It stays clean no matter how lod you play it. Very analog sounding.
It sells for $399 from the folling distributor and ships right hear in the USA
Here is a link
https://kitsunehifi.com/product/singxersu1black/
If you stream from a computer to a dac using USB this is a must have
Speak to Tim Conner at Kitsunehifi.com
Alan

 

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RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 23, 2016 at 12:24:24
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
Someone asked how is it powered
120V AC
It has an AC plug
Alan

 

Here's the original circuit by the same folks..., posted on September 23, 2016 at 13:57:51
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001

this version is powered by the source but...

Folks over on the Audio-GD Head-fi board are using it as a direct replacement for the AMANERO card with good results as that terminal strip on the card is an I2S out.

I have heard this card powered by a uRendu and it sounds great!




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 23, 2016 at 14:59:18
beppe61
Audiophile

Posts: 4705
Joined: January 29, 2004

Hi!
it was me thanks. I did not check the link you attached.
Very nice unit indeed. I would try also the balanced out.
I have the Melodious also old version. I like it a lot.


Kind regards,
bg

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 23, 2016 at 15:48:33
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
The Melodius was also my favorite untill I got the Su-1. There is no comparison. The balanced out is nice but I2S is the best along with the SPDIF with BNC connectors. That is what I am using untill my Master 7 HDMI is converted from a J45 connector to a HDMI connector
Alan

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 24, 2016 at 03:45:13
beppe61
Audiophile

Posts: 4705
Joined: January 29, 2004

Hi !
thanks again for the very valuable advice.
I have a dac with I2S input actually, the Gustard X20 I bought but it is still in the box (i am in the middle of a relocation).
I will study about the I2S option.

Kind regards,
bg

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 24, 2016 at 19:21:40
motberg
Audiophile

Posts: 66
Joined: May 19, 2013
Thanks for the review.

I also tried a SU-1 (HDMI i2S) to my Audio-GD NOS7 DAC.
I agree with the remarkable extension and detail, but in my system I prefer the Tanly DDC convertor which may not be as extended but has a more relaxed/analog presentation to my ears..

I still have the SU-1 and has over 300 hours on it now - maybe I will give it another try on the NOS7 sometime in the future.. I also have a NFB-1DAC 2016 that I am breaking in as an alternate source.

The SU-1 (used as an SPDIF/AES convertor) has an interesting review at basshead.club which also mentions good performance from a Lynx E22 pcie/AES card which is more expensive than the SU-1.

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 24, 2016 at 20:22:38
Kody
Audiophile

Posts: 62
Joined: September 14, 2016
"If you stream from a computer to a dac using USB this is a must have"

I will be streaming from my silent PC to a DacMagic. So this device sits between the PC and the DAC and improves the listening experience strikingly enough to shell out $399?

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 24, 2016 at 21:59:19
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
In my system it does
Alan

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 24, 2016 at 22:00:27
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
Do you run your master 7 in the NOS mode?
Alan

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 24, 2016 at 23:07:27
Kody
Audiophile

Posts: 62
Joined: September 14, 2016
Hi Alan,
I'm a complete novice to both audio and PC audio. My DAC arrived just today and is still in the box. I'll unbox it when my X14As arrive on Monday, and I install and configure everything. As such, I've no idea what a master 7 or NOS mode is. However, I am very interested in finding out.

My goal is to keep my system as simple as possible while producing the best sound possible. However, I am interested in adding anything that can significantly improve my sound, such as the USB converter you mention above.

I do feel that I am building upon a good platform. A few years ago, I built my current PC to be as silent as possible. I wasn't into audio, just wanted a silent PC. The system has a fanless PSU, fanless video card, Noctua heatsink with no fan, and a SSD. No fans, well ventilated, and dead silent.

I was under the impression that improving the sound quality with my current setup ended with the USB DAC. So I'm quite excited to learn of the USB converter. Again, I don't know what master 7 and NOS mode is, but I'm intrigued and would like to know.

I'll see what I can find on the web and read up. However, also very interested in what you have to say.

Edit:
I don't have a master 7. Have a Cambridge Audio DacMagic Plus still in the box. Any idea if this USB converter will improve the sound from my setup?

