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REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers

82.67.63.238

Posted on March 30, 2014 at 00:09:45
Posts: 25
Joined: June 21, 2010
Model: Trio
Category: Speakers
Suggested Retail Price: $$$$
Description: 3 way spherical horn with active subwoofer
Manufacturer URL: Avantgarde
Model Picture: View

Review by Aurelien_from_France on March 30, 2014 at 00:09:45
IP Address: 82.67.63.238
Add Your Review
for the Trio


I make the review brief as English is not my mother language.

I have had quite a lot of high-end speakers. I enjoyed most of them. But, here, the situation is drastically different. It is not really a speaker : from the viewpoint of sound, it is just like the real event, from the viewpoint of design, it is more a work of art !
Everything is just perfect. It just sounds like live music.
You can drive them to incredibly loud levels with a 10 WpC amplifier (the efficiency is close to 110 dB !!) and enjoy a so delicate sound a low levels …
I cannot find any drawback. I cannot find anything they don’t to just right. Either classical or rock, everything sounds just real.

Of course, it is expensive. Obviously. But there is a kind of trend that speakers contenders to be « best of the World » have to reach incredible prices. Maybe 200 000 $, or 300 000 $ or event 500 000 $ ! This one is expensive but not crazily expensive. And to my ears they are indeed the best. I like the sound as an audiophile but I also appreciate the design and engineering as an astrophysicist.

People at Avantgarde are extremely nice. This is a small, "human" company. They make superb speakers. I plan to keep this one a lifetime. It just fulfills all my hopes, and beyond.


Product Weakness: Will make you find all other speaker a bit ... ridiculous :-)
Product Strengths: Perfect sound. Huge sensitivity. Magnificent design.


Associated Equipment for this Review:

Amplifier: Audio Analog
Preamplifier (or None if Integrated): MBL
Sources (CDP/Turntable): MNBL
Speakers: Trios
Cables/Interconnects: Adioquest
Music Used (Genre/Selections): all
Type of Audition/Review: Product Owner


 

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    ...
images, posted on March 30, 2014 at 00:19:58
Posts: 25
Joined: June 21, 2010
A few images @ homes :









 

Tiger Between Horn Speakers..........., posted on March 30, 2014 at 01:15:05
Todd Krieger
Audiophile

Posts: 37308
Location: SW United States
Joined: November 2, 2000
Seems pretty common, actually...........



 

RE: images, posted on March 30, 2014 at 03:36:01
Hiendmuse
Audiophile

Posts: 171
Joined: August 9, 2009
Beautiful speakers Aurelien, congratulations on a fine purchase! I love great horn speakers. Question- are those rectangular speaker boxes in the corners additional bass speakers? I have not seen those before in the Avantgarde product line.

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 30, 2014 at 12:22:17
moray james
Manufacturer

Posts: 1599
Location: Calgary on the Bow
Joined: May 19, 2002
I am very happy for you that you love your new loudspeakers. You are however misleading people unintentionally I expect when you claim these loudspeakers are 110 db efficient. The loudspeaker system efficiency will always be set by the lowest efficiency speaker in the system and in your case that will be the woofers. There is no possible way that your woofers are even achieving anywhere near 100 db much less 110 db across their band. Below 100 Hz a reasonable efficiency guess would be perhaps a true 95 - 96db for those boxes. While your horn with their compression drivers may well be capable of 110 db levels the actual system efficiency is not even close to those figures. People will get the wrong impression when such exaggerated figures are given as fact. Best regards Moray James.
moray james

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 30, 2014 at 12:46:50
samoore
Audiophile

Posts: 296
Joined: December 22, 1999
The woofers are active, so their efficiency is irrelevant. The entire system as it sits is above 110dB with the active subs/woofers.

Steve
Remember, it's all about the music.

