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New HiRes Sheherazade from Chandos

67.233.214.119
Posted on July 21, 2014 at 15:31:27
srl1
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Classical Shop has a new Chandos release of the Toronto Symphony with Peter Oundjian conducting of Sheherazade. It is available in 192/24 stereo and surround. The sound is excellent. Great imaging and stability. The solo violin part by Jonathan Crow is especially nice. The performance is moving and passionate. You might want to give it a try.

 

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RE: New HiRes Sheherazade from Chandos, posted on July 21, 2014 at 16:34:18
Ivan303
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Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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 First and only review from the site you linked to:


"Beware that this is claimed as the 24/192 studio file but what is actually sold here is a 24/96 downdsample. You won't get a reply from customer service when you complain about the bait & switch.
R Hutton"




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: New HiRes Sheherazade from Chandos, posted on July 21, 2014 at 17:08:43
srl1
Audiophile

Posts: 1339
Location: Florida Panhandle
Joined: September 2, 2003
 The files were originally in error (96/24). I contacted support and was advised they were aware of the error. Today the correct 192/24 files were made available. I successfully downloaded them, and they sound great (I listen in stereo).

 

Great news..., posted on July 21, 2014 at 18:26:39
Ivan303
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 Good to hear things got worked out.

Besides the sound, what were your thoughts on the musical content?


First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: New HiRes Sheherazade from Chandos, posted on July 21, 2014 at 20:24:51
Chris from Lafayette
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Contributor
  Since: February 6, 2012
 I think I'll take you up on your suggestion and give that new Chandos recording a try. For some reason, Kal didn't seem to think that much of the performance (over on SA-CD.net), but I'll try to download it tomorrow and report back too.

I just obtained (yet again!) the Reiner/CSO Living Stereo recording (this time in the Analogue Productions SACD incarnation) a couple of months ago - IMHO the best remastering yet of that great and classic performance.



However, my favorite Sheherazade is the little known Pavel Kogan / Moscow State SO performance on Classic Records - the conductor is a crazy man, yet the performance never goes off the rails!



It's also 24/192 (but from an analogue source), but I regret the DVD-Audio did not have multi-channel tracks on it, since it was apparently originally recorded in surround.

As for the Toronto Symphony, they already have a recording that's one of the great audio touchstones IMHO - one of the best engineered recordings I've ever heard (can't remember if it's 24/48 or 24/96):

 

RE: "little known Pavel Kogan"..., posted on July 21, 2014 at 21:54:39
Ivan303
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Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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 Former assistant conductor of the Utah Symphony Orchestra(and son of violinist Leonid Kogan).

Former, and NOT current, because the boards of Utah Opera and the Utah Symphony decided to save a buck and merge. Utah Opera Manager Anne Ewers sold them on the grand plan and was given control of BOTH organizations. She took over fundraising as well for BOTH organizations with the idea that she could save even MORE money by firing fund raisers at the Symphony and do both jobs.

Result?

Donors figured all they needed to do is write ONE check to Ms. Ewers for the combined organization, thereby enjoying a 50% reduction in the total donation. As a result, the respective budgets of both the Opera and the Symphony were magically halved!

This meant the assistant conductor had to go. Irrespective of the fact that the Symphony audiences favored him HUGELY over then music director Keith Lockhart.

The last concert that Pavel Kogan conducted in Utah he enjoyed so many standing curtain call as to be almost embarrassing.

What a loss for the Utah Symphony.



First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

Thanks for the tip!, posted on July 21, 2014 at 23:29:12
Russell
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Posts: 2831
Location: San Francisco, California
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 I'll try it out tomorrow. I just downloaded the notes and noticed that the recording was done not by Chandos's usual team, but by Soundmirror, which might explain why it sounds as good as it does. (Not that Chandos-engineered recordings would be inferior--their most recent orchestral recordings sound fabulous.) I also noted that the price of the 24/192 stereo download was £14.40, a bit cheaper than the usual £15.99 (for 24/96). Perhaps it's because of the 45-minute playing time....

Russell

 

RE: "little known Pavel Kogan"..., posted on July 22, 2014 at 00:09:58
Chris from Lafayette
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 I did not know that - interesting - and thanks for the historical background! Somehow, I'm thinking that Anne Ewers MUST have a connection to Isaac Stern!

