So who's ready for another recording of Chopin Etudes?

RE: So who's ready for another recording of Chopin Etudes?, posted on September 21, 2015 at 03:33:12
srl1 Audiophile Posts: 1339 Location: Florida Panhandle Joined: September 2, 2003	Chopin never looked so good... :)

Years ago ..., posted on September 21, 2015 at 07:44:59

Mike K
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I knew a fellow who was quite knowledgeable about classical music. He
could discourse on it for hours if you'd let him. He told me he had one
and only one recording - the one he judged to be the best - of each of his
favorite pieces, and saw no reason to buy any others. He told me he had
a little over 400 recordings in his collection and that wasn't going to
increase.

Which is not to say that his particular recording is of no merit or is not
enjoyable. It might well be both, but I'm doubtful. And I wonder who
is going to buy it.

Lack of skill dictates economy of style. - Joey Ramone

That guy is like my wife in that respect, posted on September 21, 2015 at 09:30:24

Chris from Lafayette
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She has the same philosophy, and I can't understand it. Great music is greater than what any single performance can convey. With most repertoire, I feel we NEED multiple performances. Speaking for myself, my listening to different recordings of the same piece has helped me immensely in gaining what I like to think is a deeper understanding of it.

Regarding your question as to who is going to buy this new Chopin recording, I'll probably check to see whether it turns up on classicsonlinehd before I decide whether to offer up the plastic.

Zowie! Hubba hubba! Ooo la la!!, posted on September 21, 2015 at 10:23:28
rbolaw	Chris, that pianist is a total babe!!! On a related topic, I have a recording of the Brahms violin concerto played by David Oistrakh with George Szell and the Cleveland Orchestra that seems much too sharp. I wonder if you or anyone else has this recording and what you all think. Could someone please do a detailed pitch analysis of the first movement? Thanks in advance.

It's funny - I did not have a horse in that race, posted on September 21, 2015 at 14:47:46
Chris from Lafayette Audiophile Posts: 26434 Location: SF Bay Area Joined: February 17, 2004 Contributor Since: February 6, 2012	In fact, I've never owned an Oistrakh recording of the Brahms Concerto (any of them, including the one with Szell), and only now have I found out about all the excitement (or, at the very least, the sound and fury) that I've missed! ;-) As I mentioned though, I do appreciate any efforts to protect the integrity of recordings, whether from Oistrakh or from anyone else.

How's This For a Milquetoast Reply ... [windbag follows], posted on September 21, 2015 at 14:55:43

Charlie F.
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Chris,

(N.B., the focus of this post is "classical music" performances.)

I agree to the n^th degree with you and with your wife.

When I was even more completely a member of The Great Unwashed than I am at present, I thought one recording of a piece was plenty.

Way back when (think high school at the turn of the 60s/70s and college immeditately thereafter), it didn't really matter who was on the record: I bought the recording of the given piece based on a mystical calculus of "Artist's Name Recognition," "Label Name Recognition," and price. The internal relationships of the three variables remained clouded in the mists of the beyond.

A bit later, after my horizons had broadened somewhat, I began to understand that one conductor or soloist, or synergy of conductor/orchestra(/soloist), or the production abilities/qualities of a label might affect the recording and my enjoyment thereof.

In any really substantial way, it wasn't until 1998 or so when I decided to get back into vinyl and began scarfing up free/cheap used LPs that I began truly perceiving the differences between all performances of a work. I now have between 20 and 30 recordings of many classical works.

If I haven't put you to sleep with my personal story already, here's my payoff: there are some pieces that I feel no need for even a second performance in my collection; there are others that I truly appreciate having two or more interpretations at hand; and there are a smaller number of compositions that I am happy as a geoduck with my riches of 10 or more recordings.

Had I never heard multiple performances of any given piece, I wouldn't have been able to type the previous paragraph. But, here on Sept. 21, 2015, as Walter Cronkite might put it, "That's the way it is."

That having been said, I must wrap this up by saying that I seldom feel the need or the drive to do anything more than sample new recordings of "old pieces" these days. Once in a blue moon, a comment someone posts here or a review I might read elsewhere will stir the juices, and I will buy. Jaded? Possibly. Lacking the drive and the funds to remain current or to reach for a new "best" very often? Definitely.