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 30, 2014 at 13:58:22
Don Reid
Audiophile

Posts: 886
Location: Rural NW Georgia
Joined: February 2, 2001
Contributor
  Since:
April 1, 2010
Moray James wrote: "The loudspeaker system efficiency will always be set by the lowest efficiency speaker in the system and in your case that will be the woofers. There is no possible way that your woofers are even achieving anywhere near 100 db much less 110 db across their band. Below 100 Hz a reasonable efficiency guess would be perhaps a true 95 - 96db for those boxes."

This rule is, of course, true, except for when it is not true.

If you biamplify, triamplify, etc., with a line level crossover then the situation becomes more complex as well as more versatile and interesting.
I dream of an America where a chicken can cross the road without having it's motives questioned.

 

ENJOY!...and congrats :) - nt, posted on March 30, 2014 at 18:55:07
gonefishin
Audiophile

Posts: 1067
Location: Joliet,Ill.
Joined: August 27, 2000
nt
enjoy the music!

 

Moray is Right, posted on March 30, 2014 at 20:07:57
Tom Brennan
Audiophile

Posts: 5853
Joined: January 2, 2000
A system is only as sensitive as the least sensitive section, regardless whether that section is self powered. In effect, if the system is flat, the more sensitive parts of the system are padded down to the least sensitive part. It doesn't matter how this level matching is done, by active crossover, L-pads or whatever; the effect is the same.

Lookie here, I used to run Altec A5s, of about 105db sensitivity, with JBL Pro subs of about 100db sensitivity. An active crossover was used at 100hz. Now I ran the JBLs wide open but had to turn the Altecs down to match them. The result was a SYSTEM sensitivity of about 100db.

Now I could've run the A5s wide open and had 105db sensitivity above 100hz but that would've sounded like Hell, right?

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 30, 2014 at 21:30:20
moray james
Manufacturer

Posts: 1599
Location: Calgary on the Bow
Joined: May 19, 2002
you can biamp all you like but you cannot ever hope to come remotely close to the efficiency stated (110 db)you won't have the available power and you wont have the power handling even if you did have the power at hand. You just can't pull an elephant out of a shoe box. That said I am sure these are fine sounding loudspeakers. Best regards
moray james

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 31, 2014 at 04:25:12
vinnie2
Audiophile

Posts: 4481
Location: North Carolina
Joined: September 28, 2013
Yeah right. At $62,000 a set for a base price, maybe one person in five thousand reading this site could even think about getting a pair of those. That sounds like insanely expensive to me.

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 31, 2014 at 04:56:40
Joseph Crowe
Audiophile

Posts: 53
Location: Ontario
Joined: February 19, 2014
Watch out! the efficiency police are out!

Curious, what do you use as a source? You say 'MNBL' but I'm not sure what this is.

Cheers.



 

RE: Moray is Right, posted on March 31, 2014 at 07:55:09
tomservo
Manufacturer

Posts: 8149
Joined: July 4, 2002
He is right, not only that but even just the hf section is limited to the sensitivity a the lowest point (assuming you wish flat response).

For a compression driver, that means that the 15K to 20K area is the limiting thing AND if one has a CD horn (those are not) the maximum sensitivity up high is only 100-105dB.

How have you been, are you missing the iron from the old days?

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 31, 2014 at 15:20:10
acres verde
Audiophile

Posts: 722
Location: Big Easy
Joined: November 13, 2004
I think it would be fair to point out that Aurelian is misleading no one...he's just passing along the sensitivity specs as per the manufacturer's published data. And I do believe that sensitivity should be the operative word here...not efficiency.

 

RE: Moray is Right, posted on March 31, 2014 at 16:32:44
samoore
Audiophile

Posts: 296
Joined: December 22, 1999
If the speaker is passive, then yes, Moray is right. You would have to pad the horns down to match the output of the woofers. However, in this case the woofer is active and has increased gain to match the horns. Therefor you get the same dBs per watt from the woofers as the horns. Thus, equal sensitivity.
Remember, it's all about the music.

