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Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto No. 1

74.106.53.24
Posted on September 1, 2014 at 09:25:13
psgary
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 The problem with a lot of old war horses is that performers treat them like old war horses. Case in point is Tchaikovsky's First Piano Concerto. I keep trying to find a recording that doesn't clunk along, especially the first movement.

With so many recordings and samples I've heard, the pianist plays the opening series of chords so slowly that I want to say "get to the next chord already". Respect for a great piece is one thing but putting some life and energy in a revered work is not a crime.

Does anyone know of a recording where the pianist gets the piece moving from the get go and doesn't sound like he or she is slogging through mud?

 

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Van Cliburn/ Kondrashin, video., posted on September 1, 2014 at 10:01:24
Sigmund
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 Try this, a version of which is also available on cd and lp.

 

RE: Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto No. 1, posted on September 1, 2014 at 10:09:50
vahe
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 Of all the recordings that I am familiar with going back some sixty years, there is only one that fits your description, it is on fire from start to end, that performance is by Emil Gilels/CSO/Fritz Reiner. It was greatly overshadowed by Van Cliburn recording that appeared about the same time, Van Cliburn really sounds boring once you hear the Gilels/Reiner performance.

Vahe

 

Thanks for the link, posted on September 1, 2014 at 10:56:42
psgary
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 While I like Van Cliburn and find the opening of this performance to have a certain power, the tempo is still a bit too slow for my taste.

But the link is most appreciated. I think Van Cliburn did a lot to help warm the chill of U.S./Soviet cultural relations in the '60s.

 

Gilels, posted on September 1, 2014 at 11:12:13
psgary
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 Thanks. I found a sample of it on YouTube and he does take it a bit brighter than Van Cliburn.

 

Eh, he was almost an Honorary Ukrainian..., posted on September 1, 2014 at 12:05:14
John Marks
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 His principal teacher, Rosina Lhévinne, was firmly in the great eRussian/Ukrainian pedagogical school. Van Cliburn started with her in 1951, at Juilliard.

JM

 

RE: Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto No. 1, posted on September 1, 2014 at 12:55:51
kuma
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 They made several of the PC1 together but this one from April 25 1943, a special fund raising concerto for the war effort, tops anything I have heard. More electrifying and both the orchestra and pianist were highly charged from the start and won't let go. Explosive dynamics and dexterity even on the Andante by Horowitz at his absolute prime. The sound of course is a historical grade but it's a hoot to listen to in a big rig.


Distant second is Szell/Graffman. He's got the power but does not have the expressive shadings of Horowiz or Richter. Listening to it right after Ashkenazy/Curzon school of playing he comes off like a hot rodded stallion. Szell's direction is full of colour and textures with his usual precision. This combo rocks. Its overall presentation falls into the Horowitz/Toscanini set. Certainly more upbeat than the Richter/Karajan. ( to my ears )

I just got the Pogorelich/Abbado set. Altho, I haven't give it a listen yet, knowing this young pianist's eccentric style, it might be fun.


 

Recommendations, posted on September 1, 2014 at 13:07:35
psgary
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 My goodness. Thank you for all the suggestions. I will look into them.

 

RE: Recommendations, posted on September 1, 2014 at 18:00:54
Todd Krieger
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 In my recollections, Martha Argerich was also rather fast with the Tchaik Concerto.... Although otherwise not my cup of tea.

 

I can tell you this; the best recorded #1 I've heard yet is Wild's, either on Chesky or the original Reader's , posted on September 1, 2014 at 21:56:01
jdaniel@jps.net
 Digest Box set, "Treasury of Great Music," which also includes the famous Barbirolli Sibelius 2.

Wild's not a lingerer. But he's not glib and/or expedient with the Tchaikovsky either.

 

I like Horowitz/Szell even more..., posted on September 2, 2014 at 00:19:24
Russell
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 Recorded live at Carnegie Hall in January 1953 with the NY Phil, this dazzling performance tops either of the two Toscanini-led versions IMO. The finale is just staggeringly brilliant and will leave you breathless. If you like Horowitz's way with the Tchaikovsky (and I do), this version is a must-hear.

It's only currently available 'officially' in the large Horowitz/Carnegie Hall box set on Sony (well worth having) in fairly decent sound (rumor has it that it was recorded by Columbia) as well as in several 'pirate' versions (many of which incorrectly list the performance date as May 1952).