Unregardless of all that, Happy days!,

-=- Charlie F.

RE: So who's ready for another recording of Chopin Etudes?, posted on September 21, 2015 at 15:28:47
pbarach Audiophile Posts: 3306 Location: Ohio Joined: June 22, 2008	"Chopin never looked so good.," Well, appearances aren't everything. Judging by her few performances on youtube, she is technically stretched by the etudes and interpretively bland. I'd rather listen to Juana Zayas any day: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8jSHacZyG_E ...then compare it to ANY of the Bogdanova Chopin etude videos on youtube.

Charlie - Thanks for your interesting reply, posted on September 21, 2015 at 16:08:32

Chris from Lafayette
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I should have elaborated further, because my habits (and, likely, the habits of other listeners with a "collector" mentality) in the future will likely not be what they are now. In the future, I do not expect to have nearly the size of collection I have now (about 4,000 albums on various digital formats). I've already seen the future and it's something along the lines of the already available classicsonlinehd (streaming at CD-quality or better), but with even greater depth of catalog. In the future, I expect that the only recordings I'll actually own (i.e., have available on my home network drive) will be hi-rez multi-channel recordings (which, so far, have not appeared on any streaming services that I know of) or other recordings not available on whatever streaming service I'll be using.

As this situation comes about, we'll be able to do all the comparisons among different performances that we want to - until we're blue in the face! - while not sacrificing much if anything in the way of SQ. It's already here (partially), and I almost feel like a Luddite, still transferring my CD's and DVD-Audios to my networked hard drive. Sure, I might still have a favorite version of a particular piece (which I might or might not own!), but I'll be able to "check in" on other performances anytime I want - without actually having to own the alternative performances.

Ah, the irony ..., posted on September 21, 2015 at 16:39:15

rbolaw

You describe a state of affairs similar to that of the golden era of classical radio from the 1930s through the 1970s -- the tail end of which I enjoyed as a young music student. The pickings on the radio were so fat that many felt they only needed to own a few choice favorites, or even none at all.

Now, as you say, owning your music will again become unnecessary except for a few special items.

Or so you say. David Smith, and presumably others, remain unconvinced, and staunchly defend a "sell to own" system for marketing music recordings.

Wow - I didn't realize that Juana was that old!, posted on September 21, 2015 at 17:28:20

Chris from Lafayette
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While I see where you are coming from, I also think it's dangerous to draw too much of a conclusion from YouTube performances. The Bogdanova performances are all at least three years old, and I think you're overstating it to say that she's technically stretched by the etudes. (I listened only to Op. 10 No. 8 however.) What I heard was very slightly on the slow side (not very much, though - only in comparison with someone like Trifonov), with some "cheating" on the rhythm of the left hand in the middle section (but Trifonov is guilty of the same transgression in that place!). Then too, there are some stray false notes in Zayas' performances of the Etude in Sixths and the Ocean Etude (an easier work IMHO than Op. 10 No. 8). Even so, I would not call the Zayas performances technically stretched - but I wouldn't call the Op. 10 No. 8 performance by Bogdanova technically stretched either.

And here's the crucial thing: some pianists in their twenties are still getting better and better, and I suspect these new Bogdanova studio recordings (i.e., in my OP for this thread) will be noticeably better than the 3-to-5-year-old one-shot performances we hear on YouTube (which were not that bad in any case).

BTW, I recently heard Zayas' performances of the Chopin Etudes on the Music and Arts label. It's actually two different versions, recorded twenty years apart, and both of them are excellent! It got me enthusiastic about her playing, so I listened to her Schumann G-minor Sonata: big contrast in accomplishment with her Chopin and not nearly as impressive (IMHO). But she definitely has her moments!

Yup - I'm not saying that Dave is necessarily wrong, posted on September 21, 2015 at 17:41:46

Chris from Lafayette
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However it does seem that, with services such as classicsonlinehd going full speed ahead right now, we're practically at the situation I described already, despite whatever mayhem this type of streaming is causing to musicians' royalties.

I'm also aware of a number of Naxos recordings (and Naxos is the corporate entity running classicsonlinehd), where the artists themselves had to provide all of the up-front costs of making the CD, and the ones I've talked to realized few if any monetary gains from their CD recordings. Streaming is just not going to change the situation that much in the classical world for musicians who don't already have tons of marketers and publicists behind them. It may be different in the pop and jazz worlds.

