Old School!!

Joe Henderson...., posted on March 28, 2021 at 01:09:13
andy evans Audiophile Posts: 4378 Joined: October 20, 2000	It may sound like a funny thing to say about a great sax player, but I could never get past Joe Henderson's tone. He has quite a hard sound - even like an oboe in the higher registers. For some reason me ears can't take it. So I never listen to him. Am I being strange here, or does anyone else react to his tone?

RE: Joe Henderson...., posted on March 28, 2021 at 07:19:08
GEO Audiophile Posts: 4749 Joined: April 7, 2000 Contributor Since: September 9, 2000	That may be why I liked him initially. He had a different tone!

When I finally saw Joe live...., posted on March 28, 2021 at 07:44:28

D Harvey
Manufacturer

Posts: 5563
Location: SE Michigan
Joined: May 30, 2001

....I was amazed to hear how soft and gentle his sound actually was. His sound is quite variable and yes, mostly "hard" on the 60's BN sides, but I suspect this is the product of BN's house sonics more than anything else. His real sound, at least by the time I heard him, was more like what you hear on his Lush Life album--almost a whisper of a sound. The State of the Tenor records capture this sound pretty well too, as do some of the 70's era sides I've heard. In the video here I hear all of the above. The sound is more on the hard side when he's overblowing the horn, but there's a lot of the softer sound in evidence too.

I'm curious what our resident saxmen might have to say....did Joe consciously change his approach at some point or was he sonically misrepresented more than other tenor players typically were on record? The small sound I heard in concert would seem to foster that kind of thing, and the super close-up, almost unreal recorded sound on Lush Life seems to me a hint as to why that may be.

Whatever the case, I've never ever been prone to avoiding listening to Joe Henderson. :-)

dh

UMMG

RE: When I finally saw Joe live...., posted on March 28, 2021 at 08:12:23

oldmkvi
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Joe was a Microphone Player.
Had his own Vintage Mic at the Big Band Gigs I played in SF.
Most of us overblew the Mics with our bigger sounds when soloing, but Joe sounded Fantastic.
His sound was tailored for the Actual Scene in Clubs!
He played a Selmer Hard Rubber Mpc, and on his older recordings got a rather gritty and edgy sound due to the nature of the Mpc, that's how they play.
He did sound mellower later, probably change Mpcs along the way, ( to a different Selmer Mpc ) and changed his style as he got older.
But when I heard him, he sounded absolutely great, ideas coming from right out of the air!!!
His sound was perfectly tailored for his Mic, and he knew how to Work It!

RE: When I finally saw Joe live...., posted on March 28, 2021 at 08:33:26
Tom Audiophile Posts: 2081 Location: Arizona Joined: February 27, 2000 Contributor Since: March 16, 2002	Joe was known to play a Selmer Soloist D hard rubber mouthpiece, which has a small chamber (as you know). The mouthpiece in the video does not "appear" to be a Selmer Soloist. But probably a shall chamber piece anyway.

RE: When I finally saw Joe live...., posted on March 28, 2021 at 08:59:36
andy evans Audiophile Posts: 4378 Joined: October 20, 2000	I believe I did actually see him live once, which would have been late in his career. His tone was indeed softer and he played beautifully for course. Those early BN and other recordings, like with Horace Silver, seemed to project a much harder tone.

RE: When I finally saw Joe live...., posted on March 28, 2021 at 09:46:29

GEO
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Joined: April 7, 2000
Contributor
Since: September 9, 2000

That was his last great album! Loved it. So Near, So Far was excellent too.

Miles Ahead

Wow, I never found his sound "hard"., posted on March 28, 2021 at 12:03:29

Rick W

Think the first time I heard Henderson live was in the '60's at a Left Bank Jazz Society concert in Baltimore. It was Joe's gig and he had Woody Shaw in the group. Killer concert! IIRC I also heard him in the '60's w/Horace Silver at Bohemian Caverns in D.C. Both those times what I heard was his sound via mic/PA system. Judging from those live performances and records I thought Joe had a big powerful sound. Didn't sound "hard" to my ears.

I never got a chance to hear him close up sans mic until the '80's. I sat around 5 ft. away from him at the old 7th Ave. South club in Manhattan. A few times he veered away from the mic and I heard his acoustic sound. As oldmkvi mentioned, it was actually a pretty small/soft and rounded sound.

Its true that his sound on a lot of his earlier recordings is different than recordings from State Of The Tenor on, but there's no way to tell why. Different mic, recording techniques/eq, different m'piece and/or reeds, different horn could all account for it - as well as just Joe deciding to go for a mellower sound.

Henderson certainly isn't the only saxophone player whose sound changed. Rollins, 'Trane, Mike Brecker, Bob Berg, Wayne Shorter are among quite a few guys whose sound changed somewhat subtly but noticeably when they changed m'pieces. My own sound on both alto and tenor changed due to m'piece changes. At any rate, I've always been knocked out by Henderson's playing and always found his sound(s) attractive and emotive rather than hard.

So Joe had Emphysema, bummer., posted on March 28, 2021 at 17:15:51
oldmkvi Audiophile Posts: 10581 Joined: April 12, 2002	/Users/jim/Desktop/Screen Shot 2021-03-28 at 5.13.10 pm.pn

+1, Well Said! nt, posted on March 30, 2021 at 06:33:48
oldmkvi Audiophile Posts: 10581 Joined: April 12, 2002	/

Joe's horn was stolen at some point. He had just recovered it before, posted on March 30, 2021 at 06:41:11

oldmkvi
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Posts: 10581
Joined: April 12, 2002

The Big Band Gigs I played with his Band.
I saw him on a 1985 Video with Herbie and Freddie Hubbard.
Joe seemed to be playing a shiny new Mark VII (!!), and wasn't getting his best sound.
At one point, he didn't even seem to be playing on the Head, kind of ghosting it!
I know he was happy to get his horn back,
don't know about whether his Mpc was stolen too.
Charlie Mariano's Mark VI and Meyer Mpc he recorded on in the early 60's also was stolen.
It's tough getting a new set-up to replace a much older, comfortable, tried and true Horn
and Mpc!

RE: When I finally saw Joe live...., posted on March 30, 2021 at 13:02:00
musetap Audiophile Posts: 31871 Location: San Francisco Joined: July 8, 2003 Contributor Since: January 28, 2004	Saw him at Milestones in a scarce Hometown Gig many moons ago. He had more "bite" to his sound than I thought he might, but it weren't hardly hard. Good set. Knew someone that lived near him in Forrest Hills that siad he was a great guy and neighbor. "Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination"-Michael McClure

Milestones!! Sonny Buxton who later was at Pearls,, posted on March 30, 2021 at 13:51:48
oldmkvi Audiophile Posts: 10581 Joined: April 12, 2002	and is still on KCSM Saturdays was the Manager. I have a photo of me playing a Jam Session there, just as many moons ago...

+2 nt, posted on April 8, 2021 at 15:43:44
vinyl survivor Audiophile Posts: 1471 Location: Southeastern US Joined: November 28, 2007	!

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