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HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can

108.245.106.138
Posted on September 22, 2015 at 19:42:25
TitaniumTroy
Audiophile

Posts: 626
Location: Mishawaka, Indiana
Joined: October 14, 2006
 I briefly head these headphones at the 2015 AXPONA, would have listened more but it was the end of the day. Really regret not going back and listening more.

These planer magnetic headphones, have extra ordinary detail and clarity. I thought the really stood out even against other planer type headphones, like Oppo, Audeze, Kingsound.

Some quotes from Hifi Plus:
"Now let's compare and contrast to the HE1000. In pursuit of Stax-grade sonic transparency (or better), HiFiMAN has given the HE1000 what is said to be the world's first nanometre-thickness diaphragm-a diaphragm so thin that if viewed on edge it would be invisible to the naked eye".

"Next the HE1000 uses a very powerful but also-and this is important-sonically transparent 'double-sided, asymmetrical magnetic circuit'. The stated goal was to achieve 'the optimum balance between high-driver efficiency and high sound quality."

It would be cool if someday HiFiMan takes their technology and were to make a full range loudspeaker. However that speaker would be really expensive, as these heaphones are $3k, yikes!

FYI, I am not really a HeadPhone type of guy, and they really impressed me. So I would recomend any audiophile, music lover, etc,,, to try these out. Steve Guttenberg of Cnet's the Audiophilac said:
"Quite possibly the best sounding heaphones in the world"

 

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RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on September 25, 2015 at 20:18:34
Satie
Audiophile

Posts: 5426
Joined: July 6, 2002
 Their lower end phones sound good too.

I assume the nm diaphragms are made of unobtanium. I don't know what you can use to produce something like that with normal blowing techniques. Likely not a thermoplastic. I don't think they have sufficient tensile strength at that thickness. 0.5 micron mylar is 10^4 thicker than that. and that is as thin a mylar as anyone uses on planars.

 

RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on September 26, 2015 at 09:56:14
mbnx01
Audiophile

Posts: 7956
Location: Eagle, Idaho
Joined: October 22, 2004
 I'd enjoy hearing them but no way I'll pay three grand for a chinese product. My experience with Hifiman products is that they are not made that well. I've read other people having similar problems.




'A lie is halfway around the world before the truth gets its boots on'. -Mark Twain

 

RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on September 26, 2015 at 20:54:08
pictureguy
Audiophile

Posts: 22597
Location: SoCal
Joined: October 19, 2008
 .5 micron is 5000 angstroms, so it is pretty thin. But not THAT thin and in the range of regular films used in semiconductors.
I've worked with and measured films as thin as 200 angstroms, and some thinner. Measuring films that thin sometimes gets a little difficult. I worked on a technique using a variable wavelength lightsource and a way to measure its intensity. This was measuring an anti-hallation layer of less than 100 angstroms.

If it were available NOW and in the proper sizes, it would be easy to say GRAPHENE was the material of choice.


To make a diaphragm that thin? I might experiment with sputtering titanium or beryllium on to a form which would than be etched or washed away or simply 'release' the part needed. It may be possible to eventually, if not NOW, sputter grapheme and than 'dope' the conductors INTO the material. you should be able to make (eventually) Magnepan-sized panels by the MILE.
Too much is never enough

 

RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on September 27, 2015 at 09:49:20
Satie
Audiophile

Posts: 5426
Joined: July 6, 2002
 I think titanium and beryllium are too stiff to be a membrane. The vapor deposited Be and Ti are used for dome tweeters and cantilever tubes for cartridges.In both cases you use a suspension of flexible polymer.

I was thinking of carbon nanotubes in a vapor depoosited graphene membrane. But we don't really know what they use. In this case the material would be conductive on its own so would be most conducive to ribbon type drivers.

 

RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on September 27, 2015 at 11:35:54
pictureguy
Audiophile

Posts: 22597
Location: SoCal
Joined: October 19, 2008
 The way to Do it using Graphene would be to 'dope' the graphene in a manner similar to that used in semiconductors in a spiral or up/down pattern like Maggie lays its wires. The grapheme may be counterdoped to be NON-conductive so you end up with a wire matrix. Various parameters could be manipulated IN PROCESS to give the desired resistivity.