RE: Zowie! Hubba hubba! Ooo la la!!, posted on September 21, 2015 at 18:51:53
David Smith	Would you mind posting the timing from the beginning of the first movement to the start of the final chord of the first movement? And details of the release. Thanks! Dave

To clarify, posted on September 21, 2015 at 19:15:35

David Smith

I staunchly defend the *ecomonics* of a purchase system, particularly of physical product. I don't dispute the inevitability of streaming as the dominant model, and frankly people don't seem to care about the consequences so I doubt much will change. A change in legal framework is the only thing that could cause a change but because of the aforementioned lack of concern that would seem more than a long shot.

Dave

Good Man! [nt], posted on September 21, 2015 at 19:24:53
Charlie F. Audiophile Posts: 984 Joined: March 31, 2000	(:~)

RE: Wow - I didn't realize that Juana was that old!, posted on September 21, 2015 at 19:25:55

pbarach
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I had the first Zayas recording and liked it, but I came to prefer Perahia among the modern stereo recordings, and this fantastic recording that Pollini made for EMI in 1960 which he declined to release and which only came out on disc in 2011:
http://www.classicstoday.com/review/review-16298/

Yes, I noticed some mistakes in Zayas's youtube video.

I'm not a fan of Trifonov's Chopin etudes, although I like his playing in some other pieces (e.g., he did a fantastic performance of the Shostakovich Concerto 1 here in Cleveland last season with the Cleveland Orchestra and Michael Sachs--can't recall the conductor at the moment).

Chris - Thanks for your thoughtful reply, posted on September 21, 2015 at 19:38:23

Charlie F.
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I wear my neo-Luddite outlook proudly, sir. (:~)

While I truly am happy that you are moving among the brave new worlds of instantly available digital music, I have consciously decided to focus on analog recordings. Not exclusively; I don't eschew all digital. But my real listening time includes surface noise.

And this is solely because I really, really enjoy the whole thing from cleaning discs through keeping the turntable aligned and manually lowering the tonearm to the record before sitting and sipping while listening for 15 to 25 or so minutes before standing up and doing it all again.

I have no point to make here other than, as the Big Bopper put it, "Thats-ah what I like!"

-=- Charlie F.

OK, and my apologies, posted on September 21, 2015 at 21:06:48

rbolaw

if I stated your views at all inaccurately. Of course, you speak more than well enough for yourself with no help from me. My real point was that all the fancy new technology (may) be bringing us closer to listening habits of a much earlier time -- pressing a button and listening to whatever's on rather than building a unique personal collection, only with a whole lot more being "on". But predicting the future is risky business.

No apologies necessary, posted on September 21, 2015 at 21:24:31
David Smith	I just wanted to clarify. That's an interesting parallel you make. Your comment about predicting the future notwithstanding, the next ten years looks bright for listeners... Dave

These 'babe' posts are getting old, posted on September 21, 2015 at 21:44:31
Mark Wieman Reviewer Posts: 72 Joined: September 5, 2008	I'm tired of reading them. Maybe it's just me.

RE: Zowie! Hubba hubba! Ooo la la!!, posted on September 21, 2015 at 21:56:20
Mark Wieman Reviewer Posts: 72 Joined: September 5, 2008	Seriously. Pick up the needle, I think these records are broken.

RE: So who's ready for another recording of Chopin Etudes?, posted on September 21, 2015 at 23:50:23
Todd Krieger Audiophile Posts: 37333 Location: SW United States Joined: November 2, 2000	Will there be a video version? ..... [^;

I take comfort in the fact that. . . , posted on September 22, 2015 at 00:04:48
Chris from Lafayette Audiophile Posts: 26434 Location: SF Bay Area Joined: February 17, 2004 Contributor Since: February 6, 2012	. . . there's often not too much text in my babe posts, so other inmates who click on them (for whatever reason) don't waste too much of their valuable time. ;-)

I'd love a blu-ray version, but haven't seen any announcement [nt] ;-), posted on September 22, 2015 at 00:07:03
Chris from Lafayette Audiophile Posts: 26434 Location: SF Bay Area Joined: February 17, 2004 Contributor Since: February 6, 2012