Russell

 

ONE of the best. . . ONE of the best. . ., posted on September 2, 2014 at 23:08:12
Chris from Lafayette
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 Hey, man! I've got the Wild/Chesky CD too. It's great, and I love its verve and vitality - but there are so many other great ones too! ;-)

 

I just listened to that Argerich Kondrashin, posted on September 3, 2014 at 05:55:00
jult52
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 Tchaiokovsky 1st over the weekend and found it tremendously vital and inspired. Up to Martha's best work. The sound engineering is unfortunately not up to the level of the performance but can be overlooked.

I'll have to look into that Gilels/Reiner recommendation. That performance must be a great one.

 

Yevgeny Sudbin, posted on September 3, 2014 at 07:18:16
krisjan
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 Sudbin's Tchaik #1 with the Sao Paulo Symphony and Neschling is terrific! In excellent SACD sonics, too. This disc has gotten high praise from a number of critics including David Hurwitz. The coupling is Medner's No.1 which is also a wonderful performance. Highly recommended!

 

I don't even want to think about how many choices there are...but I meant to say that I find the recording one, posted on September 3, 2014 at 08:27:51
jdaniel@jps.net
 ...of the best. ; )

 

Argerich/Dutoit is fun, too..., posted on September 3, 2014 at 10:53:14
kuma
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 altho, it's too hurried for me, but it might suit the OP's requirement.

 

You can sample it here..., posted on September 3, 2014 at 13:21:48
Russell
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 Heck, you can even hear the whole disc (in 30-second segments) if you like. It's available as a 44.1/24 download (the original recording format) if that's your pleasure...

Russell

 

Thanks..., posted on September 3, 2014 at 13:33:28
Ivan303
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Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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Will give it a listen later today.


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: " It's available as a 44.1/24 download (the original recording format)", posted on September 3, 2014 at 13:37:29
Ivan303
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Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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 And yet, it is also available as a hybrid SACD.

So that means that an SACD can be limited to a sampling rate of 44.1?


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

When BIS released this SACD...., posted on September 3, 2014 at 13:50:37
krisjan
Reviewer

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 ...they were still mainly recording in 44 kHz/24 bit. Since then, they have moved to sampling rates of 88 or 96 kHz. BIS had asserted at the time that the higher resolution afforded by the 24 bit depth rate was more significant to the sound than the actual sampling rate. However, pressure (from sites like SACD_net) forced them to adopt the higher sampling rate.

 

RE: " It's available as a 44.1/24 download (the original recording format)", posted on September 3, 2014 at 13:52:28
Tony Lauck
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 Most of the BIS SACDs are upsampled 44.1 bit material. They are not high resolution as far as bandwidth is concerned. Bissie has publicly admitted to this.




Tony Lauck

"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar

 

Thanks I'll look out for one..., posted on September 3, 2014 at 13:56:08
kuma
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This is probably a bootleg version.
I did not get a box set last year since I already have so many of his CD and vinyl. Altho, it would be interesting to hear the *corrected* version of 'An Historic Returns* album.

 

RE: When BIS released this SACD...., posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:07:44
Tony Lauck
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 I am not convinced that the newer BIS recordings at higher sample rates sound much better than many of the older ones. I think it may be the use of second tier converters and mic preamps (RME mic preamps and converters on the Sibelius 2/5 release at 96/24).

I have a large collection of BIS downloads from eclassical. I would say that most of these have good sound, recordings that have not been screwed up. However, sound quality is not the strength of the label. The strength is the breadth of music and artists at reasonable prices. (Even more than reasonable if one buys from eclassical.com on sale.) Other labels, such as Channel Classics, have far superior sound than BIS, but a limited catalog and higher prices.




Tony Lauck

"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar

 

Interesting..., posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:16:29
kuma
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 I am awaiting a Gluzman/Bruch CD on BIS label.

Curious to hear how it sounds altho, I will be listening on a conventional red book player.
This was released in 2011.

 

There are at least four with Gilels on youtube., posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:24:49
Sigmund
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 Including this surprisingly good one with Cluytens and the ONRTF. I like the whole thing especially the last two movements.

 

Good god.. is this played at the right timing?, posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:29:33
kuma
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It seems the record/CD running faster. :/

 

Wild, posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:29:49
psgary
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 I had one of the Reader's Digest vinyl collections in the early 60's. Wonderful samplings of many fine works and orchestras. I don't think I had the set with the Wild recording.

I wish I could get a sample of the Chesky recording. Perhaps YouTube, much as I dislike going there.

Thanks for the recommendation.

 

True - and most of the people on SA-CD.net could not tell the difference [nt], posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:51:03
Chris from Lafayette
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1953 NY Phil, posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:51:36
psgary
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 I like Horowitz's tempo for this third movement. Thanks for posting it.

