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The Great American Symphony

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Posted on March 21, 2015 at 12:10:29
TGR
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The March 2015 issue of The Absolute Sound has an article by Mark Lehman called "The Great American Symphony" in which he nominates 9 symphonies for that title:

In his order, which is chronological and not by order of merit:

Ives Symphony 4
Hanson Symphony 2 "Romantic"
Barber Symphony 1
Harris Symphony 3
Schuman Symphony 5
Piston Symphony 2
Rochberg Symphony 2
Sessions Symphony 3
Fine Symphony

Lehman suggests recordings of these, all available on CD, but since normally I prefer to listen to vinyl I acquired LPs of all of these (pictured), and while not always his preferred recordings, all mentioned in the article. I had the Stokowski Ives already, and the others were easy to find.

I love this kind of curated approach - there is so much music out there, and time is limited, and while one doesn't always have to agree, a list like this is a great way to explore. I very much doubt if I would have gotten around to some- maybe even most - of these on my own and I'm very glad to have heard all of them.

Lehman does not offer his reasoning for his choices, per se, and it is interesting to see that the most recent composition, that of Irving Fine, was in 1962. Tragic story about Fine - he himself conducted this performance and then died a few weeks later of heart disease, just 47 years old. Also there are a couple of major names excluded - no Copland, no Diamond, no Bernstein, although Lenny looms large as performer of some of these works.

I have listened to all of them now at least once, and plan to listen again. Some very early thoughts:

Howard Hanson's Romantic Symphony (which I have known in the Slatkin recording for years) is the most accessible of these symphonies, and probably would have considered to be of greater stature if it had been composed at the turn of the century (the 20th, of course) rather than 1930....very tuneful, and really fun, and at this stage we shouldn't pay heed to the Hanson's reputation as a neo-romantic. I am planning to seek out his Symphony 3 as well.

I was surprised how lively and colorful Roger Sessions symphony 3 actually is. I look forward to further acquaintance with his work - probably next up will be the Concerto for Orchestra - I am unfortunately old enough to remember when that recording was first released.

Walter Piston's Second Symphony shows a real gift for melody, and I plan to seek out the 6th symphony for further hearing. Rochberg's symphony 2 is quite powerful - interesting that he later abandoned serial technique. His work in general seems to deserve to be better known. I would also use the term powerful to describe Barber's symphony 1. Barber is closer to being mainstream than these others, but we still don't hear enough of him.

Fine's symphony is almost cinematic - what a shame it is his only one. It is not perfect, but shows a tremendous amount of promise.

It is hard to know exactly what to think of Ives 4th symphony after a single hearing, but it is an amazing work for 1916....having said that, I cannot imagine anyone who responds to Holst's Planets to not have a positive response to the 3rd movement of the Ives work.

So of all of these works, I found myself responding the least to the Schuman 3rd - well constructed, but "academic" in nature - Schuman did not show any lyrical gift in this work. I actually enjoyed its disc mate more, the 5th symphony, but even so, I am not really tempted to explore a lot more. And my view of Roy Harris' 3rd, based on this hearing and a few others, is that it just might be overrated - it certainly ranked on the lower end of my reactions to these works after a single hearing -but note the qualification. At this stage, I don't feel a need to seek out further works of Harris, either.

The sound quality of the Columbia recordings is unfortunately not as good as that of the other labels, all of which were able to produce juicier sound. There is a grey dullness to the Columbia recordings that distracts from the music.

This has been an extremely interesting process for me. I do wish that our music directors would program some of these works more often. They deserve to be heard live and played by top-notch orchestras.

 

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Nice post - it really helps provoke interest in those works, posted on March 21, 2015 at 14:58:25
Chris from Lafayette
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 I've heard only three of those symphonies myself (Ives, Hanson and Harris). Although the Romantic Symphony is Hanson's most popular, I'm not sure that that symphony is his best. Let us know what you think when you listen to his Third. My father-in-law, Ernst Bacon, wrote two symphonies, and I wish we could get decent recordings of them - I know Kent Nagano conducted the first while he was in Berkeley. It would be nice if he took it up again and recorded it, but I think he's too busy conducting Bruckner etc. these days! ;-)

 

Hmmm. Perhaps the context of the passage of time has not been kind to Harris' Third, posted on March 21, 2015 at 15:43:07
John Marks
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 At the time the Roy Harris Third was debuted, most American concert music was of the Amy Beach variety--largely imitative of Romantic models, and usually German Romantic models at that.