RE: These 'babe' posts are getting old, posted on September 22, 2015 at 01:32:34
garf	No, you are not alone. garf

As an aside...loved your website...what a service...thanks //nt, posted on September 22, 2015 at 05:02:15
MaxwellP Audiophile Posts: 1622 Location: New York Joined: September 19, 2007	Nt

Irina started out as a lot more of a GND..., posted on September 22, 2015 at 06:33:36
John Marks Manufacturer Posts: 7799 Location: Peoples' Democratic Republic of R.I. Joined: April 23, 2000	GND standing for "Girl Next Door." I always prefer the natural, low-maintenance look, but I don't recall a discussion of the above CD cover, either. ATB, JM PS: I time the first �tude at 88 minutes 16 seconds. WHOOPS! BELAY MY LAST! That's the first movement of a Morton Feldman string quartet, sorry!

A question, posted on September 22, 2015 at 07:01:42

Amphissa
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"I feel we NEED multiple performances. Speaking for myself, my listening to different recordings of the same piece has helped me immensely in gaining what I like to think is a deeper understanding of it."

So, this is just out of curiosity. Do you obtain that "deeper understanding" by listening only to the new recordings by pretty girls? Have you heard the recordings released in the past couple of years by guys like Alexander Kobrin, Jan Lisiecki, Lukas Geniusas, Mehmet Okonsar, etc.? Or do you think pretty girls have some special, greater insight than guys?

This really is just an idle question, because I have enough recordings of Chopin to satisfy my listening needs for the rest of my life, so I don't buy more -- by girls or guys.

"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

Didn't know Chopin was a babe, posted on September 22, 2015 at 07:03:06
Analog Scott Audiophile Posts: 9933 Joined: January 8, 2002	Learn somethin new every day

Some answers, posted on September 22, 2015 at 10:04:44

Chris from Lafayette
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Hey, that wasn't "A Question" - it was three questions! ;-)

"Do you obtain that 'deeper understanding' by listening only to the new recordings by pretty girls? Have you heard the recordings released in the past couple of years by guys like Alexander Kobrin, Jan Lisiecki, Lukas Geniusas, Mehmet Okonsar, etc.? Or do you think pretty girls have some special, greater insight than guys?"

Well, first of all, my comment was intended to be taken very generally, not referring only to pianists, but to any soloist, chamber group, singer, orchestra or conductor. So the answer to your first question is no. And actually, the answer to your third question is also no. Nevertheless, as I've mentioned in previous posts, there's a funny psychology at work in the minds of some listeners to the effect that only geezers and hags can have the true insight required for spiritually uplifting performances of the great works of classical music. Since I feel that this is not true at all, I almost feel a responsibility to publicize and socialize the other side of the story, i.e., that babe musicians can have every bit as much insight and technical finish in their performances as any other type of musician. I guess you could say that my promotion of babe musicians is just part of the ethical side of my own personality - you know, to try to ensure balance and fairness! ;-)

Regarding whether I've heard the pianists you mention, I do have Kobrin's Van Cliburn recording:

It's a bit on the bland side, but I still have it and I feel that his performances do add to my understanding of the Rachmaninoff and Chopin works he plays on this album. (I'm not too tuned in to the Brahms Paganini Variations these days.) In my view, even bland performances can often add to my understanding of the music. I see that Kobrin has released a number of albums beyond this one which I wasn't aware of. (Or else I saw them listed and, based on his Cliburn performances, I wasn't too excited about them and forgot about them.)

Regarding Lisiecki, he doesn't seem to have too many titles released thus far, and I haven't heard them in any case. His recording of the Chopin Etudes seems to have garnered an ecstatic review by the disgraced Bryce Morrison in The Gramophone. That's enough to turn me off right there, although I suppose I'm being just a bit unfair. ;-) Also, his recording of the Mozart Conertos (20 and 21) is conducted by Mr. Bland himself, Christian Zacharias. In fact, I understand Lisiecki is somewhat of a protege of Zacharias - another strike against Lisiecki IMHO! Nevertheless, I do need to listen to him.

As for Lukas Geniusas, I know his playing only from the streaming files from the Chopin and Tchaikovsky competitions. I'm generally enthusiastic about his playing, as I tried to convey in a couple of my "reports" about the Tchaikovsky Competition as it was occurring a couple of months ago.