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 25, 2016 at 02:00:10
motberg
Audiophile

Posts: 66
Joined: May 19, 2013
I had my Master 7 converted to the NOS7 model at the Audio-GD factory. It is now set in the "NOS1" mode (original factory settings for the NOS7 DAC). The computer is fanless, all LPS/SSD/etc., with a PPA v2 card and Intona and Recovery in the path to the Tanly. This particular setup I would say leans towards warmish, but with a soundstage presentation that would be difficult to describe -- smaller.. but in some ways similar to some wonderful Beveridge (model 2's?) I heard many years ago..

My guess is the brightness I noticed with the SU-1 could be due to my speakers probably have a peak at 10 kHz. I never measured them but it seems to be a characteristic of the type of ribbons I have.. (from Mark & Daniel)

The SU-1 low bass extension was pretty wild also.. to balance the bass coming off the SU-1 I needed to shut off my subs (they are normally set with a sharp 40hz LP filter) and move my chair a few inches to get the listening position deeper into the 80hz room suck-out... (I have a small square room, but I consider it well treated)

The SU-1 general sound was similar either using BNC/SPDIF or i2S HDMI with the i2S offering better overall clarity.

I have had quite a few other DDC's also around the same price range, the Tanly seems to offer the best synergy for me currently. I am not sure the Tanly is still in production. some info here: tanly-audio.blogspot.com

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Asynchronous-USB-interface-DoP-over-SPDIF-DSD-I2S-over-HDMI-LVDS-SDIF-3-XMOS/1982763625.html

 

RE: Singzer SU-1 USB Converter, posted on September 25, 2016 at 02:25:50
motberg
Audiophile

Posts: 66
Joined: May 19, 2013
You may not need all the features of the SU-1. From the same company is what Ivan303 posted (Singxer F-1), but you still need to provide some clean 5V power through the USB line to make the most of this investment, so the total cost could be getting pretty close to the SU-1 unless you already have something for cleaning up or replacing the power from the computer.

http://www.shenzhenaudio.com/singxer-f-1-xmos-usb-digital-interface-board-xu208-chip-high-end-u8-upgraded-version.html

I am not an EE, but I remember there are solid technical reasons these boxes and cards can help, besides the actual signal processing performed, these cards may offer superior isolation between your computer and DAC and also there may be benefits to doing the initial USB processing outside the DAC case. Any improvement would depend on the quality of the USB processing that is already built into your DAC. My guess is you can search the web a bit and see if other folks have been using similar devices (sometimes called a DDC) with your DAC with any success.

 

Guessing that the SU-1 still kicks the AMANERO card to the curb?, posted on September 25, 2016 at 07:40:12
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001

Even thought you like the Tanly better?

I have both the Master-7 and the Master-11, one with HDMI, the other with RJ-45. Have been reading on Head-Fi of those who are replacing the AMANERO with the F-1 XU208 U8 XMOS USB card pictured above which purportedly fits and comes with a terminal strip that allows easy plug-in.

Only downside is that it is USB source-powered, but that's an easy fix with an external USB power source and a suitable cable for both USB and power.


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: Guessing that the SU-1 still kicks the AMANERO card to the curb?, posted on September 25, 2016 at 08:58:36
motberg
Audiophile

Posts: 66
Joined: May 19, 2013
My NOS 7 DAC does not have any USB input, I opted for both the RJ45 and HDMI versions of i2S inputs.. so not possible for me to compare the Amanero vs the SU-1 in the NOS 7.

The F1 is still not cheap, maybe more $$ than the Amanero. I just checked Taobao and saw that the version in the box is offered there.

https://world.taobao.com/item/535647158584.htm?fromSite=main&spm=a219r.lm0.14.10.NXGuKG&ns=1&abbucket=2#detail

My NFB-1DAC 2016 does have the Amanero, but it is still breaking in so I have not yet seriously compared vs the SU-1, but I have heard the NFB-1DAC 2016 with the SU-1 (via a 50CM BNC/SPDIF cable from Audio-GD) and the also briefly using the Amanero USB and my first impression would be the SU-1 will be preferable. The NFB-1DAC 2016 i2S input is RJ45, so no i2S connection with the SU-1...