 

This all went down nearly a decade ago..., posted on July 22, 2014 at 07:14:38
Ivan303
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 when I lived/worked in Utah.

Don't feel sorry for Anne, she left Utah for a job running the Kimmel Center for the Performing Arts in Philadelphia (at about $350K per year) in about 2007, and the 'Stupid White Guys' who run things in Utah were sad to see her go!

Utah now has BOTH a third rate opera company and a third rate symphony. OK, been a while but last I saw them in 2006 they were AWFUL.




First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

+1., posted on July 22, 2014 at 09:26:01
rbolaw
 On my shelves sit two black vinyl discs from the early 60s containing Scheherazade -- Reiner / Chicago Symphony and Ormandy / Philadelphia Orchestra. But for this forum, it would never even occur to me to buy any additional versions. But if I were starting a collection now, Peter Oundjian and Pavel Kogan would be two great ones to begin with.

 

RE: This all went down nearly a decade ago..., posted on July 22, 2014 at 12:08:47
rbolaw
 That's too bad, but combining administrative staff didn't have to mean combining fundraising efforts or one organization cannibalizing another's donors. It did probably mean half as many people were trying to do the same work, and that may have been part of the problem.
Of course, if a manager is tasked with reducing operating costs but maintaining or increasing donations is someone else's problem, ...

 

Anne was the Manager and main fundraiser for the Opera before the merger...., posted on July 22, 2014 at 15:26:55
Ivan303
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Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
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 She convinced the respective boards to combine the two organizations, cut staff including Symphony administration and fundraisers, put here in charge and allow her to raise funds for both organizations.

Didn't work out as planned as folks just wrote one check instead of two, and in most all cases, the numbers on that one check weren't twice as large.





First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

Reiner Sheherezade, posted on July 22, 2014 at 15:54:32
pbarach
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Posts: 3307
Location: Ohio
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 I have the SACD of this performance in the BMG edition--it's a great performance, but the sound is very bright in either the CD or the SACD layer. Is the Analogue Productionds SACD different in some way?

 

RE: Anne was the Manager and main fundraiser for the Opera before the merger...., posted on July 22, 2014 at 18:06:42
rbolaw
 Yes, I get your point. Not the first time a board goes for wholesale reductions in staff without thinking carefully about the consequences. I know nothing about that situation in Utah, but I do know that even if donors had no idea the two organizations were administratively combined, less staff = less work = less results can apply in the arts as in any other business. Sounds like Anne sold them on a bad idea to make herself more powerful and eliminate the competition of second similar organization (as you say, donors may have seen it differently and decided they could give half as much) and then left the mess for something else when she got a better job offer.
But I'd blame the boards for letting all that happen.

 

RE: Reiner Sheherezade, posted on July 22, 2014 at 18:15:14
Chris from Lafayette
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 Yes it is - the Analogue Productions SACD is a completely independent re-mastering from the one that Soundmirror did for BMG. There was a discussion about the two SACD incarnations over at SA-CD.net a month or so ago and the consensus of those who have heard both (including moi) was that the Analogue Productions SACD was worth its "3x the price for half the amount of music" in terms of slight improvements in spatial definition, tone quality, etc. (Sorry I have to report that, but it's true!) Same is true for the Reiner recording of Respighi's Pines and Fountains. I still think the BMG SACD's are excellent, but the couple of Analogue Productions SACD's I've heard (i.e., R-K and Respighi) are even better.

 

Russell - have you listened yet? I just did and I think the SQ is outstanding!, posted on July 22, 2014 at 18:17:33
Chris from Lafayette
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 I'll probably post more on SA-CD.net.

 

RE: "Sounds like Anne sold them on a bad idea to make herself more powerful", posted on July 22, 2014 at 18:28:44
Ivan303
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Posts: 48887
Location: Cadiere d'azur FRANCE - Santa Fe, NM
Joined: February 26, 2001
 Yep, it was her plan from the git-go. The Utah Opera was a third rate organization at best, and she was the General Manager looking to move up to a better, more rewarding position.

The Utah Symphony while admittedly a second tier orchestra, has a GREAT hall (Abravanel Hall) and a music director who, while uninspiring at best, at least was a known guy (Keith Lockhart, Boston Pops, etc.).