The sample I heard with Toscanini of the first movement was a bit too tame. This sounds more to my liking.

 

Just listened for a few seconds - the pitch is right, but the SQ is shallow [nt], posted on September 3, 2014 at 14:55:38
Chris from Lafayette
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It's a wonderful CD, in either format..., posted on September 3, 2014 at 19:27:49
Ivan303
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 Hope his playing doesn't remind you TOO much of Kreisler. ;-)


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

Here's a link to a free MP3 download of the whole thing..., posted on September 3, 2014 at 23:41:53
Russell
Audiophile

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 Since this recording is (I'm guessing) in the public domain, I guess this is probably OK, legal-wise. Note that the May 1952 date is given for the performance instead of the correct one (January 1952).

This is also an interesting read:

http://brillantenontroppo.blogspot.com/2012/01/tchaikovsky-horowitz-and-race-to-finish.html

Russell

 

The first Wild I heard was his Rach 2nd, and I thought, "what a virtuoso automaton." , posted on September 4, 2014 at 08:42:14
jdaniel@jps.net
 IMHO he doesn't stop to smell the roses even once.

I'm so glad I got to hear more of his work. His Chopin 1st couldn't be more sensitive and poetic, without sounding fussy, (and many do in the two lyrical stretches of the 1st mov't).

Same with the Tchaikovsky, and Rachmaninoff 3rd: couldn't be more lovely in the quieter sections.

His Grieg didn't grab me, though I don't blame any concert pianist for falling asleep at the wheel playing this particular PC.

 

Excellent, posted on September 4, 2014 at 10:43:14
psgary
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 Thank you for that link. I like his pace on this much better than the version I heard on YouTube with Toscanini. This recording doesn't make the concerto seem like an old war horse.

Most enlightening.

 

Playing with brio, posted on September 4, 2014 at 10:52:11
psgary
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 I have placed this on my Wish List at ArkivMusic. His opening is bright enough for my taste and I like the freshness of his interpretation.

Thank you for the tip.

 

New release by Behzod Abduraimov, posted on September 5, 2014 at 08:22:50
Ivan303
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Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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Just out a couple days ago. Listening now.

Sounds pretty good to me. Nice light touch.

Nothing particularly 'new' and 'exciting', if that's what you're looking for?

Link below:


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

My favourite is Lazar Berman with Karajan , posted on September 7, 2014 at 00:27:37
Timbo in Oz
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 It is a bit Tcherman.

The accompaniment is excellent, and B's playing is huge.




Warmest

Tim Bailey

Skeptical Measurer & Audio Scrounger


 

Interesting choice! - but, surely, you can't be happy with the SQ? [nt], posted on September 7, 2014 at 14:50:28
Chris from Lafayette
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  Since: February 6, 2012

 

RE: Interesting choice! - but, surely, you can't be happy with the SQ? [nt], posted on September 7, 2014 at 15:15:19
Timbo in Oz
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 No I'm not.

But Lazar Berman was never given a chance, and this hints at what might have been.


Warmest

Tim Bailey

Skeptical Measurer & Audio Scrounger


 

I heard Berman live one time, posted on September 8, 2014 at 10:45:40
Chris from Lafayette
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 This was a solo recital many (30+) years ago. In addition to all the usual virtuoso repertoire, he also included one of the "Biblical Sonatas" by Kuhnau - very enterprising of him, I thought! I've always admired his Liszt TE's too, but I also feel that his performances have been equaled in some subsequent recordings. He also has a recording of Tchaikovsky's "pre-revision" version of the First Piano Concerto (below) which is also interesting. I've heard some "dirty old man" stories about him too from a friend and fellow pianist (a woman who now has a pretty good career going - initials "NP") who was one of the objects of his. . . uh. . . horniness.

 

Political correctness, is wrapped around - SNAGism/feminism, and Post-modernism, posted on September 8, 2014 at 14:23:52
Timbo in Oz
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 Sighhhhhh!

Email?






Warmest

Tim Bailey

Skeptical Measurer & Audio Scrounger


 

RE: Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto No. 1, posted on September 10, 2014 at 18:41:39
eleiko2@verizon.net
Audiophile

Posts: 207
Joined: October 4, 2008
 Vladamir Ashkenazy (1963) with the London Symphony conducted by Lorren Mazel. It's fine enough where I've never found the need to own another one.

 

RE: Tchaikovsky's Piano Concerto No. 1, posted on September 11, 2014 at 22:52:16
afro18
Audiophile

Posts: 630
Location: NorthEast Ohio
Joined: December 1, 2003
 I second the Horowitz/Toscannini with the NBC......just electric!


Marty N.

 

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