Harris' third was revolutionary for being a single-movement work (albeit IIRC in 5 sections) that combined original themes that sounded familiar with inventiveness and daring in harmony and orchestration, all in the context of a fresh and self-confident approach.

There's only one tonic chord in the whole thing, and you don't realize until you hear it that the whole symphony, despite its fugal or canonical interludes and syncopation and divided strings, has been moving toward it with great intentionality and clarity of inspiration.

My favorite recordings of it are Koussevitsky's and Tilson Thomas'.

So, give it a chance, but if it never grabs you, that is because the things that made it fall like a thunderclap upon the concert-music scene in the late 1930s are everyday happenings now.

Harris later said modestly that he was in the right place at the right time... .

jm

 

RE: Nice post - it really helps provoke interest in those works, posted on March 21, 2015 at 15:49:06
ahendler
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 What about Coplands 3RD symphony I love that work
Alan

 

Interesting juxtaposition..., posted on March 21, 2015 at 16:07:22
Jim Treanor
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 the first movement of Hanson's "Romantic" accompanying--would Ripley have said "believe it or not?"--Alien's end credits.

If you haven't already, Piston's Fourth is another one you might want to give an ear to.


Jim

 

I was told, without the courtesy of asking permission, posted on March 21, 2015 at 17:51:55
John Marks
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 Cuz, y'know, most of those classical guys died when the Black Death hit, and the ones who survived got their heads cut off in the French Revolution.

"We have no need of stinkin' synchronization licenses, Seņor!"

(The Treasure of the Sierra Madre.)

jm

 

For further listening, posted on March 21, 2015 at 17:54:40
Amphissa
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 Thank you for your very fine overview of American symphonies. Personally, I've never cared much for Ives, but I know others enjoy his music.

Any review article will be limited, so it is no surprise that Lehman selected just a few symphonies to recommend. But I was disappointed that some others could not be included in his survey.

David Diamond, who died in 2005, was IMO an excellent American composer. I think his 3rd symphony, premiered by Munch in Boston in 1945, is widely considered the best of his 11 symphonies, and I would not argue with that. The recording by Schwarz is very good.

Hovhaness got a bad rap for being so prolific, but his 2nd symphony "Mysterious Mountain" is surely one of the best symphonies composed by an American. Reiner's recording with the Chicago Symphony is a classic, although there are some recordings with much better audio available.

I'm not sure that William Grant Still's 2nd Symphony "Afro-American" is really one of the best ever by an American composer, but it is certainly an excellent work. And being written by one of America's few African-American composers, it deserves much broader recognition than it has received.


"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

 

Yeah - funny the Copland wasn't on there - I like it too [nt], posted on March 21, 2015 at 18:02:28
Chris from Lafayette
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Yes - interesting that Harris' later symphonies didn't get the same kind of acclaim [nt], posted on March 21, 2015 at 18:04:40
Chris from Lafayette
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Yes - a very unexpectied use of that work, but very effective nevertheless [nt], posted on March 21, 2015 at 18:06:41
Chris from Lafayette
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Hovhaness' Symphonies could get a whole article by themselves!, posted on March 21, 2015 at 18:21:45
Chris from Lafayette
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 Of course I do have that Reiner recording you refer to - but I'm also partial to the Mount Saint Helens Symphony too. Folks can call it obvious if they want (and the almost innocent depictions and evocations of this music can bring a smile to one's face), but for me it's still mightily effective. The San Jose Symphony performed it just after it was written and Hovhaness was there to acknowledge the audience acclaim. It was kind of a thrill to be there.

Another Hovhaness Symphony I like is the Symphony No. 4 (for band) - in outstanding SQ on a Mercury Living Presence album with the A. Clyde Roller and the Eastman Wind Ensemble.

 

No Copland 3rd! (nt), posted on March 21, 2015 at 18:44:25
jdaniel@jps.net
 .

 

RE: I was told, without the courtesy of asking permission, posted on March 21, 2015 at 19:03:25
rbolaw
 Interesting. It's probably the publisher (Carl Fischer, I believe) and not Hanson's successors or heirs who has the authority to grant permission, and permission is routinely granted. Still, quite a blunder if true.

 

I was thinking the same thing., posted on March 21, 2015 at 19:17:51
rbolaw
 I can see how some could consider the work of Philip Glass or Elliott Carter too far removed from the traditional idea of the symphony, but Copland?

 

I meant of the publisher. Yes, a blunder., posted on March 21, 2015 at 20:05:28
John Marks
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 I don't know how it all turned out, I don't even know if a soundtrack album was ever sold.