Finally, I'm surprised that I've been completely unaware of Mehmet Okonsar, especially considering the number of albums he's released. I see that he only placed sixth in the Utah Gina Bachauer competition, but that's of course not a guarantee either way as to whether his playing will be finished and insightful. His recordings do look interesting and I'll try to listen to some.

You see? Such versatility! [nt] ;-), posted on September 22, 2015 at 10:08:21
Chris from Lafayette Audiophile Posts: 26434 Location: SF Bay Area Joined: February 17, 2004 Contributor Since: February 6, 2012

"geezers and hags"?, posted on September 22, 2015 at 12:28:13

rbolaw

When I started listening to classical music, either from (now departed or debased) great classical radio stations, or my father's large LP collection, I didn't know what most of the players looked like. The practice of putting the players' photos on LP covers only began to become pervasive in the late 1960s, making often interesting or even great cover art a thing of the past. So I found my favorites without knowing or caring whether they were geezers or hags.

Glamour was always a selling point for opera stars, at least the good-looking ones. But it really wasn't until the era of Jacqueline du Pre, Martha Argerich, and slightly later Anne Sophie Mutter that it became de rigueur for instrumental soloists. A big loss for me, since there are already plenty of forms of entertainment featuring beautiful women, even G-rated, family-oriented ones, I don't need or want it as a requirement for classical or any other genre of music.

Fair enough - my choice of words could have stood some improvement [nt] ;-), posted on September 22, 2015 at 15:09:22
Chris from Lafayette Audiophile Posts: 26434 Location: SF Bay Area Joined: February 17, 2004 Contributor Since: February 6, 2012

RE: Some answers, posted on September 22, 2015 at 15:36:10

Amphissa
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My questions (yes, multiple) referred only to recent recordings of the Chopin Etudes, because that was the topic of your original post. I could have asked more generally about recordings of pianists, violinists, and cellists, performing different repertoire, but then the list of male soloists would have been very long indeed.

I guess I'm just curious about your overall buying/listening choices. Because you almost never even mention newly released recordings by guys, but seem to announce a great number of new recordings by girls. I never know whether it is because you've actually listened to all the new recordings, by both girls and guys, and then just post about the pretty girls because they are (in your opinion) the best of all the new recordings. Or whether you just concentrate on recordings by pretty girls.

As an aside, just because a reviewer you do not like rates a recording highly, that does not mean the recording is crappy.

"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

Hmm. . . let's see now. . . , posted on September 22, 2015 at 19:37:51

Chris from Lafayette
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Actually, I think my previous post covered most of what you're asking about, but here's another interesting list of some of my other recent subject matter references in my recent posts on this forum:

Igor Levitt (2015 09 03)
Maurizio Pollini (2015 09 01)
Alfons and Aloys Kontarsky (2015 09 01)
Basil Poledouris and Philipp Pelster (2015 08 25)
Antal Dorati (2015 08 18)
Hans Vonk (2015 08 13)
Leif Segerstam (2015 08 13)
George Szell and Remy Ballot (2015 08 13)
Sviatoslav Richter and Ivan Moravec (2015 08 11)
George Szell (2015 08 05)
Kurt Masur (2015 07 28)

This list just covers the last less-than-two months, and I think it speaks for itself. I also think that what it really shows is that some inmates here are very. . . what?. . . nervous when attractive women musicians are brought up amid the august discussions we have on the "profundities of classical music" (e.g., the pitch on a given recording of the Brahms Violin Concerto) - so nervous in fact that they don't know how to deal with it when these references arise, and when they do (quite often courtesy of moi - although not nearly to the extent it may seem), these folks become. . . anxious and worried and want to see the source of their uneasiness removed. Maybe they're shy around purty girls. That's my dime-store psychology explanation anyway. ;-)

BTW, I acknowledge the truth of your last sentence, but I already had said that perhaps I was being a bit unfair along those lines in my previous post.

only if she can beat Richter's 'Torrent'..., posted on September 22, 2015 at 22:33:30
kuma Audiophile Posts: 10272 Location: IN Joined: July 8, 2001

Yeah. . . that's a great recording! [nt], posted on September 23, 2015 at 00:31:42
Chris from Lafayette Audiophile Posts: 26434 Location: SF Bay Area Joined: February 17, 2004 Contributor Since: February 6, 2012