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on March 31, 2014 at 18:03:44
EduardG
Audiophile

Posts: 284
Location: So. Cal
Joined: May 30, 2002
I've heard the Avantgardes. While rather musical, I thought they rang like crazy. For that kind of money the manufacturer surely could've built a thicker or otherwise reinforced horns.

 

Right and Wrong, posted on April 1, 2014 at 16:40:55
djk
Manufacturer

Posts: 6135
Joined: June 17, 2000
Right and wrong at the same time.

All the Avantgarde models come with amplifier for the woofers, so their efficiency (or lack thereof) is moot.

The Community M200 used in the midrange of the Trio is about 108.5dB/W on a horn with a Di=7. The horn they are on looks like a tractrix, and could very well have a Di=10, and thus it would be 111.5dB. It very well may be that high as they have a special voice-coil made for their M200 so as to not have to use a resistive pad in the network.

Same comments apply to the Beyma CP380M they use for the tweeter.

The link is a similar HF driver from Faital Pro on a tractrix horn, it looks like you could claim it to be 110dB (which they do).

http://www.communitypro.com/files/literature/spec%20sheets/M200A_SPEC.pdf?phpMyAdmin=c9cc5b3953d87385dc22218d669e7aab

http://www.usspeaker.com/beyma%20CP380M-1.htm

Note, the Beyma is on a CD horn, so it would have more HF on the type of horn in the Trio.

 

RE: Right and Wrong, posted on April 2, 2014 at 01:16:08
quirck
Audiophile

Posts: 213
Joined: December 23, 2006
The Avantgarde mid driver does not look like the Community M200s I have here.

 

Agreed. -t, posted on April 2, 2014 at 03:57:49
jusbe
Audiophile

Posts: 5950
Location: North Island
Joined: April 4, 2000

Big J

"... only a very few individuals understand as yet that personal salvation is a contradiction in terms."


 

umm...no, posted on April 2, 2014 at 12:20:59
triode
Audiophile

Posts: 439
Location: south Florida
Joined: January 18, 2001
My Duo Omegas are made from the same materials, and they do not "ring" in any way.

"Your liver suffers dearly now for youthful magic moments...so rock on completely with some brand new components"

 

RE: Right and Wrong, posted on April 2, 2014 at 14:12:14
djk
Manufacturer

Posts: 6135
Joined: June 17, 2000
There is a cover on the back, and the voice-coil top-chamber is a bit different.

The M200A is no longer available (as I think that was what Avantgarde uses)

The M200 requires a low-pass filter to remove the peak that the M200A top-chamber removed.

I have a photo montage from a magazine review on my hard-drive at home that shows the three drivers from the Trio, it's easy to see the M200A details.

 

RE: Tiger Between Horn Speakers..........., posted on April 3, 2014 at 22:06:10
Steve Schell
Manufacturer

Posts: 1440
Location: So. California
Joined: December 16, 2001
Hey Todd, long time no see. Long time no see for the living room owner as well... please say hello for me. That was a fun road trip / listening weekend, so long ago.

 

RE: REVIEW: Avantgarde Trio Speakers, posted on April 4, 2014 at 06:33:12
JoshK
Audiophile

Posts: 820
Location: NJ/NYC
Joined: August 3, 2001
I agree their numbers are an exaggeration, but isn't the point for most of the aficionados here to use flea or other low watt amps, in which case the bandwidth over which this system (>100hz) provides a fairly high sensitivity.

I don't know anyone in a small home room that really needs 105+db/w sensitivity for the first two octaves. I would think a stout SS amp with typical highish gain for the low section mated with a aforementioned small watt amp with lower gain would work well in a domestic environment. Would it not?

I guess, what I am saying, is that while 110db is obviously a marketing creative license, for practical purposes it is conveys the appropriate practical usage.
----------------
"When Khruschev said "we will bury you" I don't think he meant with surplus parts." zacster

 

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