JM

 

Well... just throwing some ideas out in answer to your observation, posted on March 21, 2015 at 20:20:40
John Marks
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 A reviewer I thought was rather cruel said of one or another of Harris' later symphonies (there were between 13 and 18, depending what you count) that it was like a vintage Packard with a magnificent straight-8 engine, sitting up on cinderblocks, without wheels... in an apple orchard.

Ouch.

I actually met him the year he died. He was very amiable but not really with it; his wife did most of the talking.

It's possible that he learned what he had to learn to make his great early work, and then he stopped learning and kept writing, and by the time the 1960s and 1970s arrived, his style (which perhaps owes more than most people realize to Sibelius, and also in its combination of long lines plus polyphony, to the Italian Renaissance), by that time sounded as old-fashioned as Amy Beach's "Gaelic" Symphony would have--in 1939.

Just thinking out loud, but, back when I was at Brown I actually checked the score of the Third out of the Library, and it had not been checked out in a long time... . So I did kind of get my feet wet, and I marveled at how anyone could conduct the very "busy" string interludes and get them to hang together, but I guess that's why Maestro Bernstein got the big bucks.

ATB,

jm

 

RE: The Great American Symphony, posted on March 21, 2015 at 21:01:23
learsfool
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 Very surprising indeed that Copland's 3rd wasn't mentioned, it is certainly performed far more often than any of the ones on the list. The most performed work actually on that list is the Barber, which is great.

For me personally, Charles Ives is the quintessential American composer, and I would pick the 4th out of that particular list. I also am a big fan of Harris and Piston and Schuman. I think Walter Piston might be the most underrated American composer.

 

RE: The Great American Symphony, posted on March 22, 2015 at 00:07:02
Daverz
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 A lot of these works had their best recordings in the analog era, and some have had no commercial recordings since (e.g. the Sessions Symphony 3; I wonder what ever happened to Igor Buketoff).

I think the recording of the Piston 6 to have is still the Munch. I have it in a Japanese RCA Munch Edition CD, coupled with an equally fabulous Martinu 6 (which was *composed* in the US).

By the way, Cedille has a new recording of the work on the flipside of the Sessions, Benjamin Lee's Concerto for String Quartet. That RCA recording was pretty shrill. New World Records will still burn you a CDR of the older recording.


 

Hovhaness did 2 things over and over-, posted on March 22, 2015 at 00:08:24
oldmkvi
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 The Homophonic Thing, and the Trebly Fugue Thing.

 

The morality of music, posted on March 22, 2015 at 05:22:41
Amphissa
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 If you are going to condemn music because you disagree with the political, social or religious beliefs of the composer, you will end up eliminating a huge amount of of excellent music from your life.

Music is basically amoral. It transcends its creator to take a life of its own. Point out a single line of music in Hovhaness and say "here, this melody is homophobic." Conversely, point out one line of music by Diamond or Copland or Poulenc and declare, "there, that is a homosexual melody."
"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

 

Not in the original film score ..., posted on March 22, 2015 at 05:32:03
Amphissa
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The original film used music written by Jerry Goldsmith. Ridley Scott did not like it, so the Hanson music was inserted instead.




"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

 

A mighty task indeed, posted on March 22, 2015 at 05:38:03
Amphissa
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I'm not sure anyone has ever listened to all of his 67+ symphonies, perhaps not even Hovhaness himself, much less closely enough to actually write reviews of them.


"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

 

The poster above wrote "Homophonic." As in, a one-line composition., posted on March 22, 2015 at 05:53:33
John Marks
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 And I agree that Hovhaness' large output worked against being respected in certain quarters, and "Mysterious Mountain" is a great American symphony in that same Roy Harris mold of self-confidence in the use of "American" hymnody and other source materials.

I recommended the Hovhaness Guitar Concerto in the October 2014 issue of Stereophile.

JM

 

It's time for new glasses!!!! LOLOLOLOLOLOL. nt, posted on March 22, 2015 at 08:33:09
oldmkvi
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 Wow!

 

RE: The poster above wrote "Homophonic." As in, a one-line composition., posted on March 22, 2015 at 08:34:52
oldmkvi
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 Thanks! I don't dislike his music, just that it fits in a narrow range of style.
That other post about homophobic was priceless!