Oh dear... I hope she plays better than this..., posted on September 24, 2015 at 21:38:41
kuma Audiophile Posts: 10272 Location: IN Joined: July 8, 2001

I've banished Flash and the embedding will not work for me, so I need a link, posted on September 24, 2015 at 22:39:07
Chris from Lafayette Audiophile Posts: 26434 Location: SF Bay Area Joined: February 17, 2004 Contributor Since: February 6, 2012

RE: Oh dear... I hope she plays better than this..., posted on September 25, 2015 at 01:54:32
Todd Krieger Audiophile Posts: 37333 Location: SW United States Joined: November 2, 2000	Half the time I hear a Bosendorfer piano on recording, the piano's "mechanics" is annoyingly audible....... It's the case here..... I think that's the problem, not than the pianist. I don't think the playing was that bad.

Try this...., posted on September 25, 2015 at 03:49:38
srl1 Audiophile Posts: 1339 Location: Florida Panhandle Joined: September 2, 2003	https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Yw2NcJKAdXU

Thanks - that was the performance I was referring to below, posted on September 25, 2015 at 09:57:17

Chris from Lafayette
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In the meantime, it looks as if the whole of her new recording is now available on Youtube. She still favors somewhat relaxed tempos, but makes a good case for them IMHO - at least as far as I can tell on YouTube. It's interesting enough that I'll probably try to get a hi-rez file of these performances if it becomes available. Tone quality seems to be superior too (again, to the extent I can tell from YouTube).

Irina's new recording intermixed with earlier recording trac

Huh?, posted on September 25, 2015 at 12:38:51

Amphissa
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So, that list is new recordings by young male musicians? Or are you just trying to change the subject?

You still didn't answer my question. Do you try to listen to all of the new(ish) recordings of particular works by both guys and girls (like, in this case the Chopin Etudes) and post the recordings you consider the best? Or do you just post the pretty girls because they are pretty girls?

And now you've taken to psychoanalyzing other members over the internet? So anyone who wonders why you continually post pictures of pretty girls who have released recordings are somehow defective males who are uncomfortable around attractive women? haha

I have nothing against pretty girls. They have been a part of my entire life. But being a pretty girl has zero relevance to musical talent or the quality of recordings.

I'm asking a very simple question. How do you decide which recordings to recommend on Music Lane? You've condemned other critics for their biases. I'm asking if you recommend these recordings based on objectively listening to the recordings. Is it just coincidence that they are by pretty girls? Or are all these recordings by pretty girls actually *better* than the recordings by their male contemporaries?

"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

Nevermind the piano mechanism..., posted on September 25, 2015 at 16:18:28
kuma Audiophile Posts: 10272 Location: IN Joined: July 8, 2001	what I hear is her mechanism showing. I suppose this is why there are gazzilions recordings of Chopin. Guess I prefer my intense Chopin with lots of canons over bunch of flowers. I like early Horowitz for this tune but Blechacz is sort of interesting.

RE: Nevermind the piano mechanism..., posted on September 25, 2015 at 16:37:10
Todd Krieger Audiophile Posts: 37333 Location: SW United States Joined: November 2, 2000	I guess no two people agree on everything.... This is yet another example..... I prefer Bogdanova's performance.

RE: Nevermind the piano mechanism..., posted on September 25, 2015 at 17:00:56

Todd Krieger
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The Chopin Etude Op 10 No 8 happens to be one of those pieces I rarely hear played really well..... It took me about 30 clips before I came across a really good one..... (This is one piece where even Horowitz doesn't do it for me.)

What's interesting is the pianist in this performance, Nobuyuki Tsujii from Japan, I think is legally blind.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3EaUJqUjAD8

augh.., posted on September 25, 2015 at 18:25:56

kuma
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not my cup of tea...

I have to confess I have never heard Japanese ( including *world-class* Ozawa and Uchida ) perform to my liking.
I find them often rather bland and sort of meh which lacking undefinable something that captivates me.

OTOH, those Kodo drum guys are awesome@!

Here's another pianist that I much prefer. This Pogorelich's set is fun to listen to.