I actually think in many ways the SU-1 is subjectively technically better than the Tanly also, just in my rig and for my preferences the synergy works to near perfection with the Tanly and this new NOS stuff from Audio-GD.

For example, with the SU-1 I can more clearly/easily hear the details of the high end of cymbals.. I have been thinking that (to me) the SU-1 sounds more like a live solo mic feed, while the Tanly sounds more like standing on stage a few meters from the drum kit with the band playing.

As I mentioned earlier, the SU-1 extension at both ends and overall clarity is remarkable.. I have no idea how 2 identical sets of bits can sound so different..

One thing I am not sure of is if the SU-1 uses the USB line 5V for the input half of the board.. If so I think that would open some interesting possibilities for optional powering of the SU-1 also.

 

I'll likely get one of each..., posted on September 25, 2016 at 09:20:06
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
The "Singxer F-1 XMOS USB Digital Interface Module XU208 U8 with CNC SHELL all-in-one" pictured above to be powered by a USB source (Regen) and the SU-1 for use with the Master-7 in my main system.

If I had a suitable work space here I would just swap out the AMANERO card for the F-1 card and be done with it on both systems but...

Sadly all of my stuff for that is in storage. :-(


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: Guessing that the SU-1 still kicks the AMANERO card to the curb?, posted on September 25, 2016 at 09:31:54
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
IThe Szinger su-1 has a 110v supply so it must not take any power from the computer
Also for $25 you can get an audio-gd module and easily 9I hope) replace the J45 With an HDMI input. I will be doing that as soon as I get the module. I will report on the rsults
Alan

 

RE: I'll likely get one of each..., posted on September 25, 2016 at 09:37:45
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
I spoke to 2 friends that have a master 7 and tried both swapping out the amanero board with the F1 Or leaving the amanero board in and feeding the Master 7 with the SU-1. Both have told me that the SU-1 was clearly the better sounding. That is what I am doing. I also feed the SU-1 with a Regen feeding aIntona isolater into the SU-1. I have not had to evaluate the various hookup possibilities this stuff allows. Just don't have the time
Alan

 

Guessing that the PS in the SU-1 is better..., posted on September 25, 2016 at 10:06:51
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
than the USB source +5 volt supply powering the F-! from whatever they are using a USB input.

Know someone using the F-1 board in a home made box but he is powering it from a uRendu running on a TaraDak LPS.


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

Please do..., posted on September 25, 2016 at 10:09:39
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
My Master-11 has the RJ-45 while my Master 7 is HDMI.

Don't remember why.




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: Guessing that the SU-1 still kicks the AMANERO card to the curb?, posted on September 25, 2016 at 18:06:42
motberg
Audiophile

Posts: 66
Joined: May 19, 2013
"Also for $25 you can get an audio-gd module and easily (I hope) replace the J45 With an HDMI input."

Thanks for the info! - when I bought the NFB-1, I noticed that Audio-GD did not offer the HDMI i2S as an option, so I did not ask. I will check on that for my NFB-1.

 

RE: Please do..., posted on September 25, 2016 at 18:12:49
motberg
Audiophile

Posts: 66
Joined: May 19, 2013
I have successfully used a 1 meter Wireworld Starlight 6 HDMI cable for the i2S between the Tanly and NOS 7 with no perceptible loss in SQ over the normal 0.3M length I usually use.

From what I have been reading for RJ45 i2S, 0.3M seems about the maximum safe length, but could be technically superior due to no transmitter/receiver modules in the path..

 

RE: I'll likely get one of each..., posted on September 25, 2016 at 18:29:13
motberg
Audiophile

Posts: 66
Joined: May 19, 2013
I tried the SU-1 with, and briefly without, the W4S Recovery in the path. The Recovery is powered by a special model LPS from TeraDak and with an iFi iDC Purfier additionally plugged into the Recovery end... I preferred the sound with the Recovery in the path, but it was not a very big difference (could have been expectation bias actually.. though with this computer audio stuff, things rarely go exactly the way you would expect them..)

Thanks for the comments, SU-1 vs. various modules built it.. If my Google translation worked correctly, there was a recent comment at the Audio-GD BBS (from Audio-GD) that it was easier to get good power to the USB components when they are mounted in a box outside the DAC..

 

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