 

Alien was the subject of a plagarism lawsuit from, posted on March 22, 2015 at 08:41:52
oldmkvi
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 AE Van Vogt, whose Voyage of the Space Beagle contained the novelette
that Alien copied.
While James Horner got composer credit, I think the other music used was actually stolen too.
The Gayne Ballet by Katcheturian (sp?) comes to mind, and the example you cited,
maybe more, haven't seen it in a long time.

 

RE: No Copland 3rd! (nt), posted on March 22, 2015 at 10:03:24
Todd Krieger
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 I personally think Copland's Third was the greatest of all symphonies by an American composer. Hanson's 2nd being second.

 

hahaha -- that's what I get, posted on March 22, 2015 at 10:22:23
Amphissa
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That's what I get for waking up early and posting at 5:20 AM.


"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

 

Yup - in fact there used to be a CD of Goldsmith's original closing music [nt], posted on March 22, 2015 at 13:21:55
Chris from Lafayette
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Are you thinking of 2001?, posted on March 22, 2015 at 13:25:37
Chris from Lafayette
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 I don't recall hearing any Khatchaturian in Alien. And I think you mean Jerry Goldsmith rather than James Horner?

 

Yes - but at least he often uses different modes. . . , posted on March 22, 2015 at 13:30:51
Chris from Lafayette
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 . . . for his various instances of homophony! ;-)

BTW, if you listen to too many Scarlatti Sonatas, you start to think he did the same things over and over too! ;-)

 

Don't feel bad...., posted on March 22, 2015 at 14:15:45
D Harvey
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 ....please! You brightened what has been a pretty lousy day for me. Thanks for you strong convictions!

dh

 

I would add, posted on March 22, 2015 at 19:18:03
csofan
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 I would add the Diamond 2nd. One of the great American symphonies written during the 2nd world war.

 

RE: No Copland 3rd! (nt), posted on March 22, 2015 at 23:15:17
Chris from Lafayette
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 As I mentioned below, I like Copland's Third Symphony myself, but I do know some listeners who aren't (or weren't) too thrilled by it. One was our friend, composer Don Cobb (no longer with us), who wrote the entry on Roy Harris for one of the Grove's Dictionary editions (perhaps "The New Grove" - can't remember now). Anyway, I remember playing him a recording of Copland's Third Symphony - he refused to listen to the end of the last movement, saying "I don't need to listen to any more - I already know what he's going to do!". He could not understand Copland's popularity! ;-)

 

RE: No Copland 3rd! (nt), posted on March 23, 2015 at 16:12:31
Todd Krieger
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 There are not a lot of performances of Cop's Third, but most of them are "bombastic" or "brassy", it sounds more like a thrill showpiece than serious music. Leonard Bernstein one of many offenders here. (Could be why this work misses the cut with some people.)

What really got me going with this work was Copland's own interpretation..... This work needs the "Brahms treatment" if you will.... A lyrical "introspective" read of this work just transforms it.

 

RE: No Copland 3rd! (nt), posted on March 23, 2015 at 16:42:50
Todd Krieger
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 I sampled some other performances on YT.... I found another good read, at least w the final movement................ (The good reads of this work seem to be somewhat sloppy or under-rehearsed, in regard to the orchestral playing.)

 

Disagree re: Bernstein's final DGG w/NYPO. Iron and Steel, posted on March 23, 2015 at 18:56:28
jdaniel@jps.net
 he keeps the weightiness up until the very end.

 

RE: No Copland 3rd! (nt), posted on March 23, 2015 at 19:01:24
Chris from Lafayette
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 I believe the recording I played was this one:



I suspect the later recording conducted by Copland (in your post below) is better. The one above has some patches of iffy orchestral execution. I also have the Eiji Oue / Minnesota recording on Reference, but I'm not sure I had it at that time. I've never owned Bernstein's recording.

 

+1 Diamond 3rd and +1 Still's 2nd [nt], posted on March 25, 2015 at 13:37:58
Mike Porper
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 u

 

Stop Listening to Bruckner [nt], posted on March 25, 2015 at 13:40:39
Mike Porper
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 u

 

+1 Copland 3rd [nt], posted on March 25, 2015 at 13:46:54
Mike Porper
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 t

 

Not Diamond??!!, posted on March 25, 2015 at 13:52:37
Mike Porper
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 You must be mistaken.

BTW - story I've heard [passing it on; can't verify that it's true]. Ormandy was rehearesing one of Scriabin's symphonies. Scriabin was, of course, absolutely a real man, zero-BS hetero. Somewhere in the middle of it all, he stopped and reportedly exclaimed [in full Hungarian accent]: "I don't like this homosexual music!!"

 

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