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Beecham Scheherazade available at HDTT, finally

98.255.239.35

Posted on February 20, 2017 at 08:16:29
This is another I've been waiting for. I've tried and tried to like the famous Reiner, both as a performance and recording, but I find Beecham's far more "exotic" and charming, and EMI's recording more "comfortable."

Recorded from a 15ips tape, though I don't know if that means it's some vinyl guy's backup from an lp, and US Angel tape, or an EMI UK tape.

 

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24/192 DVD just $7.20 plus shipping..., posted on February 20, 2017 at 12:12:23
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
Just my style!




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: 24/192 DVD just $7.20 plus shipping..., posted on February 20, 2017 at 12:28:47
Do you like the performance? I find it absolutely charming from beginning to end. None of the exotica sounds forced to me.

Not to be obsessive though, but would love to know more about the tape used. We'll see, it's downloading as I type.

 

Commercial tape, posted on February 20, 2017 at 12:57:23
csofan
Audiophile

Posts: 227
Location: IL
Joined: August 5, 2003
It appears to be from a commercial tape and not from someone's vinyl backup.

 

One of the inmates here posted about this not too long ago, posted on February 20, 2017 at 14:09:06
Posts: 26350
Location: SF Bay Area
Joined: February 17, 2004
Contributor
  Since:
February 6, 2012
Sorry I can't remember who it was and I can't find it right now. But he stated that some of these 15ips tapes were specially made by some companies for radio station broadcast (IOW, they were produced independently from the regular commercial tapes and were not generally available to the public). Moreover, they now fetch very high prices now on the used market. Was it Botanico who clued us in to this?

 

RE: Commercial tape, posted on February 20, 2017 at 14:13:34
Botanico92007
Audiophile

Posts: 729
Location: San Diego
Joined: March 15, 2006



Here's the original commercial tape issue at 7½ ips. HDTT doesn't use vinyl transfers unless a better sounding tape source is unavailable. The question becomes the source of the 15 ips tape. It could be from a private collection, a radio station, or LP mastering facility that never returned the copy tape. The sound quality should be excellent.

The sound on the commercial 7½ ips tape, done in England in the late 1950s, is dynamic, with exquisite low level detail, quiet background and a freshness that belies its age. The performance has stood the test of time, lovingly conducted with nice woodwind solos given free rein by the conductor, and is not lacking an exciting last movement.

 

RE: One of the inmates here posted about this not too long ago, posted on February 20, 2017 at 14:16:52
Botanico92007
Audiophile

Posts: 729
Location: San Diego
Joined: March 15, 2006
Chris, I was the one. I was scanning the tape box when you posted.

 

For $7.20 plus shipping..., posted on February 20, 2017 at 15:28:12
Ivan303
Audiophile

Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001

It hardly matters.

I have about 1-2 linear feet of Scheherazade LP's on my rack. Mostly collected them for the album covers. ;-)

I'm sure Angel Records 'Beechmint' is in there somewhere.

Did you buy the download? If so, how does is sound relative to either the LP or the 1999 re-master?




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

Just DL'd the DSD128 incarnation., posted on February 20, 2017 at 17:08:19
Jim Treanor
Audiophile

Posts: 2167
Location: Pacific Northwest
Joined: June 1, 2003
For those who don't read beyond one-line commentaries: I like it--a lot.

Most of the online reviews I've read of the Beecham CD reissues have ranged anywhere from provisionally accepting to "meh" to downright critical of both performance and sonics (a lot of it having to do with shy bass). Having sampled everything from Bernstein and Rossi to Ormandy and Ansermet to Reiner, Stokowski (all on vinyl plus Stokie on a terribly-compressed CD reissue of the same Phase 4 outing) and Temirkanov (CD) over the years, I figure I've traversed the landscape of performance interpretations and recording approaches. So, based on listening on my acoustically-treated Windows 10/JRiver-based bedroom system (TEAC UD-501 to Counterpoint SA-2000 to Sonographe SA250 to stand-mounted Paradigm Studio 20 v.5's)...

The Beecham DSD128 transfer from the 15ips tape, whatever its provenance, is exquisite. Quiet and transparent. The performance is not as fiery as, say, Temirkanov's or Stokie's (particularly in the final movement) and the bass is perhaps understated, but the reading and what the ensemble does with it is well-balanced overall and, as jd put it, "charming", evoking the mood with which Scheherazade no doubt spun her nightly tales to the sultan in order to keep her precious head. I agree, too, with his characterization as "comfortable," though I'd term it "relaxed."