I don't know how much temp. that graphene can take OR how much an ion implant for doping to the required level would disturb the lattice. It may be possible to fabricate the film with doping IN PLACE but I'd have to see how that's gonna' work.

Using something like Ti or Be would require multiple layers. Something the Be / Ti acting as a diaphragm with a non-conductive layer THAN the ribbon style conductor BONDED to the whole thing. The insulator with the Be/or Ti would have the requistie stiffness and yes, some kind of edge suspension would be needed. This would be more 'pistonic' in practice.

Think unique shapes. that's where MY mind is wandering.

Ultra strong magnets might be needed for this application or indeed be Mandatory.

Gold, for example, can be hammered thin enough to pass LIGHT which is GREEN. So you're talking the Angstrom level. I have NO idea of the mechanical properties of Be or Ti at the thickness required to make something like that work. Or for that matter if you'd end up with break up modes rendering the whole thing moot. Or Mute, as you prefer!

Ultra-Thin diaphragms might be VERY mechanically Vulnerable, too. drop it? Big wind/pressure change? Gotta think of durability, too, even if such an ear-speaker were possible.
Too much is never enough

 

RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on September 27, 2015 at 16:12:52
Satie
Audiophile

Posts: 5426
Joined: July 6, 2002
 On a much simpler note, you can use thin film Kapton and vapor deposit Al on it and you can scale to its tensile strength and get down to the tens of angstroms as it is used in hard drives and flexible printed circuits. Though I don't see how you get it to the sub angstrom level. Perhaps it is printable on a 3d printer - but 1 nm?

I would doubt you want Be or Ti thin films as they would be brittle. Their breakup characteristics are rather good though hence their audio applications as mentined.

 

RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on September 28, 2015 at 19:22:40
pictureguy
Audiophile

Posts: 22597
Location: SoCal
Joined: October 19, 2008
 Mechanical properties of materials may change at the Ultra-Thin we are talking about. I simply don't know.
Worst case? A 10mm driver of the Piston type. 500 angstroms of Be 10mm in diameter?

As for Al coated Kapton? Run it thru a PHOTO STEP and make a wire serpentine on it Ala maggie.

You'll need better eyes than MINE to do inspection.
Too much is never enough

 

$3k, posted on October 1, 2015 at 12:36:08
sbrians
Audiophile

Posts: 1455
Joined: March 4, 2002
 I did not like the sound of their portable players. But the headphones could sound good - I have not heard those.
I just wonder why someone would spend $5k+ on a headphone system when one could have a pretty nice loudspeaker system for that. I'm sure 'phones would sound better in many ways, but mostly you would be paying for the privilege to listen alone in silence. I suppose this could be desirable in an apartment, etc.

 

This could be the Future of floor-standing speakers...!, posted on October 1, 2015 at 17:27:29
audiophile919
 Who knows...years from now, they might make a floor-standing speaker out of this stuff!!..

 

RE: HE 1000 Planer Headphone's take a listen if you can, posted on October 2, 2015 at 05:27:24
Green Lantern
Audiophile

Posts: 16952
Location: San Diego, Ca
Joined: November 12, 2002
Contributor
  Since: June 17, 2003
 Way back in '83 when I was stationed in Japan I bought a pair of audio technica electrostatic ATH1 headphones just like the one pictured above. I paid about $400 which for me was a LOT of money back then (inflation calc: around $990); and why not, Stereo Review 'loved them' so they couldn't have been bad right? ;) .

Those bad boys had absolutely no bass whatsoever. If you like symphony music, violins, etc., they were great, but jazz, rock, R&B, not so good.

I'm not saying the planar headphones are the same, similar, or whatever, in fact I'm sure they're most likely great sounding, but my electrostatic headphones were a big disappointment.

I packed them away and forgot about them for decades. When I came upon them later they had delam'ed beyond repair.

Over the years I've always used low level Sennheisers which sounded very good. A few years ago I was able find a nice pair of HD 650s along with a Creek headphone amp. They were outstanding and had everything I wanted in a headphone. I paid $400. Kept them for about 4 years and later resold them for $400. Such is life.










 

RE: This could be the Future of floor-standing speakers...!, posted on October 2, 2015 at 08:45:46
sbrians
Audiophile

Posts: 1455
Joined: March 4, 2002
 They are much more energy efficient than loudspeakers. But with renewable energy, that would be somewhat moot.

 

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