Plus just about EVERYONE in Utah is trained to some degree in music, due to the influence of the Mormon Church. OK, they don't necessarily understand the concept of PAYING for it 'cause they get so much of it free. ;-)

"I'd blame the boards for letting all that happen."

Yep, yet again. Why they didn't see that having Anne Ewers knocking on the door to raise money for both institutions on the same call, 'cause she's only gonna get into the carpeted suits once a year, was going to create LESS total donations is beyond me. But the guys in Utah that sit on the boards of the non-profit institutions may have connections but they are not the sharpest in the world.







First they came for the dumb-asses
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a dumb-ass

 

RE: New HiRes Sheherazade from Chandos, posted on July 23, 2014 at 00:06:12
Amphissa
Audiophile

Posts: 2717
Location: Zardoz
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 I appreciate that Reiner was one of the favorites of the era, but his take on Sheherazade has (for me) not stood the test of time. It seems more of a knee-jerk recommendation these days -- a recording that is "expected" to appear on any list because .... well, because it always did in the old days.

The Kogan is an interesting choice, though. This was from the period when Russian orchestras had their own, distinct character. Before global homogenization. That kind of pedal to the metal intensity and balls to the wall brass playing really appeals to me as a sort of "authentic Russian" sound. I liked the original LP of this so much that I got the remastered Classic Records release.

I wouldn't list the Kogan ahead of the Stokowski recording on London Phase 4 Stereo LP, which is a brilliant performance with excellent audio. But I pull the Kogan out at times, which I cannot say about the Reiner.


"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

 

Stokowski, posted on July 23, 2014 at 03:39:47
pbarach
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Posts: 3307
Location: Ohio
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 The Stokowski Phase-4 Sheherezade is my favorite performance of this piece despite the re-orchestration here and there and the multi-miked spotlighting of the musicians. But my original LP is worn out, and the reissues on CD that I've heard (Cala and several Decca versions) reveal overloading distortion at the climaxes, which is ruinous. His 1975 remake with the Royal Phil isn't as inspired, unfortunately, although the sound is decent.

 

RE: Stokowski, posted on July 23, 2014 at 07:34:20
Amphissa
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Posts: 2717
Location: Zardoz
Joined: March 9, 2004
 You are right, the CD releases just do not do justice to the original. I've tried them too, without happiness.

The LP is readily available on Ebay, and if you look through all the posts, you can find a NM copy for reasonably cost. I bought a second copy from an Ebay retailer and am glad I did.


"Life without music is a mistake" (Nietzsche)

 

Yes, it is!, posted on July 23, 2014 at 12:09:42
Russell
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Posts: 2831
Location: San Francisco, California
Joined: February 24, 2001
 Though at times, especially in the loudest passages, I thought the sound got a little cramped, dense, and opaque (but only just a bit), and it lacked that last ounce of transparency and openness. I don't get that impression with the other recent Chandos recordings, like the Jarvi Saint-Saens, Suppe, Chabrier, Swan Lake, etc. It actually doesn't sound at all like a typical Chandos recording, but then it wasn't engineered by them, either. Still very, very impressive, though!

Russell

 

RE: Yes, it is!, posted on July 23, 2014 at 14:02:44
Chris from Lafayette
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Posts: 26480
Location: SF Bay Area
Joined: February 17, 2004
Contributor
  Since: February 6, 2012
 I can see what you mean with your comments about missing last degree of openness during the loud passages (compared with the recent Chandos recordings you list), but I think that's also because there was an audience there (in addition to the use of the Soundmirror recording team). Also, the openness was probably improved for me since I was listening via multi-channel?

EDIT: BTW, the links to the spectorgraphs for this recording are as follows:

First Movement
Second Movement
Third Movement
Fourth Movement

(Noise bands up in the ultra high frequencies. Thanks to Madeline for the use of her web site!)

 

RE: Stokowski, posted on August 9, 2014 at 11:02:45
Rockethead26
Audiophile

Posts: 2065
Location: Arizona
Joined: March 21, 2011
 I just picked up an excellent copy of the Phase 4 London and I agree that the performance, sonics and pressing are all excellent. Just listened to it twice thru.

 

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