The bottom line is that it will get more play here.

Thanks for the heads-up, jd.


Jim

 

Downloading it now, too--thanks, JD & Jim! (nt), posted on February 20, 2017 at 17:58:34
Russell
Audiophile

Posts: 2831
Location: San Francisco, California
Joined: February 24, 2001
nt

 

Great to know. Downloaded but out of town and can't listen. , posted on February 20, 2017 at 18:19:28
I'm up to my 7th HDTT transfer.

I've been wildly happy with all except the Liszt/Richter Piano Concertos, which seemed a bit dull, (did the record sound like that? I don't remember); the Bruch Scottish Fantasy with Oistrakh, which seemed a bit flat and harsh in the strings, BUT the accompanying Hindemith is absolutely fantastic; and the Tchaikovsky 4th with Monteux, which is not one of RCA's demo recordings but the performance is white hot and worth having IMHO, so sound-nuts proceed with caution.

No complaints whatsoever with the following, both sound and performance:

Ansermet's Petrushka
Stravinsky's Columbia Firebird
Bernstein's Columbia Gerswhin
Munch's RCA Schubert 9th (what perfect pacing in first mov't!)
Karajan's Sibelius 4th and 5th
Walter's lovely Columbia Dvorak 9th (my favorite)
Mehta's Decca Bruckner 9th

...and Morris' Mahler 8th if you know what to expect.


 

RE: Great to know. Downloaded but out of town and can't listen. , posted on February 21, 2017 at 03:04:45
PAR
jdaniel thank you for this. I am indebted to you already for your introduction to the HDTT transfers last year.

May I add one recommendation? The Ansermet Nutcracker. I bought a DSD64 download and was at first, not exactly dismissive, but not that impressed. However the download more or less coincided with the return of my loudspeakers after a rebuild with a brand new pair of tweeters. They just cannot have been burned in when I first listened to it as it knocked me sideways when I heard it last weekend. Very familiar recording which I have owned for the past 30 something years but it never sounded as good as this.

 

RE: Great to know. Downloaded but out of town and can't listen. , posted on February 21, 2017 at 08:37:49
Thanks! I initially felt a little awkward recommending a business that may or may not be legal. But quickly got over it. : )

I had the Ansermet Nutcracker on Lp and liked it a lot, except for the strings being a touch light in the big lyrical moments. But I love the Suisse Romande's charming woodwinds throughout--piece sounds freshly minted.

Ansermet's Swan Lake has the same pluses.



 

RE: Great to know. Downloaded but out of town and can't listen. , posted on February 22, 2017 at 05:48:43
PAR
I wouldn't get too concerned about legality. When I played that Nutcracker at the weekend it was in the company of someone who is concerned with copyright and repertoire for one of the majors. He asked what the source was and just said in a relaxed way "Oh, all PD* then". Had he been concerned believe me I would have known about it.

* Public Domain

 

"...exquisite: quiet and transparent...." Indeed it is!, posted on February 22, 2017 at 07:25:46
I listened to Mov't II last night. Transfer is warm and detailed, like the Lp, (I had four). What floored me, (no pun intended) is the lower noise floor which provides for a more listening experience. I especially marveled over the sense of space around solo bassoon and oboe. The surrounding hall is much more obvious. Very impressed!!

 

For 15 ips, check this out, posted on February 24, 2017 at 10:34:57
www.tapeproject.com

Trouble is, these are produced in very limited editions for a serious price (I believe originally $300 each, now $450 each) and sell out quickly. A friend has a few, and the sound is very impressive. I don't know if they did the Beecham Scheherazade.
Ironically, the hardware is available and not overwhelmingly expensive. My friend found an old TEAC 15 ips deck in decent shape in an antique shop for $300, and got it up and running again for another $300.

 

RE: Great to know. Downloaded but out of town and can't listen. , posted on March 4, 2017 at 23:00:31
ahendler
Audiophile

Posts: 5151
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Joined: January 24, 2003
The original Richter Liszt concertos were done by Bob Fine of Mercury records for Phillips. They are very exciting recordings with great dynamics and almost brite sounding. Certainly not dull. They are also stunning performances
Alan

 

RE: Great to know. Downloaded but out of town and can't listen. , posted on March 5, 2017 at 11:07:01
Thanks. I'm aware of those Merc engineered Philips. I also like the Tchaikovsky Sleeping Beauty with Concertgebouw and a few Tchaikovsky suites.

Well then, the HDTT Liszt/Richter is officially my first disappointment. Not bad considering all their home runs.

 

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