"Or do you just post the pretty girls because they are pretty girls?", posted on September 26, 2015 at 01:38:21

Chris from Lafayette
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I plead guilty to this charge - SOMETIMES! As you can see from my OP on this thread, I hadn't even heard Irina's performances when I posted about her new Chopin recording. These types of posts fall into a category wherein I try to alert other listeners here to potentially interesting recordings about to be released. In any case, as anybody who's paying attention ought to be able to tell, these types of posts in themselves do not constitute recommendations (because they're not reviews at all!), although a follow-up post may include a recommendation, once I've heard the performances in question. In this thread, I believe I started things off with the phrase, "I know I am [interested]" - with no actual evaluation of the performances (which I hadn't heard at that time). And, BTW, you conveniently left out any reference to a number of my posts, such as the one on Lise de la Salle's recording of Schumann's Kinderszenen, where I described my disappointment with the shortcomings of some babe-musician recorded performances. I'm sorry to say so, but your summaries and generalizations in this thread of my writings come across as deliberately misleading, in the sense that you would have us believe that I rarely post about anything other than recommendations for babe musician recordings.

How do you decide which recordings to recommend on Music Lane? You've condemned other critics for their biases. I'm asking if you recommend these recordings based on objectively listening to the recordings.

I suppose I decide which recordings to recommend just like anyone else does, i.e., by weighing the various performance factors (technical and interpretive) and sound quality factors. How else would I do it? So I return to my list (in my previous post above) of recent references in my posts, many of which are to recordings by male musicians - I somehow didn't realize you were looking for recommendations of recordings by YOUNG male musicians.

One thing I HAVE posted about however is that I'm becoming less and less enchanted with the idea of "the best" recording(s) of a given repertoire work. When I post about a given recording that I've heard, it's usually because it has some interesting or even compelling quality to it. But is it the best? How would I know? I've owned/heard over 80 different recorded Mahler Fifths, and I'm less certain today than ever that there even exists a "best" version. I think I've been pretty consistent over the years in this impression. OK, the Dorati/NPO recording of the Tchaikovsky Orchestral Suites - in its newest 24/96 incarnation - simply IS the best. But that's the exception that proves the rule! ;-)

Is it just coincidence that they [your recommendations] are by pretty girls? Or are all these recordings by pretty girls actually *better* than the recordings by their male contemporaries?

Bum rap alert - and I don't enjoy bum raps! My recommendations are not all recordings by pretty girls by any means, and I think you knew that already (but were somehow tempted to go overboard on your rhetoric - LOL!). OTOH, see my reference to balance and fairness in one of my previous posts on this thread. It's also in that same post (link below) that I answered your original questions and commented on the "young male musicians" you asked about.

Of course, there are a number instances where I would of course rank the babe recordings VERY highly in any comparison. And as long as we're questioning each other's motives and tastes here (and since you have "nothing against pretty girls"), I'd like to know which babe musician recordings (in the last, say, 10 years) you would recommend yourself? Since you so often seem so offended by babe musician posts, inquiring minds want to know. ;-)

http://www.audioasylum.com/audio/music/messages/21/217045.ht

RE: augh.., posted on September 26, 2015 at 02:03:05

Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 37333
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000

I think what gets lost in this Etude is the base melody in the left hand, the right hand dominates..... Pogorelich has the common failing of losing that base melody.

I found another good one..... An unknown pianist named Simone Renzi.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fr0viMZ3dWI

RE: "Or do you just post the pretty girls because they are pretty girls?", posted on September 26, 2015 at 14:54:38
Analog Scott Audiophile Posts: 9933 Joined: January 8, 2002	" I'd like to know which babe musician recordings (in the last, say, 10 years) you would recommend yourself? Since you so often seem so offended by babe musician posts, inquiring minds want to know. ;-)" I am looking forward to his list. You have defended yourself with honor. The misrepresentations were pretty egregious to say the least.

How is the list coming?, posted on September 27, 2015 at 20:24:00
Analog Scott Audiophile Posts: 9933 Joined: January 8, 2002	::crickets chirping::

RE: How is the list coming?, posted on October 15, 2015 at 07:34:14
Jack D II Audiophile Posts: 1535 Location: Hot Springs, AR Joined: June 17, 2009	Ivan Moravec defines Chopin for me such that listening to others play Chopin only makes me aware of their